07-28-2008 - Regular
CITY COUNCIL OF EDGEWATER
REGULAR MEETING
JULY 28, 2008
7:00 P.M.
COMMUNITY CENTER
MINUTES
1. CALL TO ORDER
Mayor Thomas called the Regular Meeting to order at 7:00
p.m. in the Community Center.
ROLL CALL
Mayor Michael Thomas
Councilwoman Debra Rogers
Councilwoman Gigi Bennington
Councilwoman Harriet Rhodes
Councilman Ted Cooper
Acting City Manager Tracey Barlow
City Clerk Bonnie Wenzel
City Attorney Carolyn Ansay
Present
Excused
Excused
Present
Present
Present
Present
Present
INVOCATION, PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE
There was a silent invocation and pledge of allegiance to
the Flag.
Mayor Thomas asked everyone to remember Councilwoman
Bennington's mother. She got a last minute call and had to
go to the hospital in Titusville and she isn't doing well.
2. APPROVAL OF MINUTES
A. Regular Meeting of April 7, 2008
Councilwoman Rhodes moved to approve the April 7, 2008
minutes, second by Councilman Cooper.
The MOTION CARRIED 3 - 0 .
B. Regular Meeting of April 21, 2008
Councilman Cooper moved to approve the April 21, 2008
minutes, second by Councilwoman Rhodes.
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The MOTION CARRIED 3 - 0 .
3. PRESENTATIONS/PROCLAMATIONS/PLAQUES/CERTIFICATES/nON
ATIONS
A. Finance Director John McKinney presenting the
Comprehensive Annual Financial Report (CAFR) for
fiscal year ending September 30, 2007
Finance Director John McKinney commented on this being the
first time that the City of Edgewater has ever prepared in
house the CAFR this year, with a lot of effort from Kelly
Leary. He recognized Malecia Williams and Michelle Grenham
from the Finance Department that helped to get this
accomplished.
Finance Director McKinney introduced Kelly Leary, of
McDirmit, Davis & Company, LLC who made a presentation
regarding the CAFR for FYE 2007 by going over the
highlights. This is the 23rd year that the City of
Edgewater has received the Certificate of Achievement.
This year the audit is unqualified which is the best report
they can get. She went over the Management's Discussion
and Analysis. The City's debt decreased by almost $4
million. She then went over the summary of the changes in
revenue and expenses for the governmental activities and
business type activities. She then referred to the
Statement of Revenues, Expenditures, and Changes in Fund
Balance for the General Fund.
Ms. Leary went over the Report of Internal Control and
Compliance and the Management Letter.
Finance Director McKinney informed the Council and the
public he was available if anyone had any questions.
Dominic Capri a , 606 Topside Circle, stated they talked
about users fees, which he talked about meetings before,
it's the Enterprise Fund he is assuming. It seems to him
that the new Finance Director had talked about this before.
He remembered him saying that they were in the red on the
users fees quite a while ago. They are now saying again
they will probably have to transfer funds out of the users
funds into the General Fund, which they did a few years ago
by $1 million. Councilwoman Rhodes informed him no and
told him that Ms. Leary said they did not do that. Finance
Director McKinney stated it has been two years since they
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have transferred anything from the Enterprise Fund to the
General Fund. Councilwoman Rhodes informed Mr. Capria not
in this financial year, not in 2007. They decided at the
workshop they were going to transfer funds from the
Enterprise Funds to make up for the departments in the
General Fund that actually do work in the Enterprise Fund.
The taxpayers won't be paying to subsidize the Enterprise
Funds. If you don't transfer that money, then what John
does as far as the budgets and things for the Enterprise
Funds, the taxpayer pays for. That will not be transferred
from the Enterprise Fund to the General Fund. Mr. Capria
stated by doing so they will not get an increase.
Councilwoman Rhodes informed him she didn't know. Mr.
Capria stated they are going to get an increase. It's
double taxation. If you have to raise the millage rate,
raise it but don't take it out of the Enterprise Fund.
Councilwoman Rhodes stated that is what they are trying to
do. Mr. Capria stated that remains to be seen.
Councilwoman Rhodes stated but there is one Enterprise Fund
that is falling seriously behind and the auditors have been
on them for years now. They have to do something about it.
Mr. Capria asked which one it was. Councilwoman Rhodes
informed him Stormwater.
Carol Ann Stoughton, 2740 Evergreen Drive, asked what the
City's current debt was. Last year it was over $5 million.
Acting City Manager Barlow stated he didn't have the exact
number off hand but he did provide that to her a couple of
meetings ago. Ms. Stoughton would like the public and the
newspapers to know what the City's debt is. Ms. Stoughton
stated they have accountants and all kinds of people and
funding, they should know what the debt is.
Mayor Thomas asked Ms. Stoughton if she wanted someone to
answer on her time. Ms. Stoughton informed him she did.
Ms. Stoughton stated she keeps asking year after year and
everything is not rosey. They need to know the debt.
Finance Director McKinney stated as of 9/30/07 the General
Fund had long-term liabilities of $8,675,423. Of that
$1,705,680 is due within one year, meaning by 9/30/08. The
business type activities Enterprise Funds at 9/30/07, the
total debt was $32,011,352 of which $3,253,913 is due
9/30/08.
Ben Fanselow, 321 Schooner Avenue, stated he isn't
interested in numbers but there seems to be a flaw in the
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idea of growth. He goes to a lot of yard sales. He
commented on people having garage sales to pay their
mortgage. He has been to a lot of developments where the
lot is there and there isn't even a building of any kind on
those developments. We have just gone ahead and done
4,500. He knows what demographics are all about. There
are no jobs to be had. He spoke of people who have worked
for the boat places for 17 years that are out of work.
There are many people who are out of work. When you look
at large developments and say it is growth, if you really
sit down and figure it out you don't get enough taxes to
pay for four teachers at a school from that many
developments. They are asking for changes in Comprehensive
Plans and he hopes they are dealing with all the
naturalists that know about it. The developers aren't
doing their demographics who have a lot of empty lots, just
like a lot of empty lots allover the place. He commented
on how many homes are up for sale in Edgewater. When
people move out, do you really consider it growth? If they
were a Financial Director they should go out in the town
and talk to people and they would understand that
truthfully we are receding, we are not growing.
Ms. Leary stated one of the Auditor General ratios they
look at is the long-term governmental debt of the City to
the population. The City's ratio of long-term debt to the
population is very much in line with other cities. That is
one of the favorable ratios.
4. CITIZEN COMMENTS
The following citizens spoke:
Mike Visconti, 316 Pine Breeze Drive, stated Edgewater did
itself proud in celebrating Independence Day with the big
bang in high style. He asked for a big hand for the Chief
and the team that put this together. He commented on the
events that were held at Menard Park. He then commented on
the fireworks display and comments people made. He
congratulated the City and suggested maybe next year they
could have a patriotic parade.
Mr. Visconti stated a lot of people were talking about
conserving water and nobody was doing anything about it.
He showed the Council the rain barrel. He installed three
today, which means 150 gallons of water will be saved. The
barrels cost $150 in the box and installed $175. It's a
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great product and they should all conserve water and catch
the Florida rainwater. He didn't know if Edgewater could
be one of the first to give the people who buy this an
incentive, a tax break or something, to conserve this
water. The more water we conserve the better it is for
Florida and they do need to conserve the rainwater. If
anybody is interested he would be glad to sit down and go
over these with them.
Councilwoman Rhodes asked Mr. Visconti if he was selling
these rain barrels. Mr. Visconti informed her he was.
Councilwoman Rhodes stated if the City were to buy a
quantity would he give them a better price. Mr. Visconti
informed her he would. Councilwoman Rhodes stated she
would love to have one but she doesn't have $150. Maybe
the City could look into buying several and then reselling
them to people at a reduced rate.
Acting City Manager Barlow stated they have looked into
that and are still currently looking into it. For those
interested there is a Green Fair that is going to be in New
Smyrna Beach on September 6th and 7th. They are going to
talk about this and maybe they can share plans on how to
build some rain barrels as well and some other
opportunities.
