11-29-1990 - Special
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CITY COUNCIL OF EDGEWATER
SPECIAL MEETING
NOVEMBER 29, 1990
MINUTES
Mayor Tanya Wessler called the meeting to order at 7:00 p.m. in the Community
Center. She read the items listed on the agenda.
ROLL CALL
Mayor Tanya Wessler
Councilman Kirk Jones
Councilperson Louise Martin
Councilperson NoraJane Gillespie
Councilman Michael Hays
City Attorney Josel Alvarez
City Manager Elly Johnson
City Clerk Susan Wadsworth
Police Chief Lawrence Schumaker
Present
Present
Present
Present
Present
Present
Present
Present
Present
Mayor Wessler stated the reason they don't say the pledge at special meetings
is because they're not required to do so.
REVIEW OF ORGANIZATIONAL CHART AND POSITIONS
Councilman Hays stated that in reviewing the organizational chart, he feels that
any elected body has certain administrative and other individuals they must rely
on and held like to address the relationship between the City Manager, the City
Attorney and those people that they must rely on heavi ly in their deci s ion
making. He said first of all, in addressing the City Attorney, he thinks it's
imperative that any client, anyone dealing with an attorney, must be able to rely
entirely and with good faith of that person and personally speaking, he does
not have that faith. He then moved that they advertise for a new City Attorney.
Councilperson Gillespie seconded the motion.
Councilman Jones stated they were just newly elected and he hasn't had a chance
to work with our City Attorney and doesn't know the ins and outs of what he's
done in the past. He said he's been controversial, but he has not researched
and found out the problems and why they feel the City Attorney is lacking in
whatever duty he's supposed to fulfill. He said held like to be able to look
into it and see his salary and what he's been getting annually compared to other
attorneys, and he doesn't know if they're rushing into something and he feels
if it's broke, they should do something about it, and he has no problem with
that, but held like a chance to work with the man and see his background and
his pay scale and see where he's at.
Councilperson Martin stated she'd like more detail as to why they're doing this.
Councilman Hays said he personally does not feel that he has good faith in the
present Attorney and he won't go through a long list of reasons for this and he
thinks it's important for himself that he feel he has someone he can work with
and deal with and he does not feel he can with this gentleman. He added it's
not a personality problem, it's just in general what he's observed in previous
dealings. He stated he does have some real problems with the contracts they have
inherited.
Councilperson Gillespie stated she seconded this to get it for discussion and
she has more than a little bit of a problem, she has an adversarial attitude when
it comes to their present City Attorney, so it's seconded and it's on the floor.
Councilman Jones again stated they're a newly elected body and to get rid of the
City Attorney they'll be in the dark. He said the City Manager knows quite a
bit about what's going on, and he has carried a lot through with the CIP and
they'll be a year trying to find out what they'll be doing and it will take
awhile to get a new Attorney and to go back through all the research and it will
cost a lot of money. He said he feels this is not the time to take this action.
He stated this is a special meeting and he thought they were supposed to discuss
things on the agenda and he doesn't think this is on the agenda and if it's not,
then they cannot do it legally.
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REVIEW OF ORGANIZATIONAL CHART AND POSITIONS (Continued)
Mayor Wessler asked the City Attorney is it's legal to bring up the motion. City
Attorney Alvarez stated he's a little surprised and shocked. He said he's been
listening to the campaign statement and it has happened in the past, however,
you just don't shoot from the hip. He said there's an element of fairness and
fair play which he thought they all pledged allegiance with justice for all.
He stated there's absolutely not been any reasons, there has been no due process,
and he's trying to be objective, but it looks like a bloody, typical hatchet job,
which he thought was behind Edgewater 10 years ago. He added he's always said
his record is open to the public and he has rested on his record very proudly
the past 9 years. He said there are people that have their own little political
vendettas and held like to think and hope that as responsible elected officials
they'll be at least open minded. He said forgetting his own personal situation,
he asked about the City, because they're all there to serve the City, and he
cannot think how this motion will be to the benefit of the City, but it might
be pleasing to some individuals in the audience.
