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02-09-2005 - Workshop CITY COUNCIL OF EDGEWATER WORK SESSION FEBRUARY 9, 2005 5:00 P.M. FIRE HALL - 2616 HIBISCUS DRIVE MINUTES ROLL CALL Mayor Donald Schmidt Councilman James Brown Councilman Dennis Vincenzi Councilwoman Harriet Rhodes Councilwoman Judith Lichter City Manager Kenneth Hooper City Clerk Susan Wadsworth Paralegal Robin Matusick Present Present Present Present Present Present Present Present INVOCATION, PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE There was a silent invocation and pledge of allegiance to the Flag. MEETING PURPOSE The purpose of the meeting was to hold a goal setting work session for FY2005-2006. The Planning and Zoning Board and Economic Development Board were also invited. City Manager Hooper made a presentation regarding the Land Development Code survey results from the survey that was on the web page. There were 351 responses, which is about 2% of the population and 4% of households. He asked Council if there was anything further they wanted staff to do. If they wanted to proceed further, they would need a Powerpoint presentation showing the problem areas, pictures of how to solve some of it and a listing of what some other local governments have done. If they weren't interested, they would like to have that direction or consensus now before they spend any more time on this. If they chose to do this, they would have another work session with a formal presentation. Councilman Brown mentioned readdressing abandoned cars and cars without tags. He would like to readdress vehicles that are sitting around rusting with grass growing up Page 1 of 1 Council Workshop February 9, 2005 around them. He doesn't receive complaints on boats and canopies. Councilman Vincenzi commented on the people that responded feeling strongly one way or the other. He feels they already have codes in place to handle most of the stuff. The only things they don't specifically address are canopies and carports. He brought this up the last time the Codes were developed and nobody wanted to act on them. He asked about having Codes for vehicles without tags. City Manager Hooper informed him we did. He also mentioned watercraft size and it being allowed to park in the front of your house as long as it isn't hanging in the right-of- way blocking the view. He then asked about having Codes for commercial advertising. City Manager Hooper informed him we also have codes for that. Some of these turn into a clarity issue of trying to make it clear. Councilman Vincenzi doesn't have a problem with someone that has a vehicle parked in their driveway with advertising on the side of their vehicle that drives back and forth to work. He isn't interested in pursuing anything. Mayor Schmidt referred to some of the responses of the survey. He spoke of having a lot of items in place that they need. He felt maybe it was time to hire another Code Officer that could ride around and find violations. He commented on all of the canopies that are out there. He feels what they have is good and they have worked hard to get the process going. Code Enforcement has been a problem for a long time. He again mentioned hiring another Code person that could lighten the load. He mentioned some of the phone calls he receives. He feels having a Police Officer assist with Code Enforcement is taking away from his duties as a Police Officer. There was a brief discussion regarding City workers assisting with Code Enforcement. City Manager Hooper commented on violations that are being turned in by some of the City workers. City Manager Hooper then commented on the Code Enforcement Boar working a magnitude what it had been. They are taking a very serious approach. The process is working. He commented on the Code Enforcement personnel being stretched. He suggested they look at this at budget time or mid-year budget review. He then commented on Florida Shores not having a homeowners association being a problem. Page 2 of2 Council Workshop February 9, 2005 Councilwoman Rhodes commented on the response to the survey. She mentioned people not saying anything but still having feelings on issues. She feels they have addressed it to the best of their ability the way the people of the City want it to be addressed. That doesn't mean things aren't going to pop up as they go along. City Manager Hooper mentioned a few instances that have popped up. Councilwoman Rhodes doesn't feel they need to look at this again. She feels they have a lot of other things that are a higher priority. Councilwoman Lichter mentioned this issue coming up every year for the past five or six years. She feels they have clearly written on paper what has to be done. She spoke on not being able to legislate aesthetics. She mentioned the City personnel that assist with reporting violations that they see to Code Enforcement. They have this in the books and she believes this is fair. Councilwoman Lichter feels there is a distinction with historic cars. She feels they have covered this thoroughly. She feels there are many more important things at the moment. City Manager Hooper stated the consensus of what he heard is to look at the Codes as far as the enforcement of what we currently have, study a little bit on the staff to see if we need another person for stronger enforcement and staff away through the tweaking or changing of the Codes. Councilwoman Lichter feels the extra person may well get taken care of once the animal shelter building is in place. She mentioned having two Animal Control people that help with Code Enforcement that are currently residing with Code Enforcement and being moved to the new animal facility. City Manager Hooper then made a presentation regarding Smart Growth Policies. He commented on moving strong to the south with an aggressive annexation policy that started a few years ago when Oak Hill made an effort to talk about annexing the U.S. #1 right-of-way. City Manager Hooper pointed out property the City has annexed to the south on U.S. #1, what will be developed on some of these properties and how Smart Growth applies. He mentioned having to do several types of infrastructure Page3of3 Council Workshop February 9, 2005 evaluations with regard to drainage. From our current City limits to Ariel Road, which is the area we are trying to reach, there will be a total of about 4,500 new units at build out. City Manager Hooper then spoke about the Urban Growth Boundary being discussed by the County to the west. The County has not opposed any annexations we have in this area and has said the City can annex anything in that area that you would create enclaves as long as the City serves those enclaves. The Joint Planning Area is us serving the water and sewer and we serve right now the Police and Fire with the Closest Unit Response to most of the area. Councilman Brown questioned the time frame for the build out of 4,500 new units. City Manager Hooper feels this is a twenty-year build out. A fair guess would be a fifteen - twenty-year time frame. Councilman Vincenzi mentioned leasing fire safety to the south on land that was donated from one of the developers. He