Mayor Thomas suggested he come to the WAV meeting with the
rain barrel so they could see it. He feels that would be
very beneficial for him to bring that to the next meeting.
Mr. Visconti would be glad to do that. Mr. Visconti
commented on being able to put Miracle Grow in it and
already having the fertilizer in the water when you water
your plants.
Pat Card, 3019 Willow Oak Drive, commended the City
Council, the City Manager and the Finance Director. He
attended a portion of the workshop earlier and he thinks
they have gone one step closer to getting to a zero
balanced budget. The right thing to do is for the Manager
to go to the people to find out what they need to cover the
cost of providing a service that they need to get done.
That is what has been done with the study that was
presented to the Council earlier by the Finance Director.
Jim Boles, 1415 Umbrella Tree Drive, commented on his water
bill last month for a house that has been vacant for two
years. He has had zero gallons of water consumption.
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Finance Director McKinney suggested he come to the Council
meeting tonight to ask the Council to abate a 97,960 gallon
water bill when the meter has been off. There is obviously
a meter malfunction or maybe someone vandalized it and
swapped meters with somebody else's meter. There is no way
97,000 gallons of water could leak out of a house without
having a heck of an erosion problem. He cannot afford a
$1,200 water bill on his very limited fixed budget. If
they can't correct it he is going to have to make some
arrangements.
Councilwoman Rhodes asked if that was one month's bill.
Mr. Boles informed her it was for 27 days. Councilwoman
Rhodes asked what the ending date was of his water bill.
Mr. Boles informed her the bill was mailed out 7/14, which
will be past due after 8/3. The price goes up after 8/3 if
there is a late fee on there.
Councilwoman Rhodes asked if there has been any consumption
from 7/14 until now. Finance Director McKinney informed
her at last count it was just over 500 gallons. They sent
the Field Ops guys out there to look at it and they were
told it has been off for three or four years. There has
been on consumption since 2005. It was stated to them that
the meter was off. When the Field Ops guy went out there
the meter was on and there were cars in the driveway. They
can't assume there hasn't been some consumption the past
month. Mr. Boles stated there was some consumption on the
21st. Finance Director McKinney stated at this residence
the homeowner stated that his well water and City water are
also interconnected. Mr. Boles commented on the meter
being off at the street. Finance Director McKinney
informed him it was not off. Mr. Boles stated they came
out on the 21st and there was a repairman out there and he
had turned the water on because he is unable to get
underneath the trailer to check pipes. He verified with
him that he turned the water on and turned it off when he
left. Finance Director McKinney stated they checked all of
their records and it was 123 Ash Street that they went out
and checked. Mr. Boles informed him that would be the
meter next door to him. He is at 118. He wasn't sure of
the number next door. The neighbor across the street from
him said somebody was in the yard with a water company
truck.
Mayor Tomas would like this to be investigated by our
technicians. Evidently there is some malfunction
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somewhere. Right now they are going on words. Evidently
there is something that happened. He asked if that could
be done immediately. Ms. Dewees informed him it has been
on-going. They have been researching it. She mentioned
finding the cross connection between his well and his
meter. They sent out the Field Operations Superintendent
himself to investigate it.
Mayor Thomas asked about having another meeting next
Monday. Acting City Manager Barlow informed him the next
meeting would be August 18th. He suggested they place this
item on the agenda. This is not on the agenda today to
take action. They can complete their investigation before
the meeting.
Councilman Cooper asked that no penalties be applied while
they are waiting for the results of the investigation and
they get a determination. Finance Director McKinney stated
that was the purpose of Mr. Boles coming this evening.
Carol Ann Stoughton, 2740 Evergreen Drive, stated she
noticed the waterman going up and down the streets. The
City spent millions of dollars to put in meters and all of
a sudden now the meters don't seem to be working or else
the City needs revenue for water to pay Paul and Peter.
Her meter all of a sudden can't be read. She hears this is
going on allover town that different people are being
billed for big bucks. She hopes the town isn't trying to
bleed our poor residents who are being bled enough with
taxes and mortgages. She is waiting to see what her water
bill is. She is only one person. She thinks it is sin.
They paid all this money for meters. It's a sin that they
have to come forward and beg Council to help them with this
situation. She heard from the garbage men that they are
being harassed with people taking videos of them on Mango
Tree. She thinks the men ought to call the police. There
are people taking videos of these guys who work so hard.
She feels this is harassment.
Ms. Stoughton stated she goes every Sunday to feed the poor
and she was going at ten til eight up 1-95 and an officer
from Edgewater was behind her practically pushing her up
the road Sunday night and he blew past her about 80 mph.
She asked what kind of emergency there was Sunday night.
She said she doesn't want a ticket in the future for asking
a question. It's nice to know that the head Finance lady
thinks our town is in good shape but she feels the people
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ought to know how much we are in debt. Compared to other
towns, no we don't compare to other towns. We should be
concerned about our debt and not anybody else's town.
Dot Carlson, 1714 Edgewater Drive/624 Art Center Avenue,
New Smyrna Beach, thanked Mr. Visconti for bringing the
water barrels to the Council's attention. She brought the
council a folder two or three meetings back but she didn't
think anything happened on it. Those were offered at $40
at the Utilities Commission in New Smyrna. The gentleman
with the water bill. She wasn't living in her house and
they consumed 40,000 gallons. She has never used that much
in her life.
Ms. Carlson stated the City of Edgewater was presented with
a letter by an organization called Central Florida
Sustainable Communities Initiatives. She was wondering if
a deal had been struck with this organization, which is a
non-profit organization, which sets up visioning meetings
with council and staff and has meetings with the residents
to gather and find out what vision they want in the town.
This company has offered to do this for free.
Councilwoman Rhodes stated they decided to do it at the
last meeting. Ms. Carlson stated there is a big hook in
there. The company that formed this is called Canin
Associates. They are not an unbiased company. They are
the ones that will be doing the architecture and
landscaping design for Restoration. They organized this
Central Florida Sustainable Communities Initiatives, non-
profit. They are going to come in here and tell us what we
need, tell the Council to tell the people what we need, and
Planning & Zoning has already told them what they need.
Basically what they are trying to do is smooth the way so
there won't be any bumps in the road or any objections from
the citizens. Let's get this project on the road and tell
the citizens to stay home and don't vote on an amendment to
change it.
Councilwoman Rhodes stated they don't have to do anything
they don't want to do. Acting City Manager Barlow stated
he is going to encourage all citizens to get involved. He
feels the more citizen that get involved the better this
product can be.
Ben Fanselow, 321 Schooner Avenue, asked the Council to ask
City Attorney Ansay who she represents, the town Councilor
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the citizens of Edgewater. Do you realize what a conflict
of interest is? Do you know of any members on the council
who have a conflict of interest and if so why have you not
disclosed it? Do you have a conflict of interest We the
citizens want an attorney that represents the citizens and
not the Council.
City Attorney Ansay stated by Charter she represents the
Council. The Council appointed her. She has a contract
with the City Council. She has worked directly under the
guidance of the Charter, the staff and various departments.
Of course she knows what a conflict of interest. The
entire practice she has is virtually based on representing
public officials and governmental entities. She knows of
no Councilme~er that has a conflict of interest. She has
not been provided any information related to any conflict
of interest.
Mr. Fanselow asked the citizens to remember that they have
no representation. Quick money makes fast friends.
City Attorney Ansay stated that the City of Edgewater,
typically the staff works for the elected officials and the
elected officials are held accountable at the ballot box.
That is usually how the hierarchy in government flows.
Bill Glaser, 1703 Needle Palm Drive, stated he was
wondering if anyone on the Council stood over on Park
Avenue and looked at the Community Center. He commented on
the fascia board appearing like it is rotted out. No paint
or paint peeling off the boards. We are paying money
making other places in the City look pretty. He asked if
they would be willing to pay for a couple gallons of paint
and wire brushes for some folks to paint at least the
fascia of the building to save it from rotting away.
Mr. Glaser commented on a boss he had and anybody that went
to him with a problem he always said if you think it is a
problem you fix it. The only problem being is he no longer
had the responsibility or authority to fix the problem.