City Attorney Alvarez stated he respects Councilmember Hays and feels he's an
intelligent individual but he didn't even discuss the matter privately with him
and let him know what the reasons are. He stated he won't hang around where he
isn't wanted but on the other hand, he thinks after 9 years he deserves a little
better treatment than this.
Councilman Jones asked if it's legal at this special meeting. City Attorney
Alvarez advised as their City Attorney that his contract is designed exactly to
prevent this type of political hatchet job and he can be terminated for cause,
that's what a contract is for, and knowing the volatile political situation in
Edgewater, there's an element of due process and proprietary interest,
expectation of employment and legal commitments and agreements. He said he
doesn I t think he has the heart to sue the City because he doesn I t want the
taxpayers to pay and he doesn't know how he would deal with it on an individual
basis. He said he has a reputation and a profession. He stated regarding is
this legal, this is probably the most illegal motion he's seen since he served
the City in the last 9 years.
Councilperson Martin suggested they have a workshop to discuss the pros and cons
of this motion and she amended the motion. Councilperson Gillespie seconded the
amendment to the motion. Mayor Wessler stated there was a motion made and
seconded and they're in discussion now, and she asked if they have to retract
their motion in order to go to discussion and have a workshop. City Attorney
Alvarez suggested they put the motion to a roll call and if it doesn't pass,
he'll be happy to sit down with the Council and discuss whatever it is they wish
to discuss.
Councilperson Martin stated she considers it unfair to vote at this time unless
they have a workshop to determine why they made the motion. Councilman Hays
stated in deference to her wishes, he'll withdraw his motion for now. Council-
person Gillespie withdrew her second. Councilman Hays requested they have the
workshop as soon as possible because this item needs to be resolved before they
can get on with City business and do what the people elected them to do. He
stated this is not a personal problem with himself and Mr. Alvarez but he has
to proceed with these things the way he personally feels is best. Councilman
Jones urged they set a workshop and the City Clerk get a time for all of them
to meet. Mayor Wessler stated they'll have a special meeting/workshop to make
a decision and they can get other legal counsel if need be to attend to advise
them. Councilman Jones said the workshop should be Council and the City
Attorney. Mayor Wessler said it has to be open to the public. Councilman Jones
said he knew that and has no problem with that but they need to discuss their
problems with Mr. Alvarez so he can prepare a defense for himself and now he can
go back into the records and have documents there to back his position. There
was discussion regarding available dates. Mr. Dominick Fazzone, from the
audience, stated they can't hear the discussion and he feels the public should
be able to hear what's happening and some are whispering and they don't want
that. Mayor Wessler explained they agreed to have a special meeting/workshop
to discuss the City Attorney on Thursday, the 6th. Councilman Jones stressed
that the public be advised of the meeting date. There was discussion about his
availability, and Mayor Wessler advised if the City Attorney has a problem with
that date, they'll change it. City Attorney Alvarez said he just wants to hear
what the problems are. Motion to hold a special meeting/workshop CARRIED 5-0.
2 Council Special Meeting Minutes
November 29, 1990
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REVIEW OF ORGANIZATIONAL CHART AND POSITIONS (Continued)
Mayor Wessler asked if there were any other comments under this item. Council-
person Gillespie stated she had questions about advisory boards and ad hoc
committees. She said it1s not necessary to come to Council but she appreciates
the Boards that do come with their ideas on an ad hoc committee to give them an
opportunity to vote on it. She added that also lets the public know about the
ad hoc committees and their actions. She asked when an ad hoc committee is
formed under an advisory board, are they confined to the same Sunshine Government
in the Law as the Boards are and do they have to abide with the same rules, or
can they discuss their duties within themselves and then report to their board.
City Attorney Alvarez replied it's always been his philosophy that when in doubt,
follow the Sunshine Law. Councilperson Gillespie said an expert in the Sunshine
Law told her the average politician violates it 100 times a week without knowing
it. She added a member of an ad hoc advisory board committee asked if she were
bound by the Sunshine Law and she told her she is until she finds out differently
from the City Attorney and to ask him in writing if she wants something concise.
City Attorney Alvarez agreed that1s correct.
