05-13-1991 - Special
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CITY COUNCIL OF EDGEWATER
SPECIAL MEETING
MAY 13, 1991
MINUTES
Mayor Wessler called the meeting to order at 7:00 p.m. in the Community Center.
ROLL CALL
Mayor Tanya Wessler
Councilman Kirk Jones
Councilperson Louise Martin
Councilperson NoraJane Gillespie
Councilman Michael Hays
Interim City Attorney Nikki Clayton
Acting City Manager Fred Munoz
City Clerk Susan Wadsworth
Police Chief Lawrence Schumaker
Present
Present
Present
Present
Present
Present
Present
Present
Present
Review additional information re: LDRA's recommendation to annex 450 acres West
of U.S. 1, 9/10ths mile South of Roberts Rd. to be used as manufactured home and
Qolf community - Mr. Munoz stated certain staff members will speak on impact,
they are not lobbying for this annexation, but feel for long term good of the
City it.s worth annexation. He noted long term growth is to the West and South
and to the South is the path of least resistance. He said growth is expected
to take place in Cape Canaveral and they feel annexation is a worthwhile effort.
Police Chief Schumaker stated the department's position is a positive view for
annexation on the most part because of two main factors, financial and morale.
He said on financial the planning board indicated monies received from annexation
would amount to about $100,000 for the Police Department which would allow them
to obtain two officers and related equipment to enhance police coverage on the
South side of the City and the golf course project would not require a police
officer 24 hours a day, 7 days a week, it would be similar to calls for service
at Edgewater Landing and for that amount of people it's very low. He referred
to higher morale with growth and organizational chart changes that will allow
hard working officers to view working for the department as an opportunity to
advance in a promotional system. He referred to pride in the department for the
past 5 years and gaining the new Police Department which was the Library. He
suggested if they choose not to annex, many of the related problems, i.e.,
traffic, accident investigations, etc., will still be a responsibility in that
end of the City and they.ll receive no funds or ability to hire officers if it's
not considered. He added they'll face many of the problems that more people
bring if they don't annex then if they do, and if they do they'll receive enough
funds to implement new officers to handle those services.
Fire & Rescue Chief Bill Vola stated compared to Edgewater Landing this has
similar style development and they1re averaging 80 units a year in development
and he's estimating 80-90 or more for the new annexation. He said current
funding levels equate to $32 per capita in the community and Edgewater Landing
directly impacts by $5,600 approximately which is an expense for providing
services to that community and the new development would be 200 people a year
and roughly an increase of $6,200 a year based on $32 per capita. He explained
the amount of calls for service is low and the majority comes from the South-
west section and Florida Shores. He reviewed response time and noted the City
has property at 35th and Mango Tree that was suggested for a fire station site
but in the Comp Plan that property was earmarked for a park and is not a good
fire and rescue station location because it's in the heart of a residential area
and there's no access to the main arteries. He explained annexation would be
on Volco which would be paved access to U.S. 1. He said it doesn't appear to
have a great deal of negative impact on providing fire and rescue services and
it1s a logical expansion for the community.
Utilities Director Terry Wadsworth said he looked at revenue provided by the
City's providing water and sewer services to the development over its build out
period. He said they assumed 8 new units a month starting about October, 1992,
which would run it through about August, 1999, for complete build out. He said
with impact fees and connection fees plus charges for services with the rate
increases included would generate about $2,691,000 of water and sewer revenue.
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Review additional information re: LDRA's recomendation to annex 450 acres
(Continued) Mr. Wadsworth pointed out some advantages to serving a project such
as this is close proximity of housing with meters close together and water lines
to service and minimal maintenance expenditures to keep the system up and running
and on line. He said there's a possibility if the project is developed in the
County we could still serve them if that would be Council's decision and water
service would have a 25% surcharge and we'd would end up with $1.3 million. He
said there's a question if the City would provide sewer and they're working on
an agreement with the County to provide service for the area but cannot assume
weill provide services to that area so it's $1,361,000 difference if the
development's in the City or if they serve it as an entity outside the City.
He pointed out this project's reuse potential noting it's also a necessity for
the golf course and we could charge for the service of providing it to them.
He said from the economic point of view they should look at serving it within
the City as far as the revenue strength from the Utilities point of view.
Parks & Recreation Director Jack Corder stated his department will serve these
people with a development of this size and its location either way. He noted
we're the closest recreation department and have the facilities and programs so
whether annexed or not weill service these people. He said there's a range of
impact fees for recreation from around $212,000 to $227,000 that could be
collected if it were annexed. He explained it addresses certain elements of the
Comp Plan but we still have 4-5 years to negotiate elsewhere. He noted we're
serving people as far away as Ariel, Cow Creek, Ragis, and Old Mission and charge
a $3.00 fee for non-residents but it doesn't cover maintenance of facilities
provided free to the public. He said exhibit A in the development agreement
shows park areas inside the development and should be more clearly defined and
at what phase the golf course could be developed if the agreement's set forth.
He explained he1s working with the County now for an interlocal agreement for
recreation areas for services both ways and it will come to Council in the future
but they don't have definite figures on it now.