The Council has the authority and the responsibility to at
least maybe make the City Hall look a little better.
Councilwoman Rhodes stated they might have the
responsibility but we don't have the money right now.
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Dominic Capri a , 606 Topside Circle, stated talking about
conflict. He asked Councilman Cooper who paid for his
campaign signs. Wasn't that to do with the developer of
Restoration? Councilman Cooper informed him absolutely
not. He stated they had campaign contributions and he was
probably the only one to put his own money in. If he
looked at the reports in the public records, he would find
that out. Mr. Capri a stated he would do that.
Mayor Thomas called a ten-minute recess at this time. The
meeting recessed at 7:45 p.m. and reconvened at 7:55 p.m.
5. CITY COUNCIL REPORTS
Councilman Cooper stated he had nothing to report but he
wanted to give accolades to the Fire Department, Police
Department and the entire City that did an outrageous job
for the 4th of July. Edgewater Power Boats, Everglades
Boats and Boston Whaler did a super job. He thanked them
for doing that. He thinks that was the best fireworks and
festival we have had.
Councilwoman Rhodes echoed what Councilman Cooper said.
Everyone that worked on the fireworks did a great job. She
suggested next year they move the kids stuff away from the
amplifier by the band. She also commended Finance Director
McKinney and the Finance Department on the CAFR. Because
of the way they laid out the CAFR all her questions were
answered and she didn't have to ask them. She appreciated
that and felt it saved them a lot of time.
Mayor Thomas briefly commented on the regular meetings he
attends.
6. CONSENT AGENDA
A. City Auction Disposal and/or Sale of Surplus of
Capital Items
Acting City Manager Barlow made a staff presentation.
Councilwoman Rhodes made a motion to declare the items
listed on the attached sheet as surplus items and authorize
the sale and/or disposal of all items, second by Councilman
Cooper.
The MOTION CARRIED 3 - 0 .
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7. PUBLIC HEARINGS, ORDINANCES AND RESOLUTIONS
A. 2nd Reading, Ordinance No. 2008-0-06, amending the
Firemen's Pension Fund to include the share plan
to the existing plan
City Attorney Ansay read Ord. 2008-0-06 into the record.
Acting City Manager Barlow made a staff presentation.
Due to there being no comments, Mayor Thomas opened and
closed the public hearing.
Councilman Cooper moved to approve Ord. 2008-0-06, amending
the Firemen's Pension Fund to include the share plan to the
existing plan, second by Councilwoman Rhodes.
The MOTION CARRIED 3 - 0 .
B. 1st Reading, Ordinance No. 2008-0-01, amending
Article I, Chapter 11 of the Code of Ordinances
to reflect the name change to Business Tax
Receipts, fee increase and the addition of the
Certificate of Use Permit
City Attorney Ansay read Ord. 2008-0-01 into the record.
Acting City Manager Barlow made a staff presentation.
Florida Statutes stated in order for these rate changes to
take effect Council must approve them by majority plus one.
For this to occur tonight it has to be at three votes in
favor of.
Development Services Director Darren Lear made a staff
presentation by describing the Certificate of Use Permit.
Councilwoman Rhodes stated the only problem she has with
this is that mixed in with all of this is a fee hike.
Their focus as a Council has been to encourage business and
commercial in this City. She thinks the decisions they
make should follow that focus. She thinks in the economy
today she doesn't think they should put any more of a
burden on the businesses in this City than they already
bear. They are looking at jobs leaving and businesses
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closing. She knows this is a small amount but it is what
it is. She has no problem with the rest of it but she
isn't going to vote for it with the fee hike in there. Mr.
Lear stated they did a survey of surrounding municipalities
and even raising the 5% we are still lower than the
majority.
Councilwoman Rhodes stated these businesses are already
encumbered with huge gas prices as are we all. She thinks
every little bit they can do to help them they should be
doing it.
Mayor Thomas asked for an example on a certain type of
business and how much it is going to go up. Mr. Lear used
Publix as an example and informed him it would probably
increase $10 per year. Councilwoman Rhodes stated but they
are going to pass that on to the people buying their
groceries.
Councilman Cooper stated a new car dealership would go up
$5. Councilwoman Rhodes stated she is entitled to her
opinion and ~he feels they should help them every way that
they can. It's not a huge amount of money but at least
they have the Council's support.
Councilman Cooper stated they haven't utilized this fee
that can be 5% every other year and we haven't done it
since 2004 and we are incurring all of the added expenses
in gas and diesel and labor the same as everybody else on
the street. He feels it is nominal and he wants to
increase business too. There are a couple increases that
are $1.40. It's not a lot of dough.
Mayor Thomas opened the public hearing.
The following citizens spoke:
Carol Ann Stoughton, 2740 Evergreen Drive, felt
Councilwoman Rhodes was right. She felt they should
promote people to stay here. There have been too many
people that went belly up. She even heard they are going
to start charging nurses for licenses. She feels anything
they charge a person to come into town is just one more
debt that they have to try to make up for. They should be
encouraging people to come here by even saying come to our
town and we will waive fees. That is what she thinks
should be looked at. Look for other ways instead of a
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merchant who is trying to come in. He is paying IRS fees,
sales tax fees. You have to look at ways to encourage
people with incentives.
Pat Card, 3019 willow Oak Drive, suggested they keep in
mind it takes three otherwise all they gain from this goes
down the drain. He respected the lady for saying what she
believes. They might want to consider amending. He would
hate to see them lose the whole thing tonight.
Ben Fanselow, 321 Schooner Avenue, asked how many
businesses we have and how much money we would gain from
raising fees for Publix at $10. How much general moneys
would be projected by this? Nobody has done their homework
on it. Somebody should give them the number. Councilwoman
Rhodes stated they know the numbers. Mr. Lear stated it
was first year of adoption 9,271. In subsequent years,
$17,660 for each year.
Mr. Fanselow stated $17,000 doesn't do anything to the
community. When you are between two towns and you want to
talk business you fail to look at your competition and what
they offer. He feels what they are trying to do is not the
businesses but they are trying to encourage people to come
into this area. A business has to raise its product cost
in order for them to make up this $13,000 so it comes from
the general public. He commented on the prices in the
stores being higher. The whole thing is they have to look
at the total picture. They are trying to get people to
come into this town yet they are offering a whole project
to raise the cost of all products. $13,000 isn't worth the
effort. It hurts the businessmen and it hurts people that
are coming into our town.
Mayor Thomas closed the public hearing and entertained a
motion.
Councilwoman Rhodes made a motion to approve Ord. 2008-0-01
amending it to take out the Business Tax Receipt fee
increase.
City Attorney Ansay stated this is an ordinance that is
going to require two readings. Typically the law related
to amending an ordinance in the middle of the process is if
it is a revision that is of a substantive nature they
should come over again on first reading. She would feel
better from a legal perspective if they amend the ordinance
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and come back on first reading again. Councilwoman Rhodes
stated then they don't have to amend it. City Attorney
Ansay informed her staff would go back and amend it and put
it back in their package. Council wouldn't have to take
any action tonight. Councilwoman Rhodes stated they don't
have to amend it with the two other Council people here it
might go like it is. It only wouldn't go like it is
because they are here. City Attorney Ansay informed her
that is a decision staff needs to make. She. thinks that
just from a legal perspective if they change an ordinance
in terms of substance they need to come back again for
first reading.
Councilwoman Rhodes moved to table this until August 18th,
second by Councilman Cooper.
City Attorney Ansay stated she thought the motion would be
to continue it to a date certain. Tabling legally has no
date. She suggested they continue it to a date certain of
August 18th.
Councilwoman Rhodes made a motion that they continue this
to a date certain of August 18, 2008, second by Councilman
Cooper.
Someone mentioned they needed to withdraw the table.
Councilwoman Rhodes questioned having to withdraw the other
motion. City Attorney Ansay informed her that was fine.
She asked if it was seconded. Someone in the audience
stated yes. City Attorney Ansay stated then withdraw it.