SUGGESTED SEATING ARRANGEMENT FOR COUNCIL MEMBERS AND STAFF
Mayor Wessler stated she likes this formation and she'd talked with the City
Attorney who said there1s no problem and she'd like people to help build a
platform, maybe 2 or 3 stair platform to be able to see everyone in the back,
and it would be volunteer labor and some volunteer materials, and if not, she1d
like to know if the City could pay for it. She pointed out anyone that joins
in would have to sign a waiver so in case they got hurt we wouldn1t have to pay
for it. She suggested since the press doesn't have a table they could add a
table or chairs at one end. Councilman Hays asked where the platform would be.
Mayor Wessler explained at this lower level, and they've been using the stage
for Bingo and they store under the stage and have no place else for storage.
Councilperson Gillespie said she promised to give the stage back to the people
if she were elected. She explained this was a regular stage in 1971 and they
used it for Little Miss and Master Edgewater contests, drama performances, teen
dance bands, PTA, and the schools used it. She said she was asked to have the
stage remodeled and have Council down and elevated 1511 or so off the floor to
look them in the eye. She added that builder Tom Bresnahan has volunteered.
Councilman Jones said he likes this seating arrangement, but if they're building
a platform, this is a center for the community. He asked if it would be
portable. Mayor Wessler replied yes. Councilman Jones said he has no problem
with that, but he doesn't want the community to feel they're being pushed out
any further and they need to find another bu il ding down the road for the
community and perhaps build a Council chambers to be proud of and they won't have
to be sitting in metal seats as he feels the public deserves better than that.
Councilperson Martin stated she likes the idea of opening this up and bringing
the stage out and stepping down from the stage, and it1s going to be removable,
and since the stage is there, it should be used. Councilman Jones asked if this
is a temporary p.a. since they're having trouble hearing. Councilperson
Gillespie replied yes. Councilman Jones explained the p.a. they have won't reach
it and they'll have it corrected hopefully by the next meeting.
Councilperson Gillespie stated the original idea in the 70's called for a 1511
pullout platform that was in two sections that pushed back and locked against
the stage front and that was designed by the volunteer firemen. She said she
was gone 12 years and came back and found this. She said they need 16 feet of
coaxial cable, 3 or 4 sheets of plywood would be welcome, and 2 by 41s and labor.
Mayor Wessler stated if anyone wants to donate materials and labor they can call
her at her home and they'll get started as soon as they get materials and labor.
ESTABLISHMENT OF MAYOR AND COUNCIL ADVISORY COMMITTEE
Mayor Wessler stated she wants to form a committee that would enlist expertise
they have in their community that would work as a go between with citizens and
her and the committee can reach more people than she alone can do. She said
they're looking for someone in Planning, Zoning, consulting, budgeting, water,
sewer, etc. She said if Council doesn't object, she'd like to have someone in
the audience speak that has a program he worked out that might be of assistance.
She stated anyone can come into City Hall and fill out an application to be on
the committee. She said the other program she's interested in is they'd be able
to pull their names up in their area of expertise. She stated this is Mr.
Naill's idea but he wouldn't be able to be on the committee.
3 Council Special Meeting Minutes
November 29, 1990
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ESTABLISHMENT OF MAYOR AND COUNCIL ADVISORY COMMITTEE (Continued)
GeorQe Naill, 1604 Royal Palm, stated in view of the fact they're looking for
an interface with the citizens, he felt they could use some advisory support and
he calls this a Citizens Local Advisory Support Program, or CLASP. He said they
would go out to the public with a brochure of some type that would request them
to identify their expertise. He said they have a lot of people in Edgewater,
both retired and in the current labor force, that cover a wide area of expertise,
with engineers, construction, mechanics, and secretarial work, etc. He said he
hopes to put it on the agenda at a later date and give them more particulars.
He said with questionnaires or brochures, they'd ask the public to identity their
expertise and their name, address and telephone number and it would be entered
into the City's computer system by coding their expertise, and if you needed to
look up someone, such as real estate broker, you'd pull up the names, and they'd
only be working on the case they'd be called on. He pointed out they'd have no
official part of the City government except they'd be responsible citizens and
would give information to help them make decisions and Council would probably
have to go into things more indepth.
