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12-18-1990 - Special/Workshop ~ ...... 'wi CITY COUNCIL OF EDGEWATER SPECIAL MEETING/WORKSHOP DECEMBER 18, 1990 MINUTES Mayor Wessler called the meeting to order at 7:00 p.m. in the Edgewater Library. She stated the purpose was for review of the current fiscal year budget. ROLL CALL Mayor Tanya Wessler Councilman Kirk Jones Councilperson Louise Martin Councilperson NoraJane Gillespie Councilman Michael Hays City Manager Elly Johnson City Clerk Susan Wadsworth Police Chief Lawrence Schumaker Present Arrived 7:02 p.m. Present Present Present Present Present Present Mayor Wessler advised the audience they could speak at any time. Councilperson Gillespie asked if anything cut from the budget goes to unappropriated or retained earnings. Mr. Johnson replied unappropriated funds. Councilperson Gillespie stated she thinks the budget should be in simpler form and she has no doubt it1s correct and the State accepts it but she'd like it in a more simplified form. She stated she'd talked with several realtors and they said they had about 15% drop in last quarter sales. She asked if they should adjust the ad valorem tax income, at least a percentage of it, to accommodate that. Mr. Johnson asked how they could simplify it. Councilperson Gillespie replied she wants a budget that when you look at it you know exactly what's coming in under that department as they have it in the first part but she doesn't like to have to add up totals and them come back and make sure it matches under that department. She sa i d she'd 1 i ke to look through the budget and see how many typewriters, computers and vehicles they own for justification of the department's joint use. Mr. Johnson said that's not a budget process but helll give them the fixed asset inventory they're required by law to verify once or twice a year. He pointed out everything they do in the budget and the accounting system and inventory are required by State law and GFOA, and the City has received honors the last few years because of this accounting. He explained the refuse and utilities are separate enterprise funds with separate fixed assets and they're inventoried once a year and justification is made if something's missing. He explained prior practice for older vehicles being used for parts and then sold at public auction. He stated he's been doing City budgets for 24 years and this is simple based on what the law requires and he has some problems with definitions such as transportation being postage, but the law requires it. He stated an explanation is in the back. He noted fixed assets were at a lesser value in the past but the auditors changed it to $500. He reviewed the burglary of radios in the shop area and how items were taken off the fixed assets list. Mr. Johnson stated some items that started out in the budget didn't make it through but it's still listed with no dollar amount, and by Charter the City Manager is responsible to put a budget together and present it to Council and have hearings. He noted he had 1.8 million more expenditure requests than revenue which is normal. He referred to the weeding process he and Fred Munoz went through, and to the situation of impasse with two unions with Council to act as a judicial body once it goes to Special Master. He showed Council back up for everything requested that had gone to Council. He said he'd like Council to set goals and objectives and tell him and he'll include them in the budget. Counc il person Gill esp i e aga i n asked about the 15% drop and ad va 1 orem tax reduction of 5 or 6%. Mr. Johnson replied they can1t adjust ad valorem taxes now. He and Councilperson Gillespie briefly discussed housing starts and sales. Mr. Johnson stated when he came on board two newspapers called and asked who held fire and what changes he'd make and he told them he wouldn't propose any changes for the first six months because you can1t learn all the process, it takes time. He said they don't have to believe him because they have a lot of resources here and in the County that are well thought of, they'll give advice and respond to them. He stated the budget is a tight budget and theylll be --- ......", fortunate if they can stay within it. He pointed out the railroad company is going to upgrade the crossing at 30th and it will cost $59,000 and they'll increase yearly rental paid for every crossing. Mr. Johnson stated the roof in City Hall didn't leak when the budget was adopted but now they have a bad leak on the seam of the building and the Police Department and Library are leaking. He reviewed how they use prior year figures and projections when doing the budget. He said they get a monthly financial report and will come back in 4 to 6 months with a budget review and make suggested changes and when money gets tight, he'll tell them. He explained they transferred to unappropriated earnings or funds $300,000 carryover they didn't spend and later in the year he'll make sure every purchase is necessary and everything they save can go for next year's budget to keep taxes down. He stated the population is now 15,360. Councilperson Gillespie asked if they should keep the condition in mind and watch in case they have to adjust down in March. Mr. Johnson replied yes, and he'll watch monthly reports and cost of living. He referred to revenues with water ut i 1 it i es because of the drought, and sa i d the State has given them three different estimates on revenue for sales tax. He referred to a prior change in Governors and remarks about the budget then, and status in the Middle East. Councilperson Gillespie stated she's concerned about adjusting down income. She asked if the DOT maintenance contract for U.S. 1 and 442 is a losing deal to us, and if we can get out of it. Mr. Johnson replied it was a loser to start with and they cannot get out of it for a year. Mayor Wessler asked if they can subcontract it out. Mr. Johnson replied they couldn't afford to do it, and DOT didn't cut the grass except every 4 to 6 months and the City wanted to do some beautification and they use the people in other areas and get $30,000 from the State. He explained it won't be any higher unless the City limits is expanded because it's so much per lane mile. Mayor Wessler asked if they bring in prisoners. Mr. Johnson replied they do it but for normal maintenance and normal grass cutting isn't that way and they did some over seeding and filled in holes. He added a lot of cities do it and don't get money from the State and New Smyrna Beach gets $11,000. Mayor Wessler asked if we get assistance. Mr. Johnson replied they did the curbing and repaired sidewalks. Mayor Wessler said it seems some of the lawn companies in Florida Shores could do it. Mr. Johnson explained they have to provide insurance and liability coverage. Councilperson Gillespie referred to an incident on 442 when a stone made a ding and she worries about someone suing because of damage. Mr. Johnson explained they try to be cautious with equipment. Council person Gillespie asked about the large piece of equipment Carl wanted that was cut out. Mr. Johnson said Council cut it out and it was a large piece that would do not only that but other areas also. Councilperson Gillespie asked if that's what Mr. Overstreet said they could use on Turgot to clear or cut there and a long canals. Mr. Johnson replied it has two wings. Council person Gillespie asked if it will work for storrnwater. Mr. Johnson replied no, not for ditches. Mr. Billick asked if anything can be cut out of this budget. He referred to page 100, overtime, budgeted $200 this year, and spent $9 last year and why it would be higher this year. Mr. Johnson explained it's there if they have a wind storm or any problem during the winter where they'd have to work extra hours. Mr. Billick asked why it can't be kept in retained earnings. Mr. Johnson replied he can't put the man to work if funds aren't appropriated and you go through an ordinance process to take it out of retained earnings. Mr. Billick noted the previous year was zero. Mayor Wessler asked if he'd have the authority if they had an emergency. Mr. Johnson explained there are certain funds there to be used for emergenc i es such as a water break or washout. He sa i d they can cut all overtime out, but he has a degree in accounting and he did the budget and there's no fat and they don't spend it unless it's needed. He added the two times he's done the budget they've turned money back into the treasury. Mr. Billick stated the first year was the utility tax when it was in utilities and was taken off and turned into the general fund and that increased the turn around in the budget where they got a windfall. He added on page 100, vehicle repairs was an increase of 400% and there were other large increases. Mr. Johnson stated that wasn't a division of the budget prior to that. Council budget was reviewed. Mayor Wessler asked if they have to have life and health insurance since it's a part time job. Mr. Johnson replied that's part of the policy Council adopted years ago that everyone's covered. Councilperson Gillespie said she was told it can be changed if it's unanimously voted on according to Mary Ann. All Council members