asked about road improvements and other things like that. City Manager Hooper pointed out where the Police/Fire Station is located. The County is going to donate or lease for a $1 a year a place to build a pump station for water. Regarding reclaimed they are talking with the County. The Council will see in April the master plan for the road impact fees and they will be talking of the mass modeling of all the roads through the City. A majority of the work is done. They will be bringing this back to Council probably in April. Councilman Vincenzi asked what City Manager Hooper anticipated as far as results of the study. City Manager Hooper feels they are going to tell them they need more roads. They are going to tell them over the twenty-year plan to start looking at U.s. #1 as a six-lane road instead of a four-lane road. He mentioned improvements along Volco Road. Councilman Vincenzi asked about another north-south corridor. City Manager Hooper spoke on tying in Volco Road, going down to Beacon Light and along roughly the Airpark corridor. It will take it up to SR 44, across SR 442 and head south down to Volco and Beacon Light. Councilman Vincenzi stated he was eager to see the study. Page 4 of4 Council Workshop February 9, 2005 Mayor Schmidt commented on the four condominium projects the Council has been discussing. There was a discussion regarding proposed marinas with these projects. City Manager Hooper commented on the County dropping their manatee protection plan and letting the cities take over along the Indian River. He mentioned there being a formula with regard to the marina siting and manatee protection plan. The City has 450 boat slips minus the slips for the residential that exists. There is a number left over that can be divided. He commented on the difference between a public marina and a private marina. Mayor Schmidt expressed an interest in what the State's long-range plans are for u.S. #1. City Manager Hooper explained a four-lane to a six-lane conversion. He further commented on the plans for Roberts Road. He would like to see the planning started this year. Mayor Schmidt commented on the need for more traffic lights. He asked if the City's road impact money would be able to be used for that. City Manager Hooper informed him it could. He presented two options of how this could be handled. He mentioned this being standard in new development agreements. Councilwoman Lichter feels even if they had the ability to be in control of docks and boats, they also have the ability to say no. She worked very hard on the Indian River Task Force on the Manatee County rules and regulations, which didn't get passed at the State level. If they have identifiable manatee zones, she feels they should be more stringent. Just because they can, doesn't mean they should. Councilwoman Lichter then commented on Smart Growth. She feels they are dealing with enough condominiums and enough closeness. She would like to see some opportunity if someone wanted to have a horse. She mentioned taking County property, where there have been horses, and making those lots smaller. She feels they have to offer all kinds. City Manager Hooper commented on the western service area. He pointed out properties that are currently in the City. He further commented on the McCaskill and Snowden properties. The 2nd reading of the Snowden annexation is scheduled to come before Council on March 7th. He mentioned Page 5 of5 Council Workshop February 9,2005 there would be a comp plan amendment, land use change, rezoning and the development agreement. City Manager Hooper commented on a piece of the Snowden property that is being talked about to become a Town Center, and maybe a long-term, long range City Hall. There was a discussion regarding the Williamson Boulevard extension. Councilman Brown expressed concern with the conservation of the wetlands and watching this very closely. Councilman Vincenzi expressed concern with developers coming in and clustering everything together. He feels this is something everyone needs to be very conscious of. He isn't in favor of clustering. He is in favor of taking buildable property, using that acre and calculating density on it. He feels this is what everybody should be doing. Councilwoman Rhodes would like to focus on commercial development. She feels bringing in more people without more roads is not smart growth. Until they have another north south roadway and infrastructure, she doesn't feel they should be doing it. City Manager Hooper explained with the development comes the roads. He used Edgewater Harbor as an example. He mentioned the type of development being proposed having commercial that goes with the use. He also mentioned having a town center to accommodate the people moving into the area. Councilwoman Rhodes expressed concern with growth and building and having no jobs and no place to put the people. Councilwoman Lichter commented on having a rest area on 1- 95 due to the rest area in Port Orange being closed and there not being a rest area from way past Daytona all the way to Titusville. This would not bother her. A proper hotel/motel wouldn't bother her. A truck stop wouldn't bother her. She feels they should take the environment and wetlands and consider these an asset. They should be very cautious that they are giving it away to developers so they can put in more houses closer together. Councilwoman Rhodes stated the City of Edgewater doesn't own this land. The people that own the land should be granted reasonable use of their land and it should be Page 6 0[6 Council Workshop February 9, 2005 comparable with what everybody else in the City gets. She feels the City's focus needs to be industrial and commercial. City Manager Hooper agreed and explained why this can be difficult. He further commented on smart growth policies. Councilman Brown asked what road was further to the west and what it would tie into. Mr. Lear informed him it was the proposed Airport Road extension from Pioneer Trail, through Venetian Bay and south of SR 44. Mayor Schmidt suggested they pass around a microphone to the members of the Planning and Zoning Board to get their comments. The following members of the Planning & Zoning Board spoke: Pat Card estimated 33,000 people living along u.S. #1 and 21,000 people living in the western part of the City with a total of 54,000 people after build out of these two areas. He feels the build out will occur probably before the completion of a north-south road east of 1-95. This concerns him. He then expressed concern with not hearing anything about schools and developers not offering the sale of property to the School Board. He also commented on large developers and large tracts of land donating land. It still appears that Edgewater will remain a bedroom community, which is what it is now. He feels this should be looked at in terms of people rather than just houses. Sandy Jones agreed with Councilwoman Rhodes that they needed to be looking at not just commercial property but industrial property. If they don't raise the industrial tax base up, the homeowners are going to start feeling the crunch in their taxes. Robert