Councilwoman Rhodes stated her original motion was not.
City Attorney Ansay stated the original one was not
seconded so it died for lack of a second.
The MOTION CARRIED 3 - 0 .
C. 1st Reading, Ordinance No. 2008-0-02, amending
Articles II, III, IV, V, VIII, IX, XVII, and XIX
of the Land Development Code to reflect that
Occupational Licenses are now Business Tax
Receipts
Mayor Thomas asked Acting City Manager Barlow if Item 7C
was similar to Item 7B.
Acting City Manager Barlow suggested they continue this as
well since it references Chapter 11.
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City Attorney Ansay suggested they open it up, read it and
continue it.
City Attorney Ansay read Ord. 2008-0-02 into the record.
Councilwoman Rhodes wanted to know why to change the name
of something they have to have this. If it is a legal
thing, she gets it. Acting City Manager Barlow stated it
was recommended by a paralegal that yes, they are provided
everywhere that those changes will occur. In it's entirety
was the recommendation of the paralegal.
City Attorney Ansay stated she thought Robin recommended
that they all get the entire sections that are being
amended. From a legal perspective, obviously they all have
to be put on notice what they are voting for. There may be
a better way short of giving them essentially the entire
Code. It is a waste of paper in a lot of regards but it is
necessary. Acting City Manager Barlow stated he would add
that to his task list but he has been working with the City
Clerk on some of the paper reduction in City Hall and
duplication of multiple retentions. He will look at this
as well.
Mayor Thomas opened the public hearing and informed the
public they were going through the motions and this is
subsequent to Item 7B.
Mayor Thomas entertained a motion.
Councilwoman Rhodes made a motion that they continue Ord.
2008-0-02 to a date certain of August 18th, second by
Councilman Cooper.
The MOTION CARRIED 3 - 0 .
D. 2nd Reading, Ordinance No. 2008-0-03, adopting the
remedial plan amendment consistent with the
Stipulated Settlement Agreement between the City
and the Department of Community Affairs
City Attorney Ansay read Ord. 2008-0-03 into the record.
Acting City Manager Barlow made a staff presentation.
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Council Regular Meeting
July 28, 2008
Due to there being no comments, Mayor Thomas opened and
closed the public hearing.
Councilman Cooper made a motion to approve Ord. 2008-0-03,
adopting the remedial plan amendment consistent with the
Stipulated Settlement Agreement between the City and the
Department of Community Affairs, second by Councilwoman
Rhodes.
The MOTION CARRIED 3 - 0 .
E. 2nd Reading, Ordinance No. 2008-0-07, providing
for an amendment of the City Charter, Section
3.04 "Election and TermsU
Mayor Thomas stated it was his understanding that it had
been requested that they remove Item 7E & 7F from the
agenda. He asked if they needed a motion to do that.
City Attorney Ansay felt they should make a motion if they
were going to remove something from the agenda.
Councilwoman Rhodes asked if they were going to remove it
or continue it. Mayor Thomas informed her that was up to
them. Councilwoman Rhodes asked why they were removing it.
Mayor Thomas stated it was recommended to him by the City
Manager to continue it because of the lack of the other
Councilmembers not being present. Councilwoman Rhodes
stated they had this meeting tonight so they could do this
tonight. Councilwoman Rhodes didn't feel it would make a
difference. Mayor Thomas stated that was entirely up to
her. He asked if they wanted to go through the motions on
these.
Acting City Manager Barlow stated it was up to the Council.
Councilwoman Bennington had a family emergency tonight and
although she didn't directly come out and ask for it to be
removed but she had alluded to that she had concerns of not
being there.
Mayor Thomas stated so they need to go through the motions
and ask that it be continued.
City Attorney Ansay stated they didn't have to act unless
they wanted to go through the motions tonight. They could
just continue it. They were going to have to do two
readings anyway. Councilwoman Rhodes stated they have
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Council Regular Meeting
July 28, 2008
already done one. City Attorney Ansay stated this is the
second reading but they would have to do the second
reading. They have time because they have one more Council
meeting before the deadline of the August 28th being on
August 18th. She thinks this is something they want to make
sure they re-advertise given the gravity of them. She
didn't know that they gain anything by going through the
motions on this one. She felt just a motion to continue it
to the next meeting or put it on the agenda for August 18th
was fine.
Mayor Thomas entertained a motion.
Councilwoman Rhodes made a motion that they continue
Ordinance No. 2008-0-07 to the August 18th meeting, second
by Councilman Cooper.
The MOTION CARRIED 3 - 0 .
F. 2nd Reading, Ordinance No. 2008-0-08, providing
for an amendment of the City Charter by deleting
Section 1.01 (a) (1)
Councilwoman Rhodes made a motion that they move Ordinance
No. 2008-0-08 to August 18th agenda, second by Councilman
Cooper.
The MOTION CARRIED 3 - 0 .
Councilman Cooper asked if it was okay to make a statement
abut this so the citizens understand why they did what they
just did.
Councilman Cooper stated these two are very important
amendments. Everybody here is of the opinion they want to
have the full Council seated before they vote on this.
They want to give the best representation they can give.
Nothing was done here on the negative at all.
Mayor Thomas stated there are two districts that listen to
their constituents and stakeholders and they are not here
tonight. They want every citizen of Edgewater to be
represented.
Mayor Thomas informed Ms. Stoughton there was no public
comment on this.
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Council Regular Meeting
July 28, 2008
Ms. Stoughton asked what this was all about. She asked if
it was about the high rise and trying to get it back on the
ballot. Mayor Thomas informed her yes. He stated did he
not make himself clear that they are postponing it until
the August 18th meeting. Ms. Stoughton stated she couldn't
even ask a question as to why it wasn't put in the Charter
when the people voted it in. Mayor Thomas informed her
this was not argumentative.
Councilwoman Rhodes stated they aren't discussing this now.
They have tabled it.
Ms. Stoughton asked why it wasn't put in the Charter when
the people voted on it. Susan Wadsworth told her they
didn't have enough material to put in. People voted on it
and it should have been put in the Charter.
8. BOARD APPOINTMENTS
A. Economic Development Board - Councilwoman Rogers
appointment to fill the expired term of Eric
Caplan, who seeks reappointment
Acting City Manager Barlow informed Mayor Thomas they would
have to postpone Item 8A, 8B and 8D due to Councilwoman
Rogers not being present.
B. Firefighters Pension Fund Board - Councilwoman
Rogers appointment to fill the expired term of
Gary Butt who seeks reappointment and has been
re-elected by the other Board members
This item was postponed due to Councilwoman Rogers not
being present.
C. MPO - Bicycle & Pedestrian Advisory Committee -
Mayor's appointment to fill the unexpired term of
Michael Carroll, who has resigned. Staff
recommends appointing Michelle Grenham.
Mayor Thomas recognized Michelle Grenham and thanked her
for volunteering.
Councilwoman Rhodes moved to approve the Mayor's
appointment of Michelle Grenham to the MPO Bicycle &
pedestrian Advisory Committee, second by Councilman Cooper.
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Council Regular Meeting
July 28, 2008
The MOTION CARRIED 3-0.
D. Firefighters Pension Fund Board - Councilwoman
Bennington's appointment to fill the expired term
of Martin Tse. The Board recommends appointing
Deborah Harrison.
This item was postponed due to Councilwoman Bennington not
being present.
9. OTHER BUSINESS
A. Purchase of 12 lead, SA02 and waveform
capnography upgrades for two existing Zoll
cardiac monitors
Acting City Manager Barlow made a staff presentation.
Due to there being no comments, Mayor Thomas entertained a
motion.
Councilwoman Rhodes made a motion to authorize the purchase
of the cardiac monitor upgrades by utilizing $29,000 from
the Fire-Rescue impact fees, second by Councilman Cooper.
The MOTION CARRIED 3 - 0 .
B. Acceptance of the Quit Claim Deeds from Barringer
& Boren Properties, LLC & Schnebly for .16~ acres
of land located north of Old County Road
Acting City Manager Barlow made a staff presentation.