Mr. Naill stated about a month ago they had a review of the City's insurance
and a gentlemen reviewed the requirements and suggested how to improve the
insurance and protection. He said he doesn't know if the man was paid, but there
are people who live in the City with expertise that are retired that could have
helped free of charge and advised them how to handle it and then they could have
gone to the local insurer who's insuring the City and addressed the problems in
a more intelligent manner.
Mr. Naill suggested that people coming into the City will pay their water bills
and they could add that onto it that they'd like to request voluntary services
to address their expertise, He added it would enhance the City's position and
would get citizens involved. He recommended he give it to Council in more detail
at a later date.
Councilman Jones stated anytime you get citizens involved you have something
going and it's like a citizens resource bank, and with the community behind them
they can do anything, and with citizens who want to participate on that type of
data bank, it will make their job a lot easier. He added it's encouraging to
hear this come from the citizens and he's definitely for it.
Councilperson Martin stated this is one of the reasons during the election they
wanted people involved in their government and this is the best way to do it.
Councilperson Gillespie concurred, stating they want everyone's assistance and
expertise and they need it.
Councilman Hays stated it's an excellent idea and he appreciates the work he's
put into researching it and they appreciate his help, and think it will be a lot
of help to them.
Mayor Wess ler asked if they have any problems or can they use the standard
application form. City Clerk Wadsworth said she can add it as the Council
Advisory Committee.
Councilman Jones moved they start the citizen Council advisory committee and he
thinks it's a good idea. Councilperson Gillespie seconded the motion. Motion
CARRIED 5-0.
CONFLICTS IN CHARTER SECTIONS 8. 15. AND 17
Council person Gillespie stated this has been a burr with her since she got
elected and when she asked when they'd take the oath of office she was told by
the City Clerk it was the fourth Monday in November and she told her the Charter
says it will be the night after you're elected, and this was dated 1953, Section
17. She said it's thrown into conflict by Special Acts, Number 8, that says you
take your oath of office the 4th Monday, then you go back to Section 15, which
the City Attorney based his ruling on regarding electing a Vice Mayor and Acting
Mayor, and it says annually in the first regular meeting after the election in
November by members of Council and since December 3rd is the first regular
meeting, that's when it will be done. She stated she still finds this in
conflict and had asked if a ruling had ever been obtained from the State and she
was told no, so she went to Katherine Odham at the suggestion of the man who was
City Attorney in 1980, but has not heard anything from her.
4 Council Special Meeting Minutes
November 29, 1990
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CONFLICTS IN CHARTER SECTIONS 8. 15. AND 17 (Continued)
Councilperson Gillespie stated she took a copy of the Charter where she felt it
was in conflict to the Attorney General in Daytona Beach and asked them to get
her something that she1d be satisfied that it's straightened out. She said it's
referred to later on in the Charter, it goes back and forth, and it's been that
way 10 years.
Councilman Jones stated with the Charter and going to the Code, with the
Municipal Home Rule Powers Act, that might have misconnected and the Home Rule
Act would allow Council, without having to go through Charter change, to do an
ordinance, and change it through that avenue. He said Section 2-20 is regular
meeting dates, and they need to know more about the Home Rules Act. He said
they'll probably find they're not violating the Charter down the road.
Councilperson Gillespie said she has a problem with interpretation and he's
correct they go by the first regular meeting, and their first regular meeting
is December 3rd, but the Charter conflicts itself and it should have been handled
before this. She said she doesn't think it has to go to a vote of the people
to correct an error that stood because of a Special Act, and this came about
when Council resigned and they didn't have a quorum, and something had to be done
to elect the Council. She said they'll have to address things and she wanted
the public to know she feels it's in conflict and it bothers her and she won't
be happy until it's squared away.
City Attorney Alvarez explained this apparent conflict in the Charter is a result
of the Special Act which was amended and the codification bureau never removed
the old language. He said if you have two conflicting provisions of a law, you
follow the latest, the latest one controls over the previous ones, and that's
what they've been following. He said he researched Section 8 and the language
should have been by ordinance, and you can see at the bottom of the pages all
the different ordinances that have been amending this Section 8.