Public Works Director Carl Overstreet stated refuse is paid as you use it and
they'd have to build out about half way through the project before it would have
an impact on refuse and with normal growth of the City and Edgewater Landing and
this project he could take up what's going on in the next 1-1/2 years with no
additional personnel or equipment and at build out it's about 2/3 of a truck for
650 homes. He stated stormwater is mi n ima 1 impact accord i ng to the project
design and it would be additional income and perhaps help him get an extra person
in that department. He stated with Streets, from the time the City accepts the
project they're looking at 10 years before they have an appreciable output of
funds. He said in talking with the developers from a safety point of view they
agreed to give us an entrance off 35th Street and that would keep us from having
to take the equipment and trucks out on U.S. 1 and back into the project. He
said they have no major impacts for the first 3 years.
Planning & Zoning Director Mark Karet stated from the Planning Department' s
perspective the most important reason for support is they see the Southern area
being the area where growth will occur, Publix is developing there, and Surrey
Ridge will be going in shortly. He said they feel it's better that growth occur
inside the City rather than outside since it will impact us and we might as well
have the revenue. He said this golf course development with home sites will
generate in excess of 10,000 round trips on our roads and it wi 11 increase
problems the Police Chief faces but they won't be paying any revenues if they're
not inside the City. He added if we don't have this annexation, we won't have
access to ones that will occur farther South. He stated the issue was brought
up about the franchise agreement with the County and Triangle Refuse, which is
a subsidiary of Consolidated Tomoka, and he talked with the President of Triangle
Refuse Service, James Cinelli, and they discussed this annexation and its status
and he i nd i cated because it IS undeve loped property, it I S not covered by the
franchise agreement and would have no impact regarding his agreement with the
County. He said if it was developed property, there'd be concern about it. He
said there were questions about people in the enclaves and those people who are
not affected by this annexation would be free to keep land uses they have since
they are not in the City, and if they were brought into the City they'd be
allowed to continue with whatever use exists on their land unless we make an
effort to change it and that would be duly noticed to them and they'd have an
opportunity to object.
2
Council Special Meeting
May 13, 1991
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Rev;ew add;t;ona 1 ;nformat;on re: LDRA IS recommendaHon to annex 450 acres
(Continued)
Harv;n Clark stated this project is of no value to investors, people who looked
at it for a future project, without the golf course which will be in the first
phase. He said if they decide the overall concept is acceptable, the first phase
would come in about the middle of the project. He said New Smyrna Beach did a
feas i b il ity study and found they cou 1 d use two go 1 f courses and he fee 1 s
Edgewater is a prime spot for a golf course. He pointed out they aren't looking
at this as a private golf course, he doesn't think they could depend solely on
people in the community to support it, but it would be semi-private open to play
and members will have preferential tee time. He said income of this project
has been a concern and they've spoken with staff and feel they've come as close
as they can with numbers and are willing to work with the City and the income
stream from the golf course will allow the City to take a closer look at them.
Al Keaton reviewed the impact and permit fees, annual fees and assessments at
build out, and ad valorem breakdown. (Copies attached)
Mary Hansen, Attorney with Storch & Hansen, explained the difference on tags
between manufactured housing and mobile homes, noting when it becomes fixed to
the property it becomes real estate, and they're figuring this on mobile home
tags. Mr. Clark stated they'll do a lot of things like Edgewater Landing and
Hacienda Del Rio, adding it1s good planning to keep mobile and manufactured homes
in that same area. He pointed out Edgewater Landing and Hacienda have the river
and his project will have the golf course. Councilperson Gillespie referred to
HB 1178 changing it to real property, noting we're one of the counties that
doesn't charge real property if you don't own the land. Councilperson Martin
stated they passed it and it's effective 1/1/92 and it has to be owned property.
Councilperson Gillespie reviewed the maximum amounts of $80 per half for tags
with what the State gets and what comes to us. She said cable TV shows 2 per
res i dence and she assumes that wou 1 d be 1 connect i on. Mr. Keaton exp 1 a i ned
that's the percentage the City gets now.
Councilperson Gillespie asked if held talked with Mr. Morgan about taking gas
down there and added she and Mr. Ewing talked with Mr. Keaton about the bike path
and other facilities that will be public. She expressed concern with enclaves.
Ms. Hansen stated she talked with the County about the 55 acres to the North
and she had a unanimous consensus it wasn1t the kind of enclave they want to
challenge. She explained under Chapter 171 only the County can challenge an
enclave and only has 30 days to do so. She said they went to LDRA and reaffirmed
that today at the administrative rezoning work shops. Councilperson Gillespie
asked about further enclaves because they just released for the Baptist Church.
Ms. Hansen replied one of the reasons they have the anti-enclave language in
Chapter 171 is they don't want to cut off the underlying jurisdiction from being
able to get there and she understands there's no problem with access to those
3 parcels on each side of the church. Councilperson Gillespie and Ms. Hansen
briefly discussed the Bella Vista request and the County1s position.
Councilperson Gillespie asked about the wildlife biologist's certification on
the land for the scrub jay. Mr. Clark replied he had someone from Orlando and
they agreed with the flagging and they had it surveyed and he's forwarding those
to different agencies.
