10-28-1998 - Workshop
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9HE CITY OF ED9EWATER
POST OFFICE BOX 100-EDGEWATER, FLORIDA 32132-0100
Mayor Randy G. Allman
District 1 Councilman James K. Gornto
District 2 Councilman Myron F. Hammond
District 3 Councilman Gary W. Roberts
District 4 Councilwoman Judith R. Lichter
Interim City Manager Kenneth R. Hooper
City Attorney Nikki Clayton
City Clerk Susan J. Wadsworth
October 20, 1998
-PUBLIC NOTICE-
The City Council of Edgewater will hold a workshop at 7:00 p.m., Wednesday, October 28,
1998, in the Community Center. The purpose of the workshop is to discuss the possible relationship
between the City of Edgewater and the YMCA.
The City is interested in addressing Citizen's concerns. Questions may be submitted prior
to the meeting by placing them in the questionaire box located in the City Hall lobby. If City Hall
is closed, the questions may be placed in the night deposit box.
:lizm
CITY MANAGER'S OFFICE
104 NORTH RIVERSIDE DRIVE
(904)424-2404 FAX-(904)424-2409
c:\meetings\wksj I 0.288
112 -
6 7(A7
MESSAGE ON CITY CLERK'S VOICE MAIL
10-28-98/ 10:38AM
MESSAGE FROM JIM WARNER-428-6347
IS FOR THE Y.M.C.A
CO37° 2 4903
Ct7-1
RECEIVED 10- 26- 98A09:18 RCVD
COT 261998
GITY MANAGER
CITIZENS OF EDGEWATER
DO YOU WANT A YMCA TO HAVE A JOINT PARTNERSHIP WITH THE CITY OF
EDGEWATER? DO YOU WANT CITY MONEY AND CITY PROPERTY IN A JOINT
VENTURE - WITH THE YMCA MANAGING IT? THIS MEANS YOUR TAX DOLLARS
AT WORK - THINK ABOUT IT, DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT AND STATE YOUR
OPINION, BEFORE IT IS TOO LATE.
NEWS JOURNAL ARTICLE ON WEDNESDAY, OCTOBER 21, 1998 -
MAYOR ALLMAN CALLED FOR A WORKSHOP TO LAY OUT CONCEPTS TO THE
COMMUNITY AND URGED PARENTS, SENIOR CITIZENS AND YOUNG TO COME
TO THE Oct. 28 WORKSHOP. "WE NEED TO HEAR WHAT THE PEOPLE HAVE TO
SAY, "ALLMAN SAID. THE CITY WORKSHOP IS PLANNED ONE DAY AFTER THE
YMCA CONSULTANT, INTERVIEWS THE ELEMENTARY SCHOOL CHILDREN.
TO ACCOMMODATE CITIZENS WHO CANNOT COME OUT TO THE WORKSHOP,
ALLMAN ANNOUNCED A QUESTION AND SUGGESTION BOX WOULD BE SET UP
AT CITY HALL. CITIZENS OF ALL AGES ARE INVITED TO SUBMIT THEIR
CONCERNS AND QUESTIONS, HE SAID.
PLEASE EITHER DELIVER TO CITY HALL - EDGEWATER, OR MAIL TO:
EGEWATER TOWN HALL, ATTENTION: MAYOR ALLMAN, P.O. BOX 100,
EDGEWATER, FL 32132.
YOUR QUESTIONS AND CONCERNS STATED BELOW
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ocl 0141° ops ,0 Questions for the workshop about the Y.M.C.A
1. Does the city of Edgewater need a facility as proposed by the "Y" and the city manager?
a) Can we do with less as we had planned in the beginning?
2. Is there a large enough base in South East Volusia to support the "Y" ?
3. What % of the users would be unable to pay the full amount or none of the costs of
membership?
4. Will the $50,000 subsidy continue beyond five years ?
a) If the answer is yes what would cause this extension ?
5. What is the failure rate of Y.M.C.A.'s ?
6. If the "Y" was to fail could the city manage the operating costs of over $500,000.00 a year.
7. Will the city continue the rec. program as we now know it ?
a) Will the basketball league be run by the "Y" or the city ?
b) Who will schedule these games ?
c) Can children, whose parents don't belong to the "Y, "use the gym to play on Edgewater
teams ?
8. What are the rates charged by the "Y" and are there any additional charges above the
membership fees?
9. Of the $100,000 raised how does it break out, donations, membership pledges, etc?
10. Has anyone talked to the Alliance Church about using their gym for our basketball program
until Edgewater has it's own gym?
11. What has happened to the P.I.D. ? Will this industrial park be developed? This past year
the city had counted on a grant, which we lost, to develop this area. If that happens again this
year when will the P.I.D. be developed?