City Attorney Alvarez stated he and the City Clerk went through the ordinances
and found none calling for a referendum for this amendment to the Charter and
they then found in 1980 a Resolution was used to call for the question and submit
the amendment to the electorates. He pointed out to submit the amendment to the
electorates, State Statute 166 provides very explicitly that referendums must
be called and submitted to the voters by an ordinance. He added there are 5
opinions by the Attorney General concerning that and he doesn't know the thinking
and why a resolution was used in 1980 to amend the Charter. He said the legal
repercussion is to the first Attorney who signed the resolution in 1980 to see
why the State Statute was ignored.
Councilman Jones stated they need to fix the problem. Councilperson Gillespie
said she's been screaming about this and asked the City Attorney if it was ever
brought to his attention. City Attorney Alvarez replied only as to what day to
swear in the new Council and the procedure being used was being used when he
became City Attorney. Councilperson Gillespie asked if anyone ever noticed this.
City Attorney Alvarez replied the Charter Review Committee, and this is something
in a housekeeping type of change that should be addressed, but there are other
provisions in the Charter that are obsolete pursuant to Home Rule Powers. He
said the cleanest way is, leaving aside some controversial items, have a
referendum and adopt a model charter and eliminate it once and for all as doing
patch work will only bring more confusion. Councilperson Gillespie asked if it's
a referendum by the public. City Attorney Alvarez replied yes. Councilperson
Gillespie asked if should be done immediately or wait for the next election
that's scheduled and ask to put it on then. City Attorney Alvarez replied it's
up to Council. Mayor Wessler asked how many more problems are in the Charter.
Councilperson Gillespie said she found 3, this was the major one and they're in
office, and he feels they're legally set and there's no problem with them. City
Attorney Alvarez replied yes, short of realizing today through the records that
the procedure calling for the Mayor and Council to go to election all at the same
time every two years was done by resolution.
Mayor Wessler asked that he read the Charter in the next week or so and come back
with all the conflicts they might have that need to be addressed right away.
City Attorney Alvarez explained they've done that. Councilperson Gillespie asked
for a report to the Council. Councilman Jones said they had a Charter Review
Committee and maybe some members could give them insight.
5 Council Special Meeting Minutes
November 29, 1990
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CONfLICTS IN CHARTER SECTIONS 8. 15. AND 17 (Continued)
Giai Benninaton stated she was on two Charter Review Committees, the first was
in 1982 when Ken Millard was on that Committee with her, and it was defeated.
She explained the items in question have been in question for a lot of years
and that was one of the reasons they had the Charter Review Committee and one
of the reasons they wanted to clean it up so they wouldn1t have conflicts. She
said she understands the first part of Section 8 is other than what Mr. Alvarez
has found out is a valid part that can only be changed by referendum under the
Home Rule established in 1973 and the other conflict, Section 15, functions and
powers of the Mayor, it says the Vice Mayor and Acting Mayor shall be elected
annually at the first regular meeting after the election in November and that's
a valid provision. Councilperson Gillespie said except when you go to 17. Mrs.
Bennington said under Home Rule this section was repealed and can be amended and
established by ordinance. She said Councilman Hays at the meeting Monday night
brought up Section 2-24, presiding officer, and that is once you have established
the Vice Mayor and Acting Mayor, then the next year at the first meeting in
November you do it again. Councilperson Gillespie pointed out it needs clarified
because it does not so state. Mrs. Bennington said Section 17 in the Charter
has been repealed by the ordinance that sets up calling for Council meetings,
Section 2-20. Councilperson Gillespie stated the Charter precedes the ordinance.
Mrs. Bennington stated no, not under Home Rule, unless it's been put to refer-
endum and voted by the people and this has not been. Councilperson Gillespie
said since this was not, that throws it back so the ordinance can rule. Mrs.
Bennington said only certain changes of the Charter can be changed by referendum
but a lot can be changed by ordinances unless it's been voted on by referendum
and approved.
Councilperson Gillespie stated that was what the City Attorney meant about the
yes and no answer to changing the Charter. City Attorney Alvarez agreed, and
explained he submitted a written answer to the gentleman who asked the question.