Councilman Jones said he feels this will be a worthwhile project and regardless
of whether we do it or not, our City will be impacted and he feels there are
more pluses than minuses.
Councilperson Martin stated at the May 6th meeting she thought this application
was withdrawn and asked if they reapplied. Mayor Wessler replied it was never
officially withdrawn. After brief discussion, Councilperson Gillespie asked Ms.
Hansen if they voluntarily withdrew it and they1re reconsidering. Ms. Hansen
replied yes. Councilperson Martin stated she talked with Phil Giorno today and
he had no notion about this annexation and the possibility of the County taking
it over and he said if it was not annexed in the future, they'd have to provide
water and seer but there were no immediate plans to take over any part of the
annexation. She asked Mr. Clark if property will have manufactured houses put
on it and it will be furnished and rented out as a deal with the golf course.
Mr. Clark replied homes will be available for a buyer through the developer and
will be put on the site and the site will be leased to the buyer and they will
be manufactured homes as Hacienda is. Councilperson Martin stated she has
3 Council Special Meeting
May 13, 1991
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Review additional information re: LDRA1s recommendation to annex 450 acres
(Continued) nothing against manufactured homes but her concern is the City get
all the tax money it can which it won't do on rented property as far as ad
valorem taxes are concerned. Mr. Clark said he doesn't disagree but the typical
home in Florida Shores will not generate as much money as this manufactured home
when you consider amenities and if you take the income stream and add what
they'll bring to the City they'll see these homes will generate as much income
as a $90,000 home. Councilperson Martin said in looking at other golf course
homes, people who use it will have to pay extra fees to carry the golf course
if it doesn't have enough use. Mr. Clark explained they cannot afford to charge
higher rates and feel they can pre-sell every membership between Edgewater and
New Smyrna Beach. Councilperson Martin stated she was told about 5% of any city
will play golf and she hopes it will support the golf course.
Mayor Wessler stated she spoke with Phil Giorno on Saturday and also to Big John
at VCOG and he has no objection to its coming into the City and these people will
use our facilities and roads and they'll be there whether or not we say they can
annex. She pointed out it's better to get something than nothing and weill have
input into the development, but if they stay in the County we may not have that.
She explained if we connect these people rate increases over the next 4 years
may be kept down. Mayor Wessler asked a member of the audience to speak at the
end of the meeting instead of at this point. She referred to erroneous inform-
ation circulating about the project going away if not annexed, but it will not.
Mr. Clark stated they feel it's a good project and the best place is Edgewater
and haven't pushed to the County and he doesn't want to do that but he doesn't
want an attitude of they'll do it anyway, they want to work with the City first.
Councilman Hays stated at the annexation presentation the tone was if you people
don1t want to do it, the County will, and sometime when you start with that
attitude they donlt progress well. There was discussion on prior dialogues
regarding stick built homes rather than manufactured homes. Mr. Clark stated
with stick built homes there's a problem with absorption rate and they can't
afford the capital investment and then wait for typical absorption for a stick
built home as it's not cost effective. Councilman Hays asked if they feel
theylll build out quicker than with stick homes. Mr. Clark said yes. Councilman
Hays asked if this project fails in the middle, they all know economy they're
facing now, will bonding cover it. Mr. Clark said sure, and explained in the
agreement with the golf course developer they make all contractors have perform-
ance bonds and they're 110% bonded and if something does take place then the City
or whoever is the assignee can come in and take over to complete it.
Councilman Hays asked if the City should look at enclaves and make them part of
the annexation, consider this as an addendum, and you don't have to change
zoning. Mayor Wessler suggested they look at it in the future. Councilman Hays
said if they have a golf course they have to water it and he doesn't think reuse
water is an issue whether or not they go for the annexation and Edgewater with
the CIP will be the prime provider and it would be the best method for them to
use. Mr. Clark stated they need water and treated and secondary water could
save on fertilizer. He said they talked to the County about water and if the
City doesn1t want them, then they may have a possibility elsewhere. He added
even if it doesn't come into the City held be willing to talk about the water.
Councilman Hays asked if golf packages will be included for week-ends and week-
days for a vacation. Mr. Clark replied he doesn't ever foresee that and
clientele he hopes they'll have would take care of that. Ms. Hansen stated deed
restrictions will be part of this subdivision, it's early to start developing
it, they need to do it to help keep prices of properties up and they don't want
to see a lot of transient clientele. She added they can make the City able to
enforce deed restrictions that would make it that kind of single family house.
Councilman Hays asked if they plan to complete the project or develop a site
plan they intend to sell. Mr. Clark said held sell if someone offered him 100
million but those he represents have full intentions of doing this project and
have a sincere interest in this area but he cannot divulge names at this point.