Garthwaite agreed the City needs industrial. He commented on there being certain things they will need in these areas for services. He asked if the developers are donating any land to the City. City Manager Hooper stated they are either donating park land or paying impact fees. He has not heard from the School Board. He commented on the hefty impact fees being paid for schools. Mayor Schmidt asked City Manager Hooper to contact the School board and maybe invite a few of them to a workshop or invite them to a Council meeting and they devote twenty Page7of7 Council Workshop February 9, 2005 minutes or a half hour. This is exactly what Edgewater thinks is going to happen and kind of get first hand from them since they are the builders and the land purchasers and things like that. Just so we know we can see face to face and he knew from talking to some folks and some people lose one more spot and don't know where it is and money dedicated for an elementary school. We always hear about the high school and maybe we can get them one on one with us. Then we can kind of get an idea what they are thinking, they know what we are thinking and may be that will push the process a little bit. Just making sure that everybody is communicating and talking to each other. City Manager Hooper felt that would be very good. Mayor Schmidt stated that he knows Indian River has room to expand. They are about at seven hundred and twenty kids right now. He didn't think Edgewater Elementary had any room to expand. We are also at the seven hundred. He thinks it is important to get them together and let's talk to them and they can see the maps and the proposals and then may be they still decide that they need to do something with Joe developer or something like that. City Manager Hooper stated they could do that. Everything we have seen they have seen, every Comp Plan, every zoning. They are in the middle of an agreement that says this year if at all. Community Development Director Darren Lear stated he met with them several times and the interlocal agreement he is talking about, we have a Committee and he brought it to their attention that we have all this proposed development and asked them why it was taking so long for the middle school. Basically their answer was that growth has been stagnant in Edgewater for so many years so he started to list off all the proposed developments and they were wide eyed after that. He has been telling them but it's a good idea and he felt maybe they needed to come here. Mayor Schmidt stated he knows they don't like to build extra room when they build schools and they don't like to built it until it is to the emergency point where they have to build it. Maybe it is time to force the drink a little bit. Page 8 of8 Council Workshop February 9, 2005 Councilwoman Lichter wanted to know where the other elementary school was going. City Manager Hooper agreed to find out. Ed Vopelak agreed with Councilman Vincenzi. If people get saturated in these areas we are going to be so overwhelmed with people we won't know what to do. We have to be real careful about development. It reminded him of what happened in Edgewater Lakes, where we had some good acreage they were going to set aside for a golf course. He spoke of taking it out of the proposal, which would make a big change in the density in that area. He has seen it in many areas, particularly up north where local communities have been trying to develop and make land available to the community for public purposes. He didn't know if that could be something they could do or not but he would like them to consider it. He was in the water business for many years. He spoke of eventually being overwhelmed with black water. Todd Fuhrmann stated the developers are talking about doing this and what is their main type of people that are going to be moving into these areas. Is it going to be retirement or mostly working family homes? To him it seems like Florida is part of that role. He asked if that is what they were structuring towards? City Manager Hooper stated he didn't think so. He thinks most of the market is working families, what you see in the Florida Shores area. He further commented on people living here and commuting to Orlando. Mr. Fuhrmann stated the baby boom generation is getting ready to retire and we are going to get a lot of retirees. If everything is focused on them in thirty years it will be a ghost town. Christine Pluscec stated she was pretty much on the same page with what everybody was saying. She does not want to see 50-foot lots. She doesn't want to see the density crammed in. She thinks down the line they are going to be sorry. Right now not have all these clusters that are so close, that concerns her. She spoke of having enough schools and making sure there is Fire & Police. They also need to make sure they address traffic. That is a concern as well for her. They need to realize they are growing and be smart in what they are doing and making sure they don't Page 9 of9 Council Workshop February 9, 2005 pack everybody into certain places and shoot themselves in the foot down the line. Charlene Zeese stated ditto. She agreed with the whole picture. Let's not overbuild. She's not very happy with Edgewater Lakes because they took out the golf course and filled it up with small lots. She also expressed concern about schools and traffic. Doug McGinnis, Economic Development Board, informed the Planning & Zoning Board that on Monday night the New Smyrna Board had preliminary approval for three more communities that will bring the total number of houses between Samsula and 1-95 to 6,000. These will be clustered communities, village style communities. Much of this is proposed. He mentioned the real concerns of the board being water, traffic, schools, and hospitals. They went ahead and gave the approval because they said it aligned with what New Smyrna Beach was wanting to do to fill up their space, go westward and get the approval with what the Council was directing. He thinks it is refreshing to hear from this Council. Mayor Schmidt thanked everyone from the Planning & Zoning Board for coming. He asked the Economic Development Board to stay. Mayor Schmidt called a recess at this time. City Manager Hooper informed everyone that Shaun Warren of Johnson Controls was going to make a presentation by highlighting the Powerpoint Presentation she was going to go through. When they were done with that, she would talk about reclaimed rates. Shaun Warren, Johnson Controls, introduced Mike Wolf, Regional Manager and Bobby Gilbert who would be handling the installation of the project. Ms. Warren went through the attached Powerpoint Presentation with regard to the Performance Based Program. First she went over the results of the detailed study. She then went over the Residential Water Meters and the Reclaimed Water Meters. She then spoke of the detailed study that was done at the Wastewater Treatment Plant and the opportunities for efficiency improvements. PagelOoflO Council Workshop February 9,2005 Ms. Warren then went over Financing, the Cost and Payback Schedule, Implementation of the Project, and the Service