He explained he recommended a referendum instead of an ordinance because Home
Rule Powers say a Charter which was adopted before 1973 may be amended by
ordinance except the following items: the terms of elected officers and the
manner of their election; the distribution of powers among elected officers;
matters prescribed by the Charter relating to appointed boards; any change in
the form of government; or any rights of municipal employees. He explained those
items can only be changed by referendum, so it becomes a test of taking this
Statute, applying it to the Charter, and coming up with a conclusion of which
portions of the Charter may be amended by ordinance. He said for some portions,
such as those they're bringing up which deal with terms of elected officers, held
suggest a referendum would be the best way to foreclose any possibility of an
illegal challenge in the future. Councilperson Gillespie asked if it's necessary
to call a special referendum since it's been 10 years now and normally an
election is called every November. She asked if they can legally wait until
November, 1991.
Mayor Wessler asked if they'll be held in legal limbo with half of their Charter.
She said there1s not a feeling of trust with some members of the Council and the
Attorney and they want to be reassured he'll be on top of it so they'll not be
held liable or breaking a law in any form. She said some members of Council are
not in complete trust of their legal counsel at this time because they've just
begun working with him. She explained they're asking if they can count on him
to be on top of the Charter and advise them correctly on everything. She said
it's been sitting here 9 years and he's been with the City and nothing's been
done and they want reassurance that he'll be advising them if there's a conflict.
City Attorney Alvarez replied certainly.
Mrs. Bennington stated a lot's been done on this Charter in the last 9 years and
Mr. Alvarez always advised them on both Councils she was on when there was a
conflict. She explained the Committee had it ready to go to referendum and the
prior Council kept putting it off to clear up some of the conflict and confusion.
She noted it was put to referendum vote in 1982 and defeated. Mayor Wessler said
a lot of citizens went to a lot of work on the Charter but they're newly elected
officials and have some doubts as to whether they'll get the right representation
from their current City Attorney.
Mrs. Bennington said with her experience, she feels she has expertise dealing
with the Charter and Codes for the Council advisory board. Mayor Wessler said
she can apply. Mrs. Bennington again stated the City Attorney has always advised
Councils she served on whenever there was a conflict.
6 Council Special Meeting Minutes
November 26, 1990
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CONfLICTS IN CHARTER SECTIONS 8. 15. AND 17 (Continued)
Councilman Jones stated he attended a couple of Charter Review Committee
meetings. He said the City Attorney has a legal obligation to meet and a
contract with the citizens to give out the right information and with his
integrity behind it and the professional he is, he wouldn't steer the Edgewater
citizens in the direction of a problem they perceive would put them in a legal
bind as they could go back on him and legally use recourse to compensate his
malpractice in attorneyship.
Councilman Jones said they need to get the Charter straightened out and a special
referendum will cost about $6,000. He noted the Charter was defeated in 1982
and they can't be held responsible for it. He suggested they can clarify the
language where they can accept it and pass it this time and perhaps they can get
it at an election in November as Mrs. Gillespie said, and they can go with it.
Mayor Wessler explained nobody's saying Mr. Alvarez will not give them the
correct legal advice, but concern is that he will read it and come back and
advise them to be on top of it, and not to neglect it.
Councilman Hays stated regarding the proposed Charter that was voted down by
previous Council, he doesn't think it was entirely the same Charter they saw in
1982 and it might be prudent to look at all the work done so far and, if
necessary, revise that committee, as they obviously have a job to do on this.
Mayor Wessler said she was unaware they dispensed of the Charter Review
Committee. Mrs. Bennington stated it was never disbanded. Councilman Hays
stated he was under the impression once it was voted down by previous Council,
it stopped there. Mrs. Bennington said it was never voted down by prior Council,
Council asked for some changes, and when changes were presented, they just let
it lay, and it was never voted on one way or the other. She added they had 19
drafts of it.
Mayor Wessler asked that the Charter Review Committee bring it to Council to vote
on it. Councilman Jones agreed with Councilman Hays that's the direction to go.