Councilman Jones asked if this project will meet Comp Plan requirements for an
area for manufactured homes. Planning and Zoning Director Mark Karet replied
yes and the developer is interested in how quickly he can sell his home and the
Planning Department's interested in making sure the Comp Plan is met. He
referred to controversy with the Comp Plan and whether it is or is not in effect,
4 Council Special Meeting
May 13, 1991
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Review additional information re: LDRA's recommendation to annex 450 acres
(Continued) and we heard at the last special meeting from the Interim City
Attorney that it is not in effect. He said one portion that was never in doubt
was the housing element because it was omitted from the ordinance but there are
policies that look at demand for housing and one of the criteria they had to meet
was availability of locations for mobile homes. He added our response to DCA
objections is that there's not enough vacant land left to provide sites for
mobile homes and locations would have to be looked at outside the City for
annexation. Councilperson Gillespie asked if the Comp Plan says 850 manufactured
homes for low income housing. Mr. Karet explained itls affordable housing.
Council person Gillespie stated $50-$70,000 is not low income. Mr. Karet
explained it doesn't address specific provisions for low income housing but it's
affordable and when you look at golf course communities, this is a very
reasonable and affordable golf course community and they felt the package made
sense from a Comp Plan perspective.
Councilperson Gillespie asked if they'll figure into the overall revenues the
times when there aren't many people using the golf course. Mr. Clark said the
feasibility review told them the typical buyer will represent 60% of the golf
population so he'll probably have it covered. He added Council has a lot of
pressure and if Council decides this isn't what they're looking for, it's okay,
they'll probably still be their neighbor.
Ted Ulinski, Vista Palm, said the statement that 5% of the people will golf is
wrong and asked if they've tried to get tee time. He supported the golf course
and said he thinks they'll get about $1 million a year revenue with 300 member-
ships sold and non-members and concessions.
Gigi Bennington, 121 Virginia Street, stated with the developer spending that
amount of money and putting in time and effort to bring it into the City it can't
be anything but a first class project or they wouldn't be so persistent. She
said there are questions about providing water and sewer before putting it in
Florida Shores but she understands under voluntary annexation until everything's
in place in our City we don't have to provide services. She referred to past
reviews of golf courses by Parks and Recreation Board. She noted ad valorem
taxes only meet 31-35% of the total revenues. Mr. Munoz stated it doesnlt cover
the Police budget this year. Mrs. Bennington said they're talking about a small
amount and with the economic growth this golf course will bring and jobs and
revenue from sales and retail stores and gas she doesn't see anything but good.
She added if they don't annex, they don't get any money, and they can control
growth and progress of the project if they annex. She said developers have to
put up over $5 million before they'll see a penny's profit and they won't let
it go down the drain. She pointed out pre-manufactured homes seem to be the wave
of the future with the older retired population. She said if they don't annex
they III cause the City to stagnate because without growth they don I t have
anything and people here will pay more for less.
George Ewing, Royal Palm, stated he hasn't seen any concrete figures and he's
not sure everything said tonight will happen in the future. He stated they can
build a golf course, but not at the expense of the citizens. He objected to the
650 manufactured homes and the low ad valorem tax they.ll produce. He said if
these people don't pay their way, it's not worthwhile for the City to take it
over. He stated Edgewater taxpayers shouldn't subsidize a golf course or any
more manufactured homes because they have enough now. He said they can build
the golf course but it doesn't have to be in Edgewater. He reviewed taxes for
manufactured homes, such as Sea Anchor Circle. Mr. Ewing stated the developer
agreed to pay the difference for the next 5 years and asked if they'll pay the
difference in taxes of an average home and manufactured home. He asked if they
should subsidize these mobile homes and said if they pass this annexation they.re
not representing the majority of the taxpayers. He stated the application was
withdrawn by letter in February and also withdrawn at the March 15th meeting.
He stated the City Attorney suggested they keep the door open for future
negotiations and she had no right to say that, it's Council's prerogative if they
want to continue. He said she gives opinions and should only give legal advice.
Mayor Wessler pointed out there was no meeting March 15th and she's asked the
attorney if at any time she puts her foot in her mouth, the Attorney should pull
it out quickly so they don't end up in court, so if Ms. Clayton gives her opinion
it's because she asked her to do it. There was discussion about Ms. Clayton
offering an opinion without being asked with Ms. Clayton explaining she comments
if it.s within the realm of her engagement. Mr. Ewing referred to a May 8, 1991,
5 Council Special Meeting
May 13, 1991
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Reviewadd;tional information re: LDRA's recommendation to annex 450 acres
(Continued) newspaper article on delinquent property taxes and about the Deland
Mayor voting against an annexation. He said we have enough manufactured homes
in the City now and he doesn't know if it's necessary to grow. He asked that
they get the internal problem with the water and sewer plant solved and then in
a year or two think about a golf course and mobile homes.
Doris Hill, Lincoln Road, stated Mr. Ewing quoted one property in Edgewater
Landing but some pay $14-$1,600 in property taxes. She said the new develop-
ment's lots will have an assessed value of about $20,000 and won't be over 50
foot wide and in Florida Shores a typical 2 lots is assessed around $8,000 and
that's a big difference. She said they1re not talking about a golf course, but
of shutting this City off. She said the older people don't want this City to
grow but growth will save money and the young people have a right to see it grow.
She noted a new shopping center's coming in and they'll be telling people they
aren't going any farther South.
Henrv Dardinski, 2704 Sabal Palm, referred to the number of mobile home parks
from the City's line South and said he can see Edgewater will encompass those.