Agreement. Councilwoman Lichter asked if the cost and the revenue we expect to accumulate cover the Johnson Control portion of the project. She asked if it was the total price. Ms. Warren stated it was the total project including the service agreement. Councilwoman Rhodes asked what they based the reclaimed water rates on when they came up with their figures. Ms. Warren informed her they worked with City Manager Hooper who came up with three different scenarios and they used the most conservative one. Mike Wolf, Regional Manager, commented on there being a requirement in Florida statues that governs performance contracting. That is what this program is essentially put together as and it requires a guarantee and that all of the costs be covered by the savings of the revenues that are generated through the program. It's a great way to implement a program so you don't have to go into Capital funds to try to implement a program. They want to achieve the benefits today rather than trying to implement them over time. They find their experience with municipalities are well intended about doing these type of upgrade programs and improvements but they don't have the capital. The idea of being able to do these in one program is very beneficial. Councilman Brown commented on the boxes and meters that are being replaced and will have to be raised and some of the businesses are going to reasphalt because they have sunk down. He asked who would absorb that cost. He doesn't see them doing this job with four mechanics and two people to replace all of the meters. Ms. Warren stated they tested every commercial meter in the City so they know exactly where they are and what they look like. The commercial meters are not going to be changed. They are going to be retrofitted. Councilman Brown stated he used to work for the water department and he knows what happens when you start changing out meters. Mr. Wolf commented on there being eight to ten small meter mechanics putting meters in and there will be two foremen. He further commented on the Page 11 of 11 Council Workshop February 9, 2005 roles of the Installation Team and what they do. Warren commented on the most important people on project. Ms. the Councilman Brown asked if the $6 million account for things that need to be fixed Ms. Warren explained the $6 million is a run into problems they absorb it. is taking along the set cost. into way. If they Councilwoman Lichter feels it will be a wonderful project and she feels they did a thorough job. City Manager Hooper informed her they would be voting on March 7th. Mayor Schmidt asked if the computer system we have now could handle this. Finance Director Jon Williams confirmed they have verified there would not be any problems with integrating the software. Mr. Wolf then commented on the software for the integration being included. There will be some formal training that will take place. He spoke of having the IT person on staff for the entire job because as they are getting to learn the system it is nice to have somebody there that knows the software in and out. Councilman Vincenzi asked how much revenue they were expecting to generate. Ms. Warren commented on having the breakdown by residential and reclaimed and the savings associated with each of the Wastewater Treatment Options. Councilman Vincenzi stated that he liked the plan and he liked the idea that the City is going to be collecting more money by making sure people pay for what they use. He had a problem with the fact that they are anticipating generating money on the refund part. He spoke of having some things to discuss over the next month. He is not for expanding the system with any more customers until they are sure that the problem is solved. Right now there are a quarter of the customers at the southwest end that don't have any pressure. Mr. Wolf commented on doing an internal management review to understand where there risks are because they guarantee the performance of this contract for the next fifteen years. If they come up short they owe the City money. They look at the balance of where the savings are coming from, where their risks are and then try to assess those so they have a balanced portfolio in savings relative to where the investments are going. He further commented on the Page 12 of 12 Council Workshop February 9, 2005 rate structure they use on the reclaimed water was more conservative than what staff may present. They feel pretty comfortable with the numbers they provided and they think there is upside to the City in terms of potential. They don't get to the revenues instantly over night but this program isn't designed for that kind of quick return. They have a year to get to the point to where they start paying for the program. Ms. Warren commented on the reclaimed meters being substantially less than residential meters. A substantially less amount of revenue is coming from those meters. She then spoke of taking a very conservative number and scaling it back on their side. Councilman Vincenzi commented on generating $500,000 possible cash flow. He wanted to know exactly what that meant. Ms. Warren explained every year for 15 years they are going to generate ex amount of savings. She further spoke of where the savings come from and structuring the payment schedule. Councilman Vincenzi asked if the $500,000 was the total project figure. Ms. Warren informed him that was correct. Councilman Vincenzi stated over 15 years they should be getting a possible $500,000 cash flow. Mr. Wolf explained they could change the term and finance it longer if they were interested in generating cash flow. Typically they find municipalities want to pay it off as quickly as they can and get beyond the debt. He also spoke on the payment schedule structure. City Manager Hooper commented on the improvements they would be getting. They would need less staff to read the meters. He spoke of the money they would generate if they had meters on the reclaimed water. He further spoke of the Wastewater improvements. The underwriter was telling them if the money were not there they would be writing the City a check. He spoke of the investment in the system. Mayor Schmidt asked who ultimately decides how much they save. City Manager Hooper explained they have a spreadsheet that says how much is going to be saved. He commented on them looking at our financials on a quarterly basis to make sure that savings is there. If that savings isn't occurring they start to react and the City starts to react. Dealing with them has been as clear as possible. Page 13 of 13 Council Workshop February 9, 2005 Councilwoman Lichter commented on reclaimed water being a conservation device. Councilwoman Rhodes commented on having less personnel and asked if they would have to hire workers in the future or that some of these guys would lose their job. City Manager Hooper confirmed they would not lose their jobs. They would be reassigned to do something else. Councilman Brown presented a scenario regarding in two years they show there is 2,000 people and they could put In another 1,000, he asked who would pay for the meters and installation. City Manager