Mayor Wessler asked City Clerk Wadsworth to contact them and have them bring it
in and get it to their meeting as soon as they can. Councilperson Gillespie
said she has a draft that she thinks is the final draft and she's very pleased
with parts of it, one of which would solve this with taking office and electing
Vice and Act i ng Mayor at the second meet i ng in November. She sa i d she was
bothered with the delay in taking the oath of office because the way it is, Civil
Defense is in limbo for almost a month.
Dominick Fazzone stated he was on the Charter Review Committee and thinks it's
very important they get a Charter thatls up to date. He said the present Charter
has 143 sections and is very ambiguous and obsolete, with over 30 sections
obsolete by Florida State Statutes. He said the Charter Review Committee over
18 months had over 40 meetings and came up with a draft and Council never refused
it but sent it back to the Committee for additions or fixing up. He stated they
listened to citizens' recommendations and many parts that were proposed by the
Committee the citizens wanted. He pointed out instead of 143 sections, they only
have 6 articles and it's on 6 sheets of paper rather than on a book. He said
it's a good beginning and with the help of citizens they can achieve something
they can work with in the future.
Mr. Fazzone stated regarding the City Attorney, held given them information when
they started 18 months ago and it consisted of the model charter used by over
30 other cities in Florida. He said it's up to Council to do whatever they want
to do with it. He said he resigned from the Charter Review Committee this
morning to give Council the opportunity to put whomever they want onto it.
Councilman Hays asked if he has what he feels is a finished product. Mr. Fazzone
replied it's 99.9% but there are 1 or 2 items that have bothered some of the
citizens and they have a right to be bothered. He stated they have something
that's very viable and can add the 1 or 2 items they want. He explained they
have a screening committee in this to screen applicants for some of the boards
and not let it go just to Council but through the Screening Committee and they'd
then come to Council for final decision. He said they also have comments by
c it i zens at the beg i nn i ng and end of the meet i ngs. He sa i d they had 4 or 5
different items that were never in the present Charter and those items didn't
come from the Committee, but from citizens, and they listened to them.
7 Council Special Meeting Minutes
November 29, 1990
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CONFLICTS IN CHARTER SECTIONS 8, 15. AND 17 (Continued)
Councilperson Martin asked if something is drawn up to individually go over it.
Mr. Fazzone replied the City Clerk has a copy of the latest and in August they
had a meeting with Council and he doesn't know if she has that. City Clerk
Wadsworth advised she1d call him if she doesn't have it.
Mr. Fazzone said in 1982 when they had the first Charter Review Committee some
of the items they talked about were illegal at that time and obsolete. He stated
the City Attorney told them certain things that by law have to be in the Charter
and they included that. He explained this is what he considers an excellent
Charter which needs some fine tuning but they don't have to wait until 1992 to
do it, they can do it in a matter of months with a good Committee.
City Attorney Alvarez stated Section 17 is the old Special Acts of 1957, Section
15 was added to the Charter in 1973, and the latest is Section 8, which was added
in 1980. Councilperson Gillespie said illegally or incorrectly. City Attorney
Alvarez stated a court will follow the legal principal that form does not prevail
over substance and if you look at every case, every decision in this State
dealing with elections and what the court will take into account in overturning
an election, the judges will not interfere with wishes of the electorate and no
judge in this State will rule they are not properly in office. He said he cannot
call for referendums, only the Council can. He explained the reason the City
went to 2 year terms for all 5 elected officers was to avoid a recall, the
amendment to the Charter, which they1ve now discovered was done by resolution,
called for an adjourning election to end everyone's term that same year in
November and that's how some individuals were eliminated from office. He said
then the initial 5 took office in December. He said 4 Councils have gone by and
the first 2 Councils weren1t interested in Charter amendments and wouldn't hear
of it and the major i ty had the ph il osophy the 1956 Charter is the one that
controls, and subsequent Councils were concerned with other priorities. He added
it wasn't until the last Council that Charter changes became a priority item.