He said the City needs a golf course and this is a good idea but he'd like to
see it with duplex homes and it will provide jobs for electricians and carpenters
but manufactured homes will make money for those that send them here. He asked
why they'd put in these fast homes unless it's for profit and nobody's asked
where they're getting the money for it. He asked if they've seen how this was
done in the past and asked cities that have golf courses if they1re happy and
making money. Councilperson Gillespie said she did. Mayor Wessler asked their
track record. Mr. Dardinski referred to the problems with Golden Bay and now
they're trying to put up regular homes instead of manufactured. He said they
should expand the right way and put up nice homes instead of manufactured units.
Mayor Wessler called a break at 8:20 p.m. and called the meeting back to order
at 8:40 p.m.
Georae Naill referred to research with golf courses in the area, noting golf
courses are good for a community but there's a problem here with ad valorem as
peop 1 e who own the homes won't own the property. He rev i ewed his tr i p to
Fairgreen and values and assessments of homes there. He stated they'd have a
deficit between what they'd collect from that area and what the City requires
in excess of $40,000 a year. He noted the developer said they'd make up the
difference for 5 years but the City must plan beyond 5 years and at that time
will have a greater deficit. He said it was stated the City would get 200
memberships but when it was asked about individual membership cost these figures
were never provided. He reviewed normal initiation fees for individuals and full
membership dues for individuals and a family. He added he'd told Mr. Keaton the
United Taxpayers were not against the golf course but against the method of
building the homes with the homeowner not owning property and no ad valorem tax
to the City. He sa i d when he asked why they d i dn 't want peop 1 e own i ng the
property so it would be real property to realize taxes his reply basically was
they wanted to make money. He referred to an area with rental units by the day,
week, and month and questioned if the developer were to consider this in a
development of this type. He said golf in this area is seasonal from the first
of November to April and referred to a newspaper article about Palm Coast golf
course fees. He said a golf course can raise fees and memberships and Council
has to decide but should consider fairness to the total City population.
Montv McMullen, Edgewater Landing, stated lots in Edgewater Landing sell from
$17-69,000 and all of this is taxed whether a developer owns or they own it.
He said there's not that much difference between his home and those in Fairgreen
as referred to by Mr. Naill. He pointed out most people get $25,000 homestead
exemption but he cannot and is assessed the full value of his lot, driveway, and
shed, and he pays $500 on his $80,000 home but also pays maintenance and the
developer pays taxes. He referred to a bank that would not deal with mobile
homes and is now having problem.s He said the State law will eventually charge
them and theylll pay the total price, and it doesn't matter who owns property,
someone will pay taxes on it. He added he wouldn't buy without his own lot.
He said they pay school taxes and it's an adult facility.
Gene Hodaes, 204 N. Ridgewood, stated when Jud Woods was City Attorney he said
15,000 cars pass there every day. He said he's tried to get the lot next to him
cleaned up and sets boxes out on Mondays and Thursdays but the truck drivers told
6 Council Special Meeting
May 13, 1991
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Review additional information re: LDRA's recommendation to annex 450 acres
(Continued) him not to use boxes. He expressed concern with cost of using
plastic bags they asked him to use. He said he pays $1,200 a year in taxes.
He referred to his treatment by a service officer and said they should have name
tags on. He reviewed his support of Lawton Chiles. Council person Gillespie
asked Mr. Overstreet to assist Mr. Hodges with his problem.
Alice Murphv, 230 N. Riverside Drive, referred to a community built by the Mackle
Brothers. She said mobile and manufactured homes put plumbers, electricians,
and carpenters out of business and asked what would happen to tradesmen. She
stated they won't use as much fertilizer with reuse water and expressed concern
with polluting ground water because of our high water table. She asked if roads
will be private or if she'll be asked to give her name, address and ID and be
photographed to get in as others continue to do with no opposition from the City.
She said her taxes are high with a large portion to schools but they have to pay
to educate children. She said the golf course would be nice but she's concerned
with manufactured homes.
Don Clausnitzer, 1823 Juniper, spoke in favor of the golf course area. He said
the numbers will meet and theylre looking at future growth. He said if this
project is put in in the County they won1t be able to expand South on the West
side of U.S. 1 and when they go West there will be a lot of wetlands. He noted
the people wi 11 impact the roads so they might as well get the benefit of
annexing them and using the money on the City.s behalf.
Dominick Fazzone, 302 Paradise Lane, stated he's a member of LDRA that acted on
this annexation and it was unanimously passed. He asked Council to reconsider
it because of income from the golf course and what it would cost the City. He
said he researched and found some homes in the manufactured areas pay did pay
their fair share of taxes. He said he went to the County Assessor.s office and
found there are properties in Edgewater Landing that paid less taxes than what
he pays in Shangri-La for a home of $50,000 compared to $110,000. He said
Edgewater Landing is a beautiful development and he doesn't think it's fair for
Council to review this without getting all the figures. He said it1s a tough
decision and referred to manufactured and mobile homes at Eastern Shores and
Edgewater Landing that are a credit and are fine homes. He said they talk about
Fairgreen's high values but most people living in Edgewater didn't live in
Fairgreen because they couldn't afford it and the type of homes proposed for this
golf course are affordable. He said they're looking for this in the expansion
and held be against manufactured homes because we have enough at this time but
they need a golf course. He noted we don't have a club house or bowling alley
or place for community meetings and the golf course will give us a club house
worth 1/2 million to accommodate meetings. He said they'll get 457 acres of land
added to the City and about 1,400 people eventually and 110 acres is jurisdiction
conservation with no buildings on it and land will be open and free. He said
they'll have 1.4 people per acre and this golf course will be good for the young
people and it will bring at least 25 more jobs into the area. He stated the 1/2
million gallons of reuse water is the most important thing to consider. He
pointed out the Comp Plan housing element states between now and 1995 they should
have 500 more units and between 1995-2000 another 400 mobile units and if they
don't have it in the City to look at annexation of land beyond the City to
accommodate that. He noted it1s affordable homes, not for the poor.