Councilwoman Rhodes asked what happens if Schnebly won't
quit claim to us. Acting City Manager Barlow stated they
would negotiate something. He has just started. He is
just reviewing this. This will help with the negotiations
if he can show in good faith his neighbors have cooperated.
It has to be resolved one way or another.
Councilwoman Rhodes stated it said somewhere that the City
was going to pave the road as soon as possible. She asked
Acting City Manager Barlow when he anticipated that
happening. Acting City Manager Barlow stated they have to
get this done first. They have prices and one of the
property owners has a paving company and has given us a
very good price. Now it is determining who is going to
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Council Regular Meeting
July 28, 2008
fund those costs. They were creative on the road just west
of there and did a shared agreement with the property
owners there. He is hoping staff can be as creative as
this project as they were with the other. Councilman
Cooper felt he needed to be commended for that.
Councilman Cooper moved to approve the Quit Claim deeds for
property north of Old County Road currently owned by the
Barringer's & Boren Properties LLC and the Schnebly's,
second by Councilwoman Rhodes.
The MOTION CARRIED 3 - 0 .
C. Approval of Work Order No. 2007-02; CPH Engineers
to provide Environmental Monitoring of Wetlands
Acting City Manager Barlow made a staff presentation.
Councilman Cooper asked why it is such a huge up front fee
the first year. Acting Director of Environmental Services
Brenda Dewees stated they are going to have to install the
monitoring wells the first year so they have mobilization
costs plus they have to survey all of the locations of the
wells themselves. In addition to that they have to go out
150 feet each way to do a transact location to monitor the
wetlands and to see the effects of our production wells on
those wetlands.
Acting City Manager Barlow commended Ms. Dewees and her
staff for rapidly addressing this in a short amount of
time.
Councilman Cooper questioned there not having to be any
shut down or interruption of service to the citizens. Ms.
Dewees informed him no. These are actually separate wells.
They are shallow wells. They are only 15 feet deep. They
are completely separate from our production wells for our
City water supply. St. Johns wants to ensure that our
production wells are not degrading any of the wetlands in
the area.
Mayor Thomas asked for comments from the public.
The following citizens spoke:
Dot Carlson, 1714 Edgewater Drive/624 Art Center Avenue,
asked where the wetlands are that they are studying. Ms.
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July 28, 2008
Dewees informed her six of them are west of 1-95 and two of
them are east of 1-95. Ms. Carlson asked when they applied
for the CUP was that an anticipation of an increase in
population because she read that. Ms. Dewees informed her
yes. Ms. Carlson asked where they expect the increase to
be. Acting City Manager Barlow stated everywhere that they
serve water customers.
Ms. Carlson mentioned the property west of 1-95 being
really wet. She had a feeling they were going to have to
spend some money to get these people to move in.
Councilwoman Rhodes stated it doesn't have anything to do
with anybody moving in. Ms. Dewees stated the reason they
are monitoring the wetlands west of there is because that
is where our production wells are.
Pat Card, 3019 Willow Oak Drive, stated it appears that
since we draw our water from the Florida aquifer, which is
at approximately 150 to 175 feet and at 70 feet, there is a
tremendous clay bed that separates the Florida aquifer from
the surficial aquifer. What in effect they are checking
here is whether or not the water is going to run down hill
to the river. He asked if this was right. Ms. Dewees
stated it was a four-year process in order for us to
acquire a 20-year CUP. During that process there were
several models that St. Johns has that they run to ensure
that what allocations they are asking for as far as ground
water resources are concerned that there is going to be
adequate supply in the aquifer. Their models sometimes
disagree with other people's models. In order to confirm
their models, they like to monitor the wetlands to ensure
that what we are pulling out of the lower aquifer is not
degrading the upper aquifer.
Carol Ann Stoughton, 2740 Evergreen Drive, stated Eastern
Shores has been a round a long time. Here is another deal
where we are taking over from something that was put in a
long time ago and the town has a burden when the developer
didn't do it. The anticipation of future growth. We
aren't putting anything over on the public. That future
growth is Restorations.
Mayor Thomas asked Ms. Stoughton what that has to do with
wetlands. Ms. Stoughton stated it is wetlands. There are
wetlands. Why are we providing water west of 1-95 when
there is nobody out there? She thinks they should be
providing water for the people here and not spending money
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Council Regular Meeting
July 28, 2008
out there. It's as simple as that. This is another snow
job to the people and an expense to the town that the
taxpayers shouldn't have to pay for. Councilwoman Rhodes
stated we aren't providing water out there. That is where
our wells are and that is where they have to be monitored.
It has nothing to do with providing water to anybody.
Councilman Cooper asked if they are mandated to get the 20-
year CUP from St. Johns to do this. Ms. Dewees stated we
got the 20-year CUP and in that permit that was part of it.
Due to there not being any more citizen comments, Mayor
Thomas entertained a motion.
Councilman Cooper made a motion to confirm and approve the
execution of the Acting City Manager on the execution of
Work Order 2007-02 with CPH to provide environmental
monitoring of the wetlands identified in the City of
Edgewater's Consumptive Use Permit, second by Councilwoman
Rhodes.
The MOTION CARRIED 3 - 0 .
D. Authorization for the City Manager to execute an
amended Agreement with the Florida Department of
Environmental Protection for the Eastern Shores
Grant
Acting City Manager Barlow informed Council that Items D,
E, and F were tied together. He then provided the
background information with regard to the necessity of
amending the agreement with FDEP.
Acting City Manager Barlow commented on Items 9E and 9F.
Councilman Cooper asked if the added $13,797 is part of the
actual grant that is there. Is there still money left to
cover that or is that going to be an additional expense for
us. Ms. Dewees informed him that would be an additional
expense. The grant we received is a cost share grant so
there are certain requirements that the City has to pay
for. One of these things is engineering survey and design
fees. They will only cover actual construction costs of
the improvement.
Councilwoman Cooper asked about the homes that would be
affected there. Is the return on the revenue projected
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Council Regular Meeting
July 28, 2008
somewhere? Ms. Dewees stated there are several homes in
there. In order to help reduce the flooding concerns in
that area, the reason they flood is the water is coming
from Marion Avenue and coming into this mobile home park.
In addition to that there is water that is being sheet
flowed, untreated right into our canals that are
essentially going into the Indian River lagoon system.
Councilman Cooper stated so we have some heavy toxins that
are flowing in because there is no control over it. Ms.
Dewees explained part of the grant money will pay for them
to evaluate that and test for those nutrients that are
going into the river right now untreated and to show that
what we have done is cleaning up this water and stormwater.
Keep in mind that one of the routes this is going to take
is to direct this water into a stormwater pond that the
City did purchase back in September. They are going to
clean that area up, enhance it and beautify it a little bit
and treat the water before it goes into the canal system
and eventually into the Indian River lagoon.
Councilwoman Rhodes had an issue with the engineers. Ms.
Dewees informed her the engineer was here to answer any
questions.
Ms. Dewees introduced Jim Shira with B&H. Councilwoman
Rhodes asked him why he is surprised. Mr. Shira stated
because they didn't prepare the grant application. The
grant application that was prepared by others assumed a
certain type of stormwater treatment process and the grant
application was submitted by this previous firm. It was
approved and when it was given to them to implement then
and only then were soil surveys done, that is where the
surprise came. Ms. Dewees informed her that was another
grant. Acting City Manager Barlow stated it is also a
catch 22. They had to secure the grant money.
Councilwoman Rhodes stated they went through this with the
shell in ParkTowne. She is over it. She is over the
engineers. The very definition of an engineer is you are
supposed to know. Mr. Shira informed her had they done it
from the onset they would have known. Councilwoman Rhodes
feels with what the engineers are paid she would expect a
little bit of knowledge. Acting City Manager Barlow stated
sometimes they have to do the grant to get the money to
hire the engineer to do the soil sample to determine that
they can't. Different grants can be very convoluted on
what step they have to do first.
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Council Regular Meeting
July 28, 2008
Mayor Thomas asked Ms. Dewees what the Mayor's goal is for
runoff into the Indian River. Ms. Dewees informed him
probably zero run off to the Indian River. This will help
tremendously. Acting City Manager Barlow commented on this
being a very old stormwater problem.