REVIEW OF BUDGET ORDINANCE 90-0-35
Councilperson Gillespie stated 90-0-35 accepted the budget and the budget is the
exhibit. She said the problems she had with the budget that bother her is in
March when they get their revisions is too late to address her concerns. She
stated the budget did not separate grants received or fees paid into recreation
from total budget so when the 5% cut was made, it cut items needed. She said she
feels the chipper is needed and she suggested it be a 3 way budget split, with
1/3 to Recreation who receive the byproduct of the chipper, 1/3 to Refuse because
it lowers incinerator usage and prolongs the life and our permitting period and
we get a yearly permit and it has to be renewed and it has to be inspected, and
1/3 to Street Department. She asked where payments into the self-insurance fund
are listed. She stated the budget does not address capital improvement projects.
She stated she spent over 60 hours on the budget and still gets lost. She stated
she doesn't feel delays in hiring reduced the budget and it will balloon next
year's budget, and she had an awful time finding the legal services of Greenburg,
Traurig, etc., and usage of the firm and split on charges should be clear. She
said she had to add code numbers to get totals. She stated there are several
cuts she1d like to see implemented plus she1d like to see justification on
several accounts, background and prior expenditures. She said a budget is set
in recurring and nonrecurring expenses and without a full history and prior
budgets it's difficult to check. She said she doesn't think the building repairs
are the type to be cut from the budget, such as roof repairs on the Police
Department and Library. She said the budget was originally set on water and
sewer rate increases and when this was defeated, corrections were made but not
carried completely through the budget. She asked where the charges are for LaRue
from Fort Myers and if they're done with their services. She said they owe
$34,266 for payoff on the dump truck and they budgeted $5,972 principal payment
and interest is $3,138 at 10% and she'd like to payoff these type items. She
pointed out it doesn't make sense to pay 10 to 12% on a loan and only draw 8%
or 8-1/4% for money in the bank.
Mr. Johnson stated he'll be glad to go over the items with Mrs. Gillespie. He
explained roofing for the Police Department is in the budget. He pointed out
he was given a mandate by Counci 1 of what to do and he gave Counci 1 a memo
regarding all costs related to leased property of some of the large items. He
agreed anything they're paying over what they're making on interest should be
paid off and the reason they were done that way at the time was because funds
8 Council Special Meeting Minutes
November 29, 1990
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REVIEW OF BUDGET ORDINANCE 90-0-35 (Continued)
were not available for purchases, such as the two fire trucks, which is normal
procedure for most cities. He disagreed regarding the chipper because he cannot
use chip products in the incinerator. Councilperson Gillespie clarified
Recreation would gain the mulch byproduct which they now purchase and that would
cut down use of the incinerator which extends its life by cutting the branches
out they would normally burn.
Mr. Johnson suggested they come every four months with a budget review and give
them that amount of time to see the income and expenses. He requested a list
of her concerns to give her answers in writing.
Councilperson Gillespie stated she'd like to see in March a much clearer type
line item budget as she's never seen a line item budget like this. Mr. Johnson
said he thinks it's a simple budget and he has a degree in Accounting also. He
added the budget conforms to State Standards and every item has details backing
it up. He said he wants to work with this Council and do his job and he'll put
a document together with the list she submits.
Councilman Jones suggested they have a workshop with Finance and give them more
familiarity in this area. Councilperson Gillespie submitted her list to Mr.
Johnson.
Councilman Hays stated he had several questions on some of the line items but
he spent some time today with Mr. Munoz and some of it was semantics for these
type of line items. He said he can go over it at the workshop by line item to
save time tonight.
Councilperson Martin said they could pinpoint these items through a workshop.
Mayor Wessler asked they allow quite a bit of time for the workshop because it
will be very detailed.
Mr. Johnson stated the City's audited every year by a CPA firm and this City gets
a clean bill of health and they have no problem answering any of it.
Councilman Jones thanked the audience for having patience because it's their
first official meeting. He commended the Mayor, saying he'd be trembling if he
were in her shoes because it's not a easy job to chair a meeting.
Mayor Wessler suggested a motion to adjourn. Councilman Jones moved to adjourn.
Councilperson Martin seconded the motion. Meeting was adjourned at 8:25 p.m.
Minutes submitted by:
Lura Sue Koser
ATTEST:
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CITY CLERK'
ApProved this~7 day of
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~~S<:~~ \~~'~J
MAYOR ~"
9 Council Special Meeting Minutes
November 29, 1990