Phillip Fonq, property owner in Edgewater, stated they all have their own opinion
of the type of home they'd like but if there.s no development they'll get no tax
at all and if it's in the City they'll get revenue for it. He said the golf
course is an advantage from a marketing standpoint and that1s the key to the
development1s success. He said the golf course and manufactured homes serve
a need for some people with affordable housing and this meets the Comp Plan
requirement. He said there are more pluses than minuses and he believes this
is a good sound project. He asked the developers to do a good job on marketing.
Councilperson Gillespie asked the legal status ruling on this. Councilman Hays
asked if the Attorney touched base with the County. Ms. Clayton said she called
Dick Kelton at Volusia County and asked the status of their position and his
comments included that the County's position is as a general rule they don't
oppose a person seeking urban services and annexing into a city but they look
at each case individually. She said he told her there1s not enough review of
the project to determine their position on the annexation and from staff level
at the County they didn't look at the annexation closely enough to determine
7 Council Special Meeting
May 13, 1991
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...."
Review additional information re: LDRA's recommendation to annex 450 acres
(Continued) their position to the County Council. She said it's incumbent on
the City not to create enclaves and that's a violation of State Statutes and the
County must decide whether or not to challenge. She said someone suggested it
would be wise to contact the people in that area and they may want to consider
that no matter how this is handled. She noted last week the developer worked
with Director of Planning Don Sikorski and Dick Kelton and others and it wasn't
clear if they plan to use DCA manufactured housing or HUD housing and there's
a difference in category as HUD is generally mobile homes and DCA is equivalent
to a stick built and under Volusia County regulations you can put DCA certified
or standard manufactured homes in any residential unit in the County. She said
ability to put mobile home tags exists for both those structures. She said at
that meeting they talked about west and east of the railroad and the developer
talked about whether or not to build the development by phases and phase 1 would
be east of the railroad and it would have to go through rezoning and special
exception process according to Dick Kelton who was not clear on what rezoning
they're looking for. She said the County had serious concerns about the
conservation nature of the western side of the property and the developer and
City and County should assure that wherever the property is developed those
issues would be addressed so they don't have water crossing boundaries and
environmental issues that effect one jurisdiction because of permitting of
another jurisdiction. She stated regarding the utilities issue, the County would
not be in a position to provide utilities to the development so there would not
be an immediate need in the program unless they could find capacity somewhere
and the Utilities Director said they could have them as a customer whether in
or out of the City. She noted there was discussion of using another system close
by but there's no sewer capacity there, only water. She said this should be
coordinated no matter how they deal with the development.
Ms. Clayton stated they had a voluntary withdrawal at the public hearing by the
developer and she doesn't know what is before them today. Mayor Wessler asked
for her input because she'd like to give them a yes or no answer to annex them
into the City. Ms. Hansen said they have an agenda item for consideration and
all they can expect tonight is some sense of Council as to what they should do
next and it may take a motion. Councilperson Gillespie said she has no problem
with that and is pleased with the information. Mayor Wessler said they have all
the information before them and can bring it back without more information.
Councilperson Gillespie said they have to work on Ms. Clayton's information.
Gig; Bennington, 121 Virginia, suggested they need a motion of their intent to
go ahead with the annexation or based on the information not to go ahead and then
this would have to have ordinances and other information and perhaps a motion
to accept the information they received and go on with the annexation procedures.
Councilperson Martin moved to accept the information received and go further into
the information the Attorney gave them tonight. Councilperson Gillespie seconded
the motion. Ms. Hansen stated they have the information Ms. Clayton requested
and can provide it and she'd like a motion conditioned on that and actually to
restart the process. She suggested they could perhaps waive the LDRA again and
come back to Council. Councilperson Gillespie asked if it's to reschedule with
Council for consideration of annexation based on information that's available
that meets our attorney's criteria. Ms. Hansen said yes and perhaps they could
have first reading of the ordinance. Councilperson Gillespie stated that would
be getting them into the procedural process and since there was no precedence
with voluntary withdrawal, and had they voted on it they'd have to wait for one
year, but they didn't. Ms. Clayton suggested they consider the precedent value
of what you do and when you have a developer who voluntarily withdraws, it
doesn't matter if you voted on it, you advertise it and had a public hearing,
and her opinion is the waiting period applies but the waiting period can be
waived and you can consider if you want to short cut the process. She said the
question is if you want the developer to submit a new application and staff to
give a recommendation to be presented next Monday for how to expedite the hearing
process with still having assurances of due process and procedural protection
for all involved. Councilperson Martin withdrew her motion and Councilperson
Gi llespie withdrew her second. Councilperson Martin so moved with the Attorney' s
suggestion. Councilperson Gillespie seconded the motion. Motion CARRIED 4-1.