Mayor Thomas asked for public comment or questions.
The following citizen spoke:
Carol Ann Stoughton, 2740 Evergreen Drive, asked who the
engineer was and if there is any way that the city can go
back after these people who we had to pay to do these
services for non performance of work. It's a sad state of
affairs. She feels it is a sin that whoever did it and got
paid for it didn't do the job. Maybe they should look into
that and get some money back.
Due to there being no further comments, Mayor Thomas
entertained a motion.
Councilwoman Rhodes moved to approve the attached agreement
with FDEP for the Eastern Shores Stormwater Improvement
Project with modification that FDEP may require and
authorize the City Manager to execute the agreement, second
by Councilman Cooper.
The MOTION CARRIED 3 - 0 .
E. Authorization for the Mayor to execute an
Easement Agreement for the Eastern Shores Mobile
Home Park Stormwater Project
Councilman Cooper moved to approve the easement agreement
and authorize the Mayor to execute the document, second by
Councilwoman Rhodes.
The MOTION CARRIED 3 - 0 .
F. Authorization for the City Manager to execute
Work Order 2007-05 allowing B&H Consultants to
complete work on the Eastern Shores Stormwater
Project
Councilwoman Rhodes moved to approve Work Order 2007-05 to
B & H Consultants in the amount of $13,797 and authorize
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Council Regular Meeting
July 28, 2008
the City Manager to execute the document, second by
Councilman Cooper.
The MOTION CARRIED 3 - 0 .
Mayor Thomas called a ten-minute recess at this time. The
meeting recessed at 8:50 p.m. and reconvened at 9:00 p.m.
G. Notice of Proposed Property Taxes (TRIM Notice)
pursuant to Section 200.069, F.S. setting the
Tentative operating millage for Fiscal Year 2009
Finance Director McKinney asked Council to set the
tentative millage rate for fiscal year 2008/2009 at 6.43899
mills, which is the roll back rate, which would generate
the same amount of revenue that we received in the
2007/2008 fiscal year. He then commented on what a
taxpayer would pay in the current year and next year. He
contacted all of the other agencies we pay taxes to and
with our millage rate and everyone elses tentative millage
rate the current year 07/08 tax bill on a $150,000 home
with the 25,000 homestead exemption would be $2,532.80.
With our proposed millage and that of all the other
districts the total tax bill would be a decrease from
$2,532 down to $2,203 that is assuming also the $25,000
Amendment 1 exemption. He then commented on how that
relates to an average home such as in Florida Shores. This
year we saw 15.6% decrease in our taxable value. The only
city greater than Edgewater was Deltona. We are pretty
much single-family dwellings. We don't have a high
commercial or second home base like New Smyrna, Ponce
Inlet, and Daytona Beach Shores. He mentioned other cities
going to Council and asking for the roll back rate. The
ones that have seen a decrease they still had a lot of
construction such as condos and commercial.
Councilwoman Rhodes stated to put it at the highest they
can put it because they can always come down and can not go
back up. She thinks they need to leave options open.
Going to the roll back rate, she doesn't know that they
could do much better than that especially with as cash
strapped as we are. She suggested setting it at the 6.44
and coming down if they are able.
Councilman Cooper stated he realized they are stuck with
this and they have to go to the roll back rate but with
Amendment 1 and they haven't got the mandate yet of what is
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Council Regular Meeting
July 28, 2008
going to happen and if there is gong to be sizeable cuts
again. They also have another survey coming forward on
utility fee increases and things of that nature that may
help with this problem. He is concerned because the State
says they are going to give an additional $25,000 homestead
exemption cities are now already implementing a higher ad
valorem to take away that exemption. We are right in there
taxing where a higher power gave you a break and the cities
are taking it back. He would like to guard themselves
against doing it if they don't have to. He would like them
to look harder at revenue generating areas. They need to
exercise every avenue they possibly can to generate revenue
and not generate it just by going to the tax rolls because
they can.
Finance Director McKinney stated when he comes before them
on August 11th- for the General Fund Budget workshop. They
met at 6 p.m-. this evening to discuss the cost allocation.
With that in mind with what the millage rate he is asking
for, if he can come back August 11th with Tracey and say
they can balance the budget at 5.9 or 5.6 then that is what
he is going to present to them August 11th. Right now if
they go below 6.4 and they have to be at 6.4 then they have
to do a mailing out to the entire city. Our maximum
millage is 6.9 by the State's calculation. He only brought
before Council the roll back rate.
Councilman Cooper stated his heart goes out to the citizens
so they understand completely what they are actually doing.
Acting City Manager Barlow stated the entire staff is
working very hard in the budget. They want to make sure
they do everything they can for cost containment.
Councilwoman Rhodes stated 2007 was the first year in
recent memory that we actually met our unrestricted funds.
We made 16%, which was just squeaking by. We did that by
virtue of selling the ParkTowne property. We are not going
to have that luxury next year. She thinks they need to be
mindful of that and not put themselves in a position where
they cannot make the Charter requirement. Acting City
Manager Barlow stated it is a concern of theirs as well.
They have 17 positions allocated in last year's budget that
they have frozen trying to hold down costs. We have done a
lot of job sharing lately. The employees are working hard
but they are getting by.
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Council Regular Meeting
July 28, 2008
Councilwoman Rhodes stated at some point we are going to
have to alleviate that burden on our employees. Our
employees are working over and above and they have been
doing it for at least two years now. At some point they
are going to have to be in a position where they can have
the staff we need to get the work done without over
burdening our employees and burning them out. She would
like to see them get there this year. She also wants the
unrestricted funds met too. Acting City Manager Barlow
stated they are doing a lot of clean up work. He is hoping
around mid quarter 2010 the economy will turn and they are
putting things in place now. This year and next year he is
convinced it is going to be rough tight years without a
doubt but they are trying. Councilwoman Rhodes stated our
insurance costs are going to go up because the employees
are all going to be sick with stress related illnesses. In
her mind for the future that would be a goal of hers.
Mayor Thomas opened the public hearing.
The following citizens spoke:
Dominic Capria, 606 Topside Circle, stated he knows it is a
tough job keeping the millage rate down. That is for sure.
He thinks they are doing a good job trying to do it but he
feels the millage rate is a little high because of
Amendment 1. He voted against Amendment 1. This concerns
him because for years they have been comparing with other
cities such as New Smyrna. New Smyrna has approximately
225 plus employees, which is much more than us. Their tax
rate has always been lower than us. We have been number 2
ever since he lived here which is 19 years. He thinks they
are shooting for number 1 on the hit parade. He knows they
have to put the millage rate at that because of the law and
he was positive they were going to reduce some of that. He
would like to see it go much lower and not be number one on
the hit parade.
Robert Lott, 2112 S. Riverside Drive, stated he keeps
hearing a lot of wish in one hand. Everybody wants lower
millage rates. He keeps hearing we want to be compared to
New Smyrna Beach but then we don't want the commercial
aspect of New Smyrna Beach, such as the condos, the rental
properties and all those revenue-generating things to keep
the millage rate down. They can't have it both ways. He
was talking to the citizens in the audience. They have to
make a decision and have solutions and not just make
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Council Regular Meeting
July 28, 2008
complaints. Come up with solutions. There are solutions
and they can grow. We can grow in a smart way. We can
create these revenue streams and ease the tax burden on the
residents of this City. The State did mandate a 6.9% and
they didn't even approach that. They stated at the roll
back rate, which is commendable as well. It is difficult.
It is hard. We have to start making some tough decision on
how we are going to grow and what type of growth we need.
He hopes everybody is ready to keep their minds open and
look at some of the opportunities that should come.
Mayor Thomas closed the public hearing and entertained a
motion.
Councilwoman Rhodes moved to have the City advertise the
millage rate at 6.43899 mills, second by Councilman Cooper.
The MOTION CARRIED 3 - 0 .