It is too early to make any decision on the "Y ". We need more information on costs to the city
and to the citizens of Edgewater, of the price of the building and facility and the cost of doing
business with the "Y ".
Bob Garthwaite
10 Lee Drive
Edgewater
428 -4490
City Council Workshop
RE; Proposed YMCA
#1 Why was this not put on the ballot,all citizens of Edgewater
should have a say into anything that will one way or another
affect us all.
#2 Why was the fifth graders and not the parents surveyed to
see who was interested and who would support and how many could afford
the $516 yearly membership fee.
#3 Why was we taxed 1 million dollars in this years budget for a
sport complex when very little interest has been shown for a sport
or YMCA complex. Where in the 1.5 million of lost and found funds
and why was this not used instead of additional taxes ?
#4. Who will pay to pave West Turgot? This street during thw school year
is one of the buisist.
#5 The other parks within the city have been vandalized to the
point that we ask why build more to be trashed by the teens in our city.
Frank Wells
141 Shangri La Circle
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INFORMATION ON VOLUSIA COUNTY CITIES
CITY — POPULATION FACIUTY STATUS
Edgewater 18,251 Proposed that Edgewater will:
City Clerk: 424 -4207 Donate Land to YMCA
Give $1 Million to YMCA
Give $50,000, possibly higher, for 5 yrs
toward YMCA operating expenses.
Maintain insurance on structure /property
Insurance on property /structure >$10k yr
City will also have to maintain liability
insurance...because if there is a severe
accident...usually everyone involved
gets sued shut gun cover liability.
Lawyers call this a shot -gun suit.
Daytona Beach 64,138 The Y on Derbyshire.
City Clerk: 676 -0311 Liaison is Leisure Services Department
The Y is WHOLLY owned and operated
by the YMCA
Deland 17,000 The YMCA is leasing a piece of property
City Clerk: 736 -3900 owned by the city. The YMCA has built
their own building and maintain it
themselves.
Deltona 58,000 No YMCA.
City Clerk: 407 - 860 -7160 They have a City owned swimming pool
DeBary Has YMCA
Main Number: 407 - 668 -7852 City offices have no information
407 - 774 -9622 Unable to reach YMCA administration
Holly Hill 1 1, 500 Recently broke ground on a $1.2 Million
City Clerk: 947 -4141 City owned building. No YMCA.
New Smyrna Beach 18,425 Decline YMCA involvement. The population
City Manager: 424 -2107 in this city is approximately the same as our
city, but with a tax base that is 3 times larger
than Edgewater. NSB priorities are to bring
money into city and work toward building an
industrial park.
Ormond Beach 33,500 The YMCA built on it's own land with
City Clerk: 676-0311 YMCA money. No city involvement.
Port Orange 45,000 The YMCA leases a city owned building
City Clerk: 756 -5213 which is on city owned property.
Oak Hill 1,082 3 city parks_ .leased to county and programs
City Hall: 345 -3522 _ are provided by the county
With YMCA Without YMCA
Capital Improvement
$2 Million $1.1 Million
Size of Facility
30,000 Sq. Ft. Facility 20,000 Sq. Ft. Facility
25 Yard Pool
Facilities
Gymnasium Gymnasium
Nautilus and Weight Nautilus and Weight
Room Room
Aerobic Room Aerobic Room
Day Nursery
Teen /Senior Center Teen /Senior Center
Steam /Sauna Room
Locker Room Facility Locker Room Facility
Co -ed Whirlpool
Racquetball Court Racquetball Court
Fitness Testing
Outdoor Pool (8 -Lane)
Programs
Basketball Basketball
Aerobics Aerobics
Swim Lessons
Nutrition Classes
Weight Management Weight Management
Senior Exercise Senior Exercise
Racquetball Racquetball
Fitness Evaluation
Arthritis Classes
Volleyball Volleyball
Dancing /Ballet /Jazz
With YMCA Without YMCA
Staffing
±8 Full -Time 2 Full -Time $58,000
10 Part -Time 6 Part -Time $62,000
Paid By YMCA 235,000 Paid By City $120,000
Maintenance Cost
Paid by YMCA $151,000 Paid By City $60,000
Insurance
Paid by YMCA $1 0,000 Paid By City $6,000
Hours
M -F 6:00 a.m. - 9:00 p.m. M -F 6:00 a.m. - 9:00 p.m.
Sat 9:00 a.m. - 6:00 p.m. Sat 6:00 a.m. - 6:00 p.m.