Hooper commented on the customer paying for it. Councilwoman Lichter asked how long the new meters last. Ms. Warren informed her the Census meters were the best meters on the market and their published warranty is twenty years. Councilwoman Lichter stated since they have now gone to every residential home in Edgewater and checked out the efficiency. Ms. Warren informed her they had checked every commercial meter. The residential meters they took a sampling. Councilwoman Lichter was wondering of the percentage that was working efficiently if they would be the last to be replaced. City Manager Hooper clarified all of the meters would be replaced because they are radio read meters. He further commented on the radio read meters. Mayor Schmidt asked City Manager Hooper what he needed from them. City Manager Hoper stated at this point for Council to tell him they are happy with that. He would sign a letter of intent and would be on the agenda coming back on the 7th. City Manager Hooper commented on the design and improvements and improvements to the water to the Southern Service Area. They have been bid and will be opened next Thursday at 2:00 p.m. He spoke of $650,000 worth of trunkline that move water into the further southern area to be able to solve that issue. City Manager Hooper commented on the reclaimed system. There are two purposes for reclaimed water. It is to get Page 14 of 14 Council Workshop February 9, 2005 rid of effluent disposal and they treat this at the Wastewater Plant and it becomes a commodity that has value. They get golden brownie points for the consumptive use permit. The more reclaimed water they use the less potable water they use. Councilwoman Lichter asked if the total Council understood what happens in terms of St. Johns. City Manager Hooper further commented on what the Consumptive Use Permit was. He then spoke of trying to use more reclaimed to reduce demand on the potable water system. City Manager Hooper further commented on being better able to manage the water supply. He then commented on how an agricultural analysis would be done. He spoke of using % of an inch of reclaimed water per week, which turns out to be about 10,000 gallons a month. He spoke of some customers using a lot more than that. The goal is to try to get all users between the range of 10,000 to 13,000. If they are at that range that is a fairly equitable distribution of that resource and is highly used in a conservation manner by the Water Management District. He then mentioned the people that use more reclaimed water having to pay for it. City Manager Hooper then presented three different options to Council on how to do the consumptive rate charges for the reclaimed water system. Councilman Vincenzi asked about the cost to do the improvements to the reclaimed water system to the southern part of Florida Shores being $600,000. City Manager Hooper confirmed it was $650,000 plus or minus. The City would pay for this out of impact fees. Councilman Vincenzi wanted a breakdown of how much was being made on reclaimed and how much was being made on potable water. City Manager Hooper agreed to present this at the March 7th meeting. Councilman Vincenzi stated there are months during the winter when they can't give away the reclaimed water fast enough so it is dumped into the river. He asked how many months that was. Environmental Services Director Terry Wadsworth informed him it depends on rainfall amounts. He spoke last year of having very little discard to the river. Page 15 of 15 Council Workshop February 9,2005 He also spoke of having increased storage now for rainy days or for supplementation. Councilman Vincenzi asked how many months they get a lot of complaints. Mr. Wadsworth estimated from the middle of April to the middle of June. Councilman Vincenzi felt if this is really for conservation, then they don't need to charge people extra. He further explained if they are trying to conserve and there are high usage months, why can't they implement the rates for only the high usage months. City Manager Hooper further explained as long as they can keep the people between 10,000 and 13,000 usage they spread out to more people and they are taking the demand off of the water supply. He then presented some options of during the heavy months getting the permit changed back into the lake so instead of wasting it and it going into the river, they would be putting it into a freshwater lake so they could withdraw it. Councilwoman Rhodes stated it doesn't matter what month it is. If they aren't using the water they aren't paying for it. Once the meters are in, they are going to pay for what they use. City Manager Hooper explained the only reason they are discharging into the river is because the system is broke. Once it is fixed and balanced they would have more customers and it would not be discharged. Environmentally it is an observation of what Council wants to do. Take on more customers to be able to spread this water around. Councilwoman Lichter commented on in a way they have been giving the water away. She spoke of there being very few cities that have reclaimed water. We are ahead of ourselves. St. Johns recognizes that. She wanted to know what other cities rates are and how they are doing it. She feels they have to fix it and can't charge people for what isn't working well. She spoke of the CUP coming up soon and she feels they have to think of what that means in our total water usage. Councilwoman Rhodes liked the idea of paying for what they use. She spoke of collecting rainwater. This is fast becoming the biggest problem in the State of Florida. They have to make some important decisions. She believes in Page 16 of 16 Council Workshop February 9, 2005 paying for what you use and if you are paying for it you should get it. She feels they have gone on far too long with people paying for water they aren't getting. Councilman Vincenzi again stated he wanted to see the figures. He wanted to see some good advertising about it for the March 7th meeting so the residents are aware it is coming up. He feels if they need to conserve they need to charge for the months they don't have it and charge the base rate of $10 the rest of the year. He feels they shouldn't be overcharged because they would be dumping the water anyway. Councilwoman Rhodes pointed out right now they can use 10,000 gallons and pay $10. When this goes into effect, they can use 9,000 gallons of water and pay less than $10. Councilwoman Lichter thinks bookkeeping would be extremely hard with what they are saying about constant rates. She spoke of the water being dumped into the river being used in a different manner. City Manager Hooper commented on using reclaimed water in the parks and medians and other areas that are public accessible. Councilwoman Rhodes commented on the people that are conscientious being rewarded. Councilman Brown confirmed the money that was borrowed to put the system together and having to make the payments. Will all three options make the payments? City Manager Hooper informed him they would. He commented on the difference between the three options. He will be bringing the three