H. Notice of Proposed Property Taxes (TRIM Notice)
pursuant to Section 200.069, F.S. setting the
Tentative non ad-valorem voted debt service
millage for Fiscal Year 2009
Finance Director McKinney made a staff presentation. The
Edgewater I&S is for the debt we issued for the animal
shelter and for the 08/09 fiscal year we have a debt
payment principle and interest of $31,918. Our proposed
voted debt service requirement for fiscal year 08/09 would
be a millage rate of .033047 which would have them at
exactly $31,918 in ad valorem revenue.
Councilwoman Rhodes stated it seems to her that last year
the millage rate for this debt service was a lot higher.
Finance Director McKinney informed her it was lower. It
was .0271. Our 2007 adjusted taxable value was
$1,195,974,542. Our preliminary taxable value going into
next year with new construction is $980,595,906. We have
had a decrease in our taxable value. In order to make
their debt service requirement the millage rate had to go
up.
Councilman Cooper commented on this being added to the
millage rate they just passed so it would bring their
millage to 6.76946. Councilwoman Rhodes stated that was ad
valorem and this is non ad-valorem. Acting City Manager
Barlow stated this is the debt service on the animal
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Council Regular Meeting
July 28, 2008
shelter bond to meet our debt service payments.
Councilwoman Rhodes stated she didn't think they had a
choice with this one. Finance Director McKinney informed
her they didn't. He figured it out to be 6.47946.
Mayor Thomas opened the public hearing.
The following citizen spoke:
Carol Ann Stoughton, 2740 Evergreen Drive, asked what the
current debt service was in ParkTowne. We have a bond that
we have until 2018. What is that debt? Finance Director
McKinney stated we have some notes. Ms. Stoughton asked
how much was that. Finance Director McKinney informed her
there was more than one. Ms. Stoughton asked if it was
figured in our debt. Finance Director McKinney informed
her yes. Ms. Stoughton asked how much it is. Finance
Director McKinney informed her he could give her that
information tomorrow. Ms. Stoughton feels people should
know we aren't out of the woods yet and that wasn't a gain
to our community but it is still a debt. She thinks they
should negotiate some of these debts and pay them off if
they no longer own the property. She informed Finance
Director McKinney he could get back to her on that.
Finance Director McKinney stated he would provide to Tracey
our total debt outstanding on ParkTowne. She said pay down
the debt. He has spoken with our debt financial advisor
strictly to restructuring our debt and he said at our
current rate structure we couldn't refinance any of our
debt because other than CPI we have not adjusted our rates
since 2002. Unless we adjust our rates he cannot refinance
and pay down the debt any quicker.
Councilman Cooper asked if it was in ParkTowne plaza that
the payments commence shortly. Finance Director McKinney
informed him yes and this year we also have to pay interest
on the FIND note. Councilman Cooper stated their payments
will start commencing and that will be paying down the debt
the City incurred. ParkTowne now starts to pay and it will
pay the debt as far as the City is concerned. Finance
Director McKinney stated we have debt we have used to
finance ParkTowne but some of it they have paid outright.
Acting City Manager Barlow commented on the debt we have on
the improvements made in Florida Shores. Finance Director
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Council Regular Meeting
July 28, 2008
McKinney also mentioned having debt on Terra Mar. He spoke
of having $32 million in Enterprise debt service.
Mayor Thomas entertained a motion.
Councilman Cooper made a motion for the City Manager to
advertise the non ad valorem millage rate at .033047 mills,
second by Councilwoman Rhodes.
The MOTION CARRIED 3 - 0 .
10. OFFICER REPORTS
A. City Clerk
City Clerk Wenzel stated she put a document in their boxes
today. There is an Institute for Elected Municipal
Officials coming up in October. She asked them to look
over the paperwork and let her know if they would like to
attend. Mayor Thomas informed her he wasn't going.
B. City Attorney
City Attorney Ansay commented on the declaratory action
that the City filed related to the proposed Charter
Amendment for the lands west of 1-95. They had a hearing a
week ago today. The judge has not ruled. The attorneys
for the interested landowners affected by the measure
presented their arguments. The attorney for ECARD
presented their arguments. She explained to the court that
Council and the City was hoping to get a resolution as
quickly as they can so that if the court rules that the
measure is valid we will have sufficient time and the judge
concurred and said he was going to do everything possible
to make that happen. She recognized they had a meeting on
August 18th. The deadline is the 28th of August. That will
give them plenty of time to pass a resolution if the court
rules that it must go on the ballot, they can do it at that
meeting. She fully expected the judge to rule by that
date.
City Attorney Ansay stated the City Council denied the
application for vested rights of River Club. SeaGate came
with three applications. One staff granted and denied two.
One Council granted of those two but denied the third,
which was River Club. They have appealed that and will be
going forward with oral arguments defending the City's
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Council Regular Meeting
July 28, 2008
position in that denial and SeaGate will be attempting to
try to get the court to overrule that. She agreed to let
them know how that turns out. She believed that would be
in the next week or two.
City Attorney Ansay stated she gave a note to Mr. Barlow
earlier and suggested that Council think about including in
the agenda at he very beginning a section that deals with
any additions, changes or deletions to the agenda. It is
common in a number of municipalities to do that up front.
Tonight was a night where they had a number of agenda items
that they postponed. She thinks that sometimes is a good
idea. If they have things they know they have to pull that
maybe they could do it up front in case folks are present
for those. She feels this might be a good way to address
those issues.
C. City Manager
Acting City Manager Barlow stated the department directors
quarterly reports have been placed in their boxes.
Acting City Manager Barlow reported that the Wastewater
Maintenance Building is near completion. Jack Corder is
working on finalizing the plans for the renovation of the
shelter. Time wise they feel they are on schedule and
still shooting for the December 25th goal.
Acting City Manager Barlow reported that North Flagler has
been completed and reopened. Brenda is working with the
County to see if they can get the street sweepers to come
out there and do a final clean on Park Avenue. That went
extremely well.
1) Tentative Agenda Items
Acting City Manager Barlow asked Council to look at the
Tentative Agenda Items listing in the back of their agenda
packets. There are some very important dates coming up.
The August 4th meeting has been canceled. On August 11th
they have a workshop for the General Fund Budget. August
18th is a 6 p.m. workshop presentation on the rate study and
a regular Council meeting at 7 p.m. One very important
date is August 23rd at 9 a.m. in the Community Center for
the Community Visioning Process. He encouraged Council to
encourage the citizens and their neighbors to participate.
This is the first public workshop where all the citizens
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have the opportunity to give input on what they want their
community to look like as they go forward. August 25th is
the Enterprise Fund budget workshop. September 1st is Labor
Day so they are rescheduling that meeting to September 8th.
The second Community Visioning process meeting is going to
be September 6th at the same time as the first one, which he
expected to last three or four hours. Since they had to
reschedule the Labor Day meeting they also had to
reschedule the September 15th meeting to September 22nd.
Acting City Manager Barlow stated any part of the agenda
they aren't required to keep and they are discarding to
leave it on the dais because we do recycle at City Hall and
we can add it with our recycling.
Mayor Thomas stated what Acting City Manager Barlow didn't
tell them was he was very active in the paving of North
Flagler Avenue. He negotiated and got all the concrete
donated. Acting City Manager Barlow stated it was $23,000
worth of concrete donated by Tarmac Industries.
Councilman Cooper asked Acting City Manager Barlow for an
update on the amphitheater roof. We are running out of
time. Acting City Manager Barlow stated he had a
conversation with Mr. Corder last week regarding that and
it appears he has negotiated and they will need to re-bid
that because they can't get a contractor to come in under
the original price. That is one of his top priorities upon
returning to work. He thought he told him the grant was
good until next Spring. He agreed to double-check the
date.
11. CITIZEN COMMENTS
The following citizens spoke:
Mike Visconti, 316 Pine Breeze Drive, wanted to speak about
Reflections & Restoration west of 1-95. Here in Edgewater
we have per say building permits for building homes. Here
we have two developers who are willing to bring millions of
dollars into Edgewater and build homes in residential and
commercial properties using their money. Bringing their
money here. Right now our economy is really low because of
the building. If you build one house on a piece of
property, you get the tree removal, then the excavation,
then the slab, then cement mixer, then the framers, then
cement blocks, then the roofers. All of these are the
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July 28, 2008
trades that need the work. In one house you have all these
trades, plus people buying appliances for their homes.