Sun 2:00 p.m. - 6:00 p.m. Sun
Construction Schedule
Design - 4 Months Design - 4 Months
Permitting - 2 Months Permitting - 2 Months
Construction - 10 Months Construction - 8 Months
Opening March 2000 Opening January 2000
User Fees
Monthly Rates Program Rates
Family $45.00 Racquetball $5 /hour
Youth $10.00 Weight Room $20 /month
Exercise Room $1 5 /month
Lockers $15 /quarter
Basketball $20 /program
With YMCA Without YMCA
Ownership of
Real Property
City City
Debt Service
None to City None to City
YMCA May Have
Debt on Loan
$48,000 /yr
Total Operating
Cost to City (Annual)
$50,000 $120,000
Non - Monetary
Benefits
Halifax Fish Wellness Center No
Business Attracting Facility ?
Educational Facility Yes
Community -wide Use ?
Better Programs No
Comparison of Facilities
ltir(RE A R )\ CEV IF YMCA
AREA SIZE / SQUARE FOOTAGE SIZE / SQUARE FOOTAGE
Total square footage of Building 162 y 1.34 21 .718 220 x 136 29,920
Gymnasium >�' , 4 4 ) 3r., 90 x 120 10,800
Aerobics Room 39 x 70 2.730
Nautilus Room 4 . ; >! :3 49 x 52 2.548
Locker Rooms — 2 per .. 38 x 38 2 ,888
Racquetball Courts — 2 per 20 x 40 1.600
Multi Purpose Room ,,;4, 34 x 43 1.462
Kitchen : u y ., 10 x 10 100
Teen Center ,,r) 28 x 38 L064
Day Nursery 20 x 38 760
Wellness Training Room 40 x 175 700
Offices — 5 per l 1 YES
Storage Rooms — 2 per ‘ YES
Whirlpool 8 , 8 64
Sauna — 2 per 6 x 8 q
Swimming Pool - heated 25 meter
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Volusianet LETTER TO THE EDITOR Printed: 10/28/98 3:05 PM
Date: 10/22/98 10:04 PM
From: dreg <dreg @volusianet.net>
To: observer @volusianet.net
Copy:
Subject: LETTER TO THE EDITOR
WHY A Y? SOME POINTS TO PONDER!
Opposing a YMCA is akin to opposing apple pie or motherhood. YMCAs have made many important contributions to
our society. Yet there remain several important questions regarding the potential YMCA in Edgewater that urgently need
answers.
First, and foremost, we need to ask why Edgewater is the only community that sees fit to support the YMCA with their
money? New Smyrna Beach is a far more affluent city than Edgewater, but they have steadfastly resisted making contributions
to the YMCA drives. Some claim that they may not understand the issue, or that it has not been explained to them adequately.
But that seems unlikely. New Smyrna Beach was involved in this matter from the beginning, long before Edgewater decided to
do anything about the YMCA. The crucial question is whether Edgewater should engage in this support in the absence of other
communities? If the YMCA is unable to convince other cities to support it, why should we?
A second question involves the site currently being considered for this YMCA. The West Turgot Avenue site is clearly
out -of -way for most of the people that the YMCA says it wants to serve. It is a splendid place for an Edgewater facility, but
hardly suitable for a multi- community recreational center serving 35,000 or more people, as Mr. Bostic claims it should do. The
earlier site on 10th Street was much more accessible and will become increasingly so as the widening of Mission Road is
completed. If Route 1 is also widened, that will make a 10th Street site even more accessible. Two such sites have been
considered. The first one, next to Christian Life Center, had been approved by both the YMCA and the church, and is, in fact,
described as the site for the Southeast Volusia YMCA in a brochure obtained from Mr. Bostic on June 17. A more recent 10th
street offer was made by the South Campus of DBCC. As far as I can see, the only reason the YMCA people are planning to
use this Edgewater site is that Edgewater says they will donate one million dollars.
This brings up a third question. So far, the discussion about the YMCA has centered on a building to be built using both
Edgewater and YMCA - provided money. Yet, there is much that needs to be done to make the Turgot site ready for any kind of
building. Besides, there are to be four ball fields, tennis courts, parking lots, etc, after the environmental problems are resolved.
Unless there have been additional funds earmarked for this venture, Edgewater will need to take this money out of the million
dollars designated for its recreational complex. This will drastically reduce the funds available for any building. Will the YMCA
make up this shortfall? So far, their fund - raising efforts have produced limited results. As noted at the Council Meeting on
Monday October 19, they have only raised about $100,000 thus far. Kindly note that the YMCA group has been attempting to
raise these funds for more than a year.
Perhaps there needs to be more deliberate consideration of these, and other, issues, instead of the euphoric
proclamations that have pervaded these discussions. To have or not have a Y is an important question. To be sure, a YMCA is
a noble idea, but what has been presented to Edgewater is much less noble.
Dr. Charles G. Gebelein,
Citizen of Edgewater
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