Mayor Wessler voted NO.
Ms. Clayton stated they are to refile the application
City Council for consideration on Monday on whether
8
and recommendation to the
they wish to expedite or
Council Special Meeting
May 13, 1991
,
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Review additional information re: LDRA's recommendation to annex 450 acres
(Continued) short cut any procedures and waive the waiting period. Ms. Hansen
stated she'll have it in tomorrow. Councilman Hays asked if they'll get a final
opinion on whether they should proceed because of the voluntary withdrawal.
Mayor Wessler said she understood Ms. Clayton said they could come back.
Councilman Hays stated he wants to be procedurally correct. Mayor Wessler asked
if itls okay for Ms. Hansen to come back. Ms. Clayton said the voluntary
withdrawal by letter had not reached the agenda so it was withdrawn before the
meeting was held at which it would have been considered and the second voluntary
wi thdrawa 1 was done dur i ng the pub 1 i c hear i ng at wh i ch the item was before
Council for a decision.
Results of meeting re: Shangri-La Village Homeowners Association with
recommendation to accept roads and stormwater - Mayor Wessler stated last
Thursday Gates Castle, Mark Karet, Bill Vola, Terry Wadsworth, and Ron Ferland
and she met with Shangri-La Homeowners and discussed the problems and it was the
recommendation of all departments to take over that for the Shangri-La residents.
She said the only question is the retention area in back of Shangri-La and our
departments said we could take it over but some residents want to keep it and
do the maintenance and hold liability themselves. Counci1person Gillespie asked
if it's the retention that will move to Turgot. Mayor Wessler replied no.
Mrs. Frances Ferguson, 336 Shangri-La Circle, stated it was agreed it would be
deeded to the Homeowners Association but the Board of Directors refused and said
they didn't want it so it was never related to them they didnlt want to accept
it. She said a lot of the homeowners wanted it deeded as a private commons area
as it had been the last 6 years so they had a petition with 64 signatures and
they were all in favor of the commons area being deeded to the Association but
the Board of Directors doesn1t want it and the homeowners do. Councilman Hays
asked how many members they have. Mrs. Ferguson noted some homeowners are not
members but of the 64, with some gone for the summer, there are about 5 that are
not Association members. Councilman Hays asked how many homeowners. A lady in
the audience replied 106.
Dominick Fazzone said he's lived here since 1984 and lives where flooding takes
place. He said Mr. Ferguson was a very good former president and did a lot for
their Association but in the last 7 years they've had a lot of problems,
including flooding, and maintenance of the roads and commons area that the City
didn't want to accept and the Association took it over and did the work on it.
He agreed it would be nice for the homeowners to have the retention area under
their control but their Association only represents some of the citizens of the
Shangri-La subdivision and it's not a part of the deed or covenants like some
others are. He exp 1 a i ned it I S a vo 1 untary club and present off i cers and
directors do not want that responsibility and the petition said if they got the
retention area a new road can be put through that area and they could control
it and stop the City from building that road. He said he was told they wanted
control of the retention area so they could control if a street would be going
in where the school area is. He noted the City will be working on the retention
area to ease the flooding problems and it has to be reworked and they should be
under the control of the City. He said they've been paying insurance on the
streets and retention area and some people wonder why.
Mayor Wessler asked if they can block something if they give the road to the
people. Planning & Zoning Director Mark Karet said it's an access easement that
would overly any ownership. Council person Gi llespie said it I S an emergency
egress. Mayor Wessler asked about retention on Turgot. Mr. Karet replied it
will remain there and will be reworked. Council person Gillespie said she
understood the retention pond would move over to Turgot. Councilman Hays said
that will be connected and Parks & Recreation Director Jack Corder agreed.
Mayor Wessler asked if any Council member objected to accepting the drainage and
roads. Councilman Hays said they all looked at it and in fairness to people in
Shangri-La it's time to assist them with the problem and he moved they do take
over Mr.Overstreet's suggestion for Shangri-La roads and stormwater for
maintenance. Counci1person Gillespie seconded the motion. Motion CARRIED 5-0.
Planning & Zoning Director Mark Karet stated if they give the retention area to
someone it would have to be a separate organization set up so they could take
responsibility and the most logical would be the homeowners association but there
seems to be disagreement and to give it to individuals that may be leaving would
9 Council Special Meeting
May 13, 1991
....
....."
Results of meeting re: Shangri-La Village Homeowners Association with
recommendation to accept roads and stormwater (Continued) be problematical to
the City to see proper maintenance is done. Mayor Wessler said they were
concerned about how often they'd have the grass cut but they could take care of
it and Mrs. Ferguson said something about putting in a shuffleboard area and
she1d told her the City would be open to suggestion if they'd pay for it and they
could use it in the park. Parks & Recreation Director Jack Corder said with
development of the 26 acres he doesn't feel held be looking at developing that
area now. Mayor Wessler said it would be them, not the City, but after talking
to department heads it seems the best solution is to accept that and weill take
control of it and they can cut the grass if they want to. Councilman Hays said
it was Carl Overstreet's recommendation and he agrees with it and knows weill
provide proper maintenance.