They have to have some money coming in and give these trade
people work that we need so badly here and everywhere. He
spoke of seeing one building permit in the newspaper. We
need building, some jobs and for people to work. Right now
he sees a lot of places closing down. He went to the
printers in New Smyrna, Quick Print and they are closing
their doors Friday, August 1st. He also commented on the
restaurant across the street being closed. He closed his
business for the same reason, no building. He hopes that
these developers come in and start right way doing what
they have to do and supply this work for Edgewater and the
vicinities.
Dominic Capri a , 606 Topside Circle, stated 1.01(1) (a). He
was confused due to not being able to find 1.01(1) (a)
probably because he had an old Charter. He asked if that
is dealing with building heights.
City Attorney Ansay stated the Charter amendment that was
passed was Section 1.01(a) (1). Mr. Capria again asked if
that had to do with building heights. City Attorney Ansay
informed him yes.
Dot Carlson, 1714 Edgewater Drive/624 Art Center Avenue,
asked Council where a citizen would find what she just
referred to. This just says Ordinance 2008-0-08. She
looked at the Charter online. 1.01(a) (1) is not there for
the general public to read. If you are going to ask them
to vote on this, they better get this one clear because
they are asking them to remove residential height. As Mr.
Lott said we can't get any businesses and can't reduce the
tax base because we don't have high condominiums and high
apartment buildings. Last year it was commercial and
industrial. Took that out. That is out there. She asked
if that was reflected in there that commercial and
industrial was removed from that amendment by a vote of the
people in 2007. Acting City Manager Barlow provided Ms.
Carlson with his copy of the Charter.
Ms. Carlson stated if that pertains to height on
residential and it doesn't. She has read the ballot
language if that is what they are going to use. It says
amendment to delete this section from the Charter and that
refers to all building heights in Edgewater. The building
heights in Edgewater were upped for commercial and
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Council Regular Meeting
July 28, 2008
industrial in 2007. She asked if anyone remembered that
vote. Now they are going after the residences. People
were guaranteed they wouldn't have condos looming over
their neighborhoods. They can't guarantee that and are
going to demolish it because Restoration needs the height.
She also stated she needed her letters back.
Carol Ann Stoughton, 2740 Evergreen Drive, asked why when
the people voted in 2006 it wasn't put in the Charter, what
they voted on. Mrs. Wadsworth told her they didn't have
enough to go to print. If the people voted on a petition
that was submitted and what happened happened why isn't it
in the Charter. If City Attorney Ansay works for the
Council and the Council work for the people why isn't what
they voted on in the Charter. Because you all plan to
change it? She wanted to know how much they are going to
spend for other consultants to try to ram this down their
throat again. She would hate to see the City spend money
because there is a big conflict here. She will still come
and speak her mind. She sees that the people voted by the
developer paid certain Council people to get in office and
if they do vote they were paid by the developers to get in
office. She wanted to know why it wasn't put in the
Charter.
Mayor Thomas stated you are saying that Restoration paid to
have some people put on this Council. Ms. Stoughton
accused him of trying to put words in her mouth. She
didn't say that. She wanted to know why it wasn't put In
the Charter. The fact that the people voted with a
petition. Why wasn't that put in the Charter? Are they
going to spend monies to try to ram this down the peoples
throat again. They all know what is behind it. Why wasn't
it put in the Charter?
Acting City Manager Barlow stated that is the
responsibility of staff, not the City Attorney. The
Council did pass a referendum which brought it into law.
The question is why wasn't that put to print. That was the
responsibility of the previous City Clerk. From his
understanding was she was gathering numerous other
legislative changes and doing one major update. He is
working with the City Clerk and they are working to have
all of their Codes, and we already have an agreement that
was executed numerous months ago putting all of our codes
online.
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Council Regular Meeting
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Ms. Stoughton stated it is two years old. She would like
to see it in the Charter. They voted for it and it should
be in there. What is the game we are playing now? Because
we don't want to put it in because we want to over ride it?
You might laugh but you are representing a Council and she
is the people.
Councilwoman Rhodes stated well if it is over written it
would be stupid to put it in now and then take it out
again. Ms. Stoughton stated duh we voted on it. It should
be in there.
Councilwoman Rhodes stated that is a waste of money. Ms
Stoughton stated you see what is going on here. It will
all be put in the paper.
City Attorney Ansay stated as far as the legal issue is
concerned once the amendment is passed is effective and
becomes law. The issue of actually getting it printed that
lies with staff and Municipal Code Corporation. Bonnie
doesn't sit and type up the Charter that goes into the book
and gets distributed. We have a contract with a
Corporation that does that and they are actively working
with that corporation to make those changes effective. It
is not an instantaneous process. Once that happens it will
also be online and there will be a lot of other benefits to
it. It is the law whether someone's outdated version of
the Charter has it or not. It remains the law once it was
passed. It is certainly from a legal perspective fully
effective.
Mayor Thomas stated usually when the Legislature passes
laws they are usually in effect July 1st or October 1st and
it doesn't go in the law book but it is still a law. City
Attorney Ansay explained that was a different deal. When
legislation is passed and it has an effective date
specified that becomes effective on that date. Typically
the law is unless the measure being passed states otherwise
it becomes effective upon passage or adoption. Usually
what the Legislature does is they pass it early in the
spring and they make effective July 1st. She commented on
some reasons why this is done. Here it became effective
immediately. It is the law whether or not there is a lag
in getting folks copies of the Charter updated or not it
certainly is the law doesn't affect the effectiveness of it
at all.
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Council Regular Meeting
July 28, 2008
Bob Lott, 2112 S. Riverside Drive, stated he sat on the
Charter Review Committee in 2004 and he has chaired the
Committee in 2008. Every five years they take a look at
the Charter. Every Council person appointed a citizen from
their district and one at large and they sit down and go
over the Charter to see if things have changed that would
make things in the Charter no longer relevant or damaging.
It has been a very action packed two years. They already
have a 35-foot height limit in the Land Development Code
that the previous Council invoked. There is a very
difficult process that one has to go through to get any
kind of deviation from the Land Development Code. When you
put the Land Development Code in the Charter, they not only
have all of those requirements that they must meet in order
to get that variance for that Land Development Code but on
top of that they have to put that to vote to the citizens.
That means they have to educate the citizenry as to exactly
what that means. He stated one of the reasons this Charter
Review Committee requested this amendment be looked at
again is because they learned a lot of things. The City of
St. Petersburg spends most of their time in court trying to
alleviate situations they shouldn't have to do because it
is in their Charter. It shouldn't be in the Charter. We
are government by representation we are not a full-fledged
democracy or socialist republic. They have to reevaluate
these things as they come down the road. It was this
Committee's opinion that they really needed to look at it.
Especially when the first vote passed 51% to 49%. It
wasn't exactly a mandate. Once the public was educated to
what actually it meant it they turned around to 73% and
said they really didn't mean that. They probably should
have gone back and asked to have the whole thing removed
then. They were trying to do what they felt was best for
the City. It's not a matter of ramming it down somebody's
throat or special interest. It is a matter of governing
our community. They have to give the elected officials the
opportunity to make the decisions that are in the best
interest of the City. When they take that way from them
i.e. putting it in the Charter, they can't tolerate that.
He hoped that added a little bit of clarification.
Mayor Thomas informed Ms. Carlson she had already had one
turn. Ms. Carlson stated so did he. Mayor Thomas stated
he didn't think so, not under Citizen Comments. Ms.
Carlson stood corrected and thanked Mayor Thomas.
12. ADJOURNMENT
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Council Regular Meeting
July 28, 2008
There being no further business to discuss, Councilwoman
Rhodes moved to adjourn. The meeting adjourned at 9:48
p.m.
Minutes submitted by:
Lisa Bloomer
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Council Regular Meeting
July 28, 2008