rate options to Council for more direction on March 7th of which option to advertise. Councilman Brown felt it appeared Option B would probably be the best option. He expressed concern with the number of people that go away and if the $3 base rate would pay for the system. City Manager Hooper commented on continuing this by issuing a letter of intent and bringing back the contract and the rates as well as additional backup on March 7th. There was a five-minute recess at this time. Page 17 of 17 Council Workshop February 9, 2005 City Manager Hooper then commented on Item D - 2005 Goals/Objectives with regard to the SR442 Corridor. He mentioned the gateway standards that have been adopted. They are going to take the SR 442 Corridor standards and run them along u.s. #1, particularly to the South where the new development is occurring. They have medians that will be landscaped as well as setbacks for monument signs and ground signs along that area. That will be done this year in the Land Development Code for the u.S. #1 Corridor. Leisure Services Director Jack Corder commented on the landscaping that would be done on SR 442 as well as the Welcome to Edgewater signs. Councilwoman Lichter asked if it would be possible to get no littering signs on SR 442 as well. City Manager Hooper commented on talking more on Monday night to the Chief and pushing him to actually write littering tickets. Councilwoman Lichter commented on the bumper sticker she had on the back of her vehicle that gives the phone number for the Police Department for people to report people they see littering. She commented on the money that is paid to the County to clean up u.S. #1 on SR 442. She felt if they cut back on the littering they could cut back on the money paid to the County. Councilwoman Rhodes commented on businesses adopting some of the medians. City Manager Hooper commented on it being a matter of timing and all of the projects they currently have going on. Assistant City Manager Liz McBride made a presentation about ParkTowne with regard to what is going in there and where it is going. City Manager Hooper commented on the property that is left and what they are planning to do in the future. He spoke of starting with 160 acres and by the time they take out road right-of-way and drainage, there are about 110 to 120 of saleable acreage. Quite a bit of that is sold. Councilwoman Lichter asked about speaking to the college and they said maybe there could be some training courses offered at the college to help some of these new employees. She asked City Manager Hooper if he saw any of these new Page 18of18 Council Workshop February 9, 2005 industries being able to request some type of training. City Manager Hooper stated the answer was a very strong yes. Councilwoman Lichter then mentioned the roadway to go to the college. City Manager Hooper commented on some issues they are having and this portion not being developed yet. Councilman Brown asked about how long it would be before they started seeing a tax base. City Manager Hooper informed him they started seeing some of it last year. Everything they sold went on the tax rolls. He spoke of it increasing every year. Every time a new structure is built it is about 18 months before it goes on the tax roll depending on the time of year. Councilman Vincenzi asked if City Manager Hooper was glad they decided not to sell the 20 acres. He asked if they have contracts on them that say they are going to buy. City Manager Hooper informed him they also put down a 10% deposit. He spoke of giving them a survey. They have 90 days after the survey to say it works for their intended purpose and then a closing date is scheduled. Councilman Vincenzi expressed concern with some of the businesses with the exception of Boston Whaler not really bring in a whole lot of new jobs. City Manager Hooper commented on it being too early to know what jobs are going to be created. Councilman Vincenzi commented on the County advertising with signs and billboards. He asked if they were advertising outside the County also. City Manager Hooper explained they have a website and brochures they send out so they are advertising County facilities as well as ours. Councilman Vincenzi felt any exposure helps. He would prefer it outside the County. Councilman Vincenzi commented on Bob Lott bringing up there seems like there are a lot of entities that are duplicating efforts. There needs to be more concentrated efforts. He felt it would be more efficient to combine or team up with whoever is doing any initiatives and really concentrate on marketing and advertising. City Manager Hooper further commented on the marketing efforts by various entities. Page 19of19 Council Workshop February 9, 2005 Councilman Vincenzi mentioned meeting and getting all the entities together to talk to find out what can be done to consolidate their efforts. City Manager Hooper commented on the Summit that would be held with other Southeast Volusia cities and the Economic Development Board at the college that will be sponsored by the Chamber to focus group effort on ParkTowne. Councilman Vincenzi commented on this consisting of a lot of political entities. He was talking about people who have an interest in Edgewater. City Manager Hooper commented on the concept being what is good for anyone of the cities in the Southeast being good for the others. City Manager Hooper commented on the residential and non- residential uses coming into Edgewater. Bob Lott, Economic Development Board, commented on the railroad wanting 20 acres in ParkTowne for $71,000. He expressed concern because a lot of work was put into the development of ParkTowne and a lot of people did a very good job. We have 20 acres of prime, commercial property and he didn't want to see it become a buffer zone between the railroad and ParkTowne. Mr. Lott then commented on trying to sell property in ParkTowne. He wondered why they put out a request for proposal for commercial realtors to come in and take our industrial park and advertise it nationwide. He would like to see some movement on that. City Manager Hooper commented on advertising twice for a commercial broker to sell the property. He only had one response and the gentleman described he was the wrong guy for the job so they advertised again. Mr. Lott again brought up selling the 20 acres to the railroad. City Manager Hooper mentioned this being optional. Tom Hamel 1 , Economic Development Board, stated they haven't had a meeting now for over a year with their counterparts at the Chamber, Port Orange and New Smyrna. He spoke of when they were talking about the possibility of their joint venture in terms of putting together materials that would help support what each and everyone of them has to sell. They don't need to compete with each other. The County too Page 20 of 20 Council Workshop February 9, 2005 has come forward and offered to help them develop the park. He spoke of putting together a survey in cooperation with DBCC that is going to be conducted among 200 plus business in Edgewater targeting those that are marketing and whether there is greater opportunity for expansion. The