Mrs. Ferguson said if they assume responsibility for maintenance they have to
carry liability insurance. Mayor Wessler said the City holds onto the liability
and is responsible for it but other people have cut grass and trees. Ms. Clayton
said the City's concern with the liability is if they mow it and she can give
the City a hold harmless in exchange for this. Mrs. Ferguson asked if they have
to carry liability. Ms. Clayton replied it's up to them. Mrs. Ferguson read
the petition. Mayor Wessler said it will benefit everyone for the City to keep
it and they can get a hold harmless and she doesn't want this to divide Shangri-
La. Councilman Hays said it's the City's responsibility since they relinquished
the pond.
Bob Switzer, 326 Shangri-La, stated the Board of Directors did not tell the true
facts to the people and if they ask them they'll take their names off the
petition. Mayor Wessler stated they voted on the issue and don't want to divide
their community. Mr. Fazzone stated the people owe Mr. Ferguson a vote of thanks
because he did a lot for Shangri-La.
Short list of City Attorney applicants and determining dates to hold interviews
Council members reviewed the names they'd selected for a short list. Councilman
Jones selected: J. T. Frankenberger, Kim OIConnor, George Sofranko, Jr., Krista
Storey, and Jud Woods. Counc il person Mart i n se 1 ected: Stan 1 ey Bak i ta, Pau 1
Chipok, Floyd Hennen, George Sofranko, Jr., Krista Storey, and Jud Woods.
Council person Gillespie selected: George Sofranko, Jr., James Walsh III, Kathleen
Schneider, Paul Chipok, B. Randall Griffiths, and Krista Storey. Councilman Hays
selected: Kahlil Day, Larry Kinder, Donald Seps, George Sofranko, Jr., and Jud
Woods, Jr. Mayor Wessler selected: William Barley, B. Randall Griffiths, and
Kim OIConnor. The top six selected were: George Sofranko, Jr.; Krista Storey;
Judson Woods; Paul Chipok; B. Randall Griffiths; and Kim OIConnor. Mayor Wessler
suggested they call them individually and have the Department Heads meet them.
It was agreed to meet May 29th if appointments could be arranged for interview.
Councilperson Gillespie asked if they'll have the first public hearing on the
assessment because they need one of the hearings by the end of May. Mr. Munoz
replied tomorrow Ron Ferland will get the tapes from the County and they'll work
with the individual who'll convert the data. Mayor Wessler said she thought the
first hearing was in July. Councilperson Gillespie said Mr. Mansfield said they
need two public hearings and a board of equalization and suggested they hold it
by the end of the month. Ms. Clayton said shelll work with Mr. Ferland on
setting up public hearings but information for the hearings has to be provided
before they can be scheduled. Councilperson Gillespie stated Ron Ferland said
to get the letter out. Mayor Wessler said she understood it was July 17th.
Mayor Wessler stated interviews will be the 29th and they can pay their own
expenses. Ms. Clayton asked if they established criteria for the interviews.
Councilperson Gillespie said she turned hers in. Ms. Clayton suggested they may
want input from local professionals and she knows a couple. She noted they're
looking for local government experience and someone bright and they may want
assistance from someone who practices in Volusia County. Mayor Wessler stated
she checked with local attorneys and one wasn't recommended very highly.
Councilperson Gillespie said she doesn't want a currently seated City Attorney
who held have to work with but she'd like someone with prior experience. She
said the Police will run a credit check. George Naill said he met with Sam Owens
and he offered his help with the selection process and also told him Ms. Clayton
is very competent. Mayor Wes s 1 er noted he recommended Ms. Clayton to her.
Council-man Jones said he has a problem with the 29th. Councilman Hays suggested
they meet on Saturday. Mayor Wessler stated the City Clerk will work with the
30th and 1st to have them here. 10 Council Special Meeting
May 13, 1991
....
....,
Review aaenda format: Determine procedure for advisory board/committee
appointments: Review re: Roberts Rules of Order or other rules bv which to
conduct meetinas Mayor Wessler suggested they TABLE the rest of the items and
Council person Gillespie so moved. Council person Martin seconded the motion.
Motion CARRIED 5-0.
Mr. Munoz stated the two used refuse trailers will be purchased for $8,289.20
and held like that cleared by Council before they purchase them from Ormond
Beach. Councilperson Gillespie moved to accept the Acting City Managerls
recommendation for the Public Works trailers. There were no objections expressed
by Council.
Councilperson Gillespie moved to adjourn. Council person Martin seconded the
motion. Meeting was adjourned at 10:08 p.m.
Minutes submitted by:
Lura Sue Koser
~
ATTEST:
-cr?crERr! ~
App' oved this / 7 day of
, 1991-.
,~~QCl.<l~
MA R
11
Council Special Meeting
May 13, 1991