Marketing and Statistics class at DBCC is going to be conducting the study for them over the next month. As a result of that they will get very specific information about what Edgewater businesses see as their needs, what kinds of jobs they see the possibility of creating and what types of educational efforts they might be held by. Doug McGinnis, Economic Development Board, spoke of working on a program with the Education and Editorial Board and feeling it is very important to get outreach media to give them the message of Edgewater that not only is Economic Development possible but how great the community is as well as some of our new features such as the amphitheater. He suggested they invite the media to have a luncheon. They can also make contact with magazines and newspapers throughout Florida and outside so they can drop articles on Edgewater all the time. It is a lot cheaper than buying ads. He spoke of making relationships now and keeping the promotional effort ongoing. Mayor Schmidt stated a couple of weeks ago they were talking about DBCC doing an amphitheater in Deltona and using part of the City Hall site for it. They compared it with Port Orange's amphitheater but yet here we are sitting with an amphitheater and there was no mention of it. It is a matter of getting the word out. From what he understands our amphitheater is bigger, we just don't have a cover yet. City Manager Hooper then presented an update on City Hall. He described a scenario where they could take the current City Hall and gut as much of it as possible to accommodate a five to seven year stay. He then spoke of ideas that have been brought forth regarding dedicating public land for a town center concept out by SR 442 and 1-95. City Manager Hooper commented on having the bank come back to him and ask him if he would be interested in creative financing. He could tell them a deal on how they could get there but he thinks at this point it has been to the citizens twice and they said no. Clearly if he were to recommend to Council a way for them to buy it, it wouldn't Page 21 of21 Council Workshop February 9, 2005 be very smart for them to do. They are at the point of not doing anything other than spending some money. Councilwoman Rhodes didn't think the citizens would object to it if they could do it without raising taxes. Councilwoman Lichter likes where City Hall is and feels it is the most unique site on the river. City Manager Hooper commented on the issues with the existing City Hall building. There was a discussion regarding the mold and fungus and things that could be done to correct the issues in order to stay at the existing City Hall for five years. He spoke of building a new one on dedicated property in seven years. Councilwoman Rhodes feels they need to have a vision of what they want the existing City Hall to be after five years. City Manager Hooper commented on that being what they are doing by gutting it, leaving it open and putting in partitions so it becomes an open space. City Manager Hooper was looking for Council consensus on what he has described. Councilwoman Lichter commented on land on Park Avenue becoming available on its own and they won't need to take the two residents. She spoke of the City Hall in Ormond also being on the river. Mr. Hamell stated City Hall is an economic development consideration. He has had two developers in City Hall meeting with staff from the Atlanta area. They are very interested in the prospect of building a hotel and other facilities. They took one look at City Hall and said this is City Hall? It doesn't help them in terms of looking like a forward-looking progressive community. It is a major liability. In spite of that, they are still interested because they see the long-term possibilities in the community. The impact is not positive. City Manager Hooper then presented an update and status on the Animal Shelter. He spoke of having the Pet Society as the policy makers of how the facility will actually work. He then spoke of having a paid director to run the facility as well as volunteer assistance. He spoke of putting the Animal Control facility there. He further commented on the concepts being pretty straightforward. He estimated the building would cost $400,000 to $500,000. Page 22 of 22 Council Workshop February 9, 2005 City Manager Hooper then commented on conversations with the School Board to be able to use students who could get credits for helping at the shelter. City Manager Hooper then commented on the bank loan for the Animal Shelter. Councilman Brown commented on the FFA at the Middle School getting grants from the Federal and State governments for that. There is enough property there that instead of having the animals at the school maybe they could work out a deal where they would lease property from the City at the Animal Shelter and keep their animals over there. City Manager Hooper stated he has had some success about locating different grants that the City would be eligible for. He spoke of having early talks with the County. The County has more animals than it can take to the two Humane societies so they have voiced an interest in being a partner and paying for the oversizing of this. He made it clear that the Edgewater residents were paying for this and if they wanted more space they would have to write a check. City Manager Hooper then commented on a new Fire Station and Police Station. He spoke of the two acres that has been dedicated and identified in front of the hospital. He predicted this would be four or five years unless they did some financing or some other type of mechanism that is not pledging tax. He spoke of the goal being to make it a shared facility. Councilwoman Lichter asked if they were talking just an administrative building and questioned if they would need a substation for fire coverage down south. City Manager Hooper explained it's not just administrative. It would be a Fire and Police Station. They would be adding a facility that shares Police and Fire administration. There was a discussion regarding the equipment and personnel needs and costs for a new station. Councilwoman Lichter questioned if there was any cooperation or confirmation from the County when they are down that far. City Manager Hooper spoke of the City currently serving outside the City and being paid to do that. Page 230[23 Council Workshop February 9, 2005 Leisure Services Director Jack Corder presented an update on the Recreational Facilities. He commented on looking at addressing future needs and how they are going to design Kennedy Park. He spoke of one aspect they are looking at being to have a Regional Shuffleboard Facility with New Smyrna. They are looking to have a passive, boating, park at Kennedy Park. He also mentioned building a Shuffleboard Park at either Rotary or at Kennedy. Councilwoman Lichter questioned the Shuffleboard people being receptive. Mr. Corder informed her that some were and some weren't. There was a discussion regarding a location that was discussed being behind the Regional Library on Live Oak in New Smyrna, the old City gym. There is enough land to build a Regional Shuffleboard Facility there. Councilwoman Lichter asked if they could find out what the objections are and maybe they could address some of their concerns. Mr. Corder mentioned it not being an objection but an identity crisis. Councilwoman Rhodes asked how many courts New Smyrna has. Mr. Corder informed her 16. Councilwoman Rhodes asked if they went with New Smyrna how many courts they would be looking at? Mr. Corder informed her a minimum of 24. Councilwoman Rhodes expressed concern with only adding 8 courts and doubling the amount of people. Mr. Corder commented on the number of members going down in the Shuffleboard Club. The last report he had they only had 68 members in the Club from our City. Councilwoman Lichter guessed if it was a star facility, something very special that these kinds of things could be worked out. She spoke of moving any place other than on the river is upsetting. They kind of said they were looking at Rotary Park and it kind of stayed in their heads because that is what they said. She felt they should come up with something very special. Mr. Corder mentioned the Shuffleboard Club being well aware and that they had been discussing this long before. Councilwoman Rhodes asked about getting insurance money for the reconstruction of the shuffleboard courts. City Manager Hooper informed her the City would be receiving Page 24 of 24 Council Workshop February 9, 2005 insurance money as well as FEMA money. FEMA will not give them any money until the City tells them they are going to rebuild. City Manager Hooper questioned if he was hearing that they should ask the Club what they want. Councilwoman Lichter suggested he present the positives of going together. City Manager Hooper presented two options of what they could do regarding a facility. Mr. Corder informed Council they would be coming back with a redesign of Kennedy Park. Mr. Corder then presented an update on Hawks Park. They applied for an ECHO grant and a FRDAP grant for additional restroom facilities there. He spoke of the park being done in three stages. Councilwoman Lichter would like to put Edgewater on the map with something very special at Hawks Park. She then spoke about getting the cover for over the outdoor stage. City Manager Hooper informed Council of this being the list of what he saw as their goals and what they have been working on and a continuation of that effort. He informed them now was the time to distinguish what they wanted to see specific and if there was anything additional they wanted to add. Councilman Brown mentioned the School Board land of 30 acres on Mango Tree Drive. He would like for them to see about possibility getting a grant to buy that property. He spoke of this being an environmentally sensitive area that he would like to see made into a City park. Councilman Brown stated next to it the county has a dumping area where they dump dirt. They need to see if they can get them to trade us off for some land elsewhere to put that dirt. Councilman Brown then spoke about the containment area at FIND. They can use that area for a park or whatever they want to do with it. He suggested the possibility of putting in a BMX bicycle park. Councilman Brown asked the Council to allow him to continue research on the island protection to find out what if Page 25 of 25 Council Workshop February 9, 2005 anything they should be doing out there. He spoke of doing grant research to see if there is a grant available for this. He feels they need to look at protecting the islands now. City Manager Hooper agreed to come up with a list for the Council could go over and decide what they want staff to spend time on. Councilman Vincenzi wanted to see more planning for the City. He would like a clear vision of what is coming up. He wanted to know what City Manager Hooper was planning for the next ten or fifteen years. Mayor Schmidt commented on wanting sidewalks and streetlights. Councilwoman Rhodes commented on economic development with regard to bringing in more commercial. She then commented on the beautification of SR 442. She also mentioned the reclaimed water problem. She doesn't want people paying for something they aren't getting. Councilwoman Lichter wants to see the Animal Shelter/Adoption Center as quickly as possible. She spoke of what the Pet Society has done with regards to taking care of these animals for three years. Councilwoman Lichter agreed with Mayor Schmidt as far as streetlights. She still feels they need a streetlight by the Post Office, which is still a problem. Councilwoman Lichter would like to see the continuation of beautification. She also mentioned more involvement with citizens to serve on City Boards and Committees and not enough people knowing the truth about what is going on. Councilwoman Lichter also commented on watching and controlling growth. She expressed being pleased with what the City looks like today compared to what it looked like thirteen years ago when she moved to the City. Councilwoman Rhodes commented on street signs. She spoke of stop signs that were been knocked down during the hurricanes. She also mentioned there still being debris in some places and she knows this takes time. Page 26 0[26 Council Workshop February 9, 2005 City Manager Hooper spoke of starting the budget process with regard to the new HTE Software. He spoke of struggling this year like they have never struggled before. We have not received the first penny from FEMA. We have a about $4 million in checks to write for trash pick up and other things related to the hurricane. FEMA hasn't even accepted the first reimbursement. They keep changing rules and staff going through the process. He spoke of the budget being a strange one to see. City Manager Hooper further commented on FEMA nickel and diming us to death. He didn't expect this game to end soon. City Manager Hooper stated he knows Council has told him clearly they would like to see roll back. He understands that as a mission but it is going to be very hard to get to. He spoke of there being a lot of unknowns. It is going to be a very tight year. City Manager Hooper also commented on looking to refinance the City's debt. ADJOURNMENT There being no further business to discuss, the Workshop adjourned at 8:45 p.m. Minutes submitted by: Lisa Bloomer Page 27 of27 Council Workshop February 9, 2005 ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ :3 = ~ ; = ~ ~ ~ c= 00 ~ ..... rI:l N ~ o Q. o ~ Ul ~ o ()'Q ~ ~ e P ,,\ ~. ~ '-~':.'-:;~'C'.' ,~i ;-~';?" - - ,. ,~..':~'~.' """ -. ". .....'.' ~ ... ',. 'S' lIS' ~ ~. _._i~'~. ~1.. ;~. ~ :..~;:-JL;S- , '~ -1" -, L~'" .~.".:..~.' ~.. .' '.. . ,,-"'.-' , :' ~ ~ . ~~.. ~ '~'" ~ ~' ""'" ,!t \ '" ~)~' ~... ~.~ -- ~ .' o ~ D ~. ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ =: ~ ~ ~~~ ~ ~ =: ~ ~ ~ ~ ... ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~. ~ ,'iF ~!6..1 * )~-"...J. ~~ <;~..~~. "~. ~ c "I; ~ ~ ~ = ~ = ae =" "'C ~ g rJj rJj 0 ~(1Q~~~ ~ 0 0 ~ ~ ~ ~ =- o ~ ~ ~ = ~ ~ ~ rJj = ~ ~ Q. (] ~ ;- 0 ~ ~ Q. ~ ~ ~ =- ~ Q. ;- o. rJj = ~ r:IJ = Q. ~ > rtQ ~ = Q. ~ . . . I~ ""~ = ~ .. (IIIIto. I W o ~ e"g ~ ~ ~ ~ = = ~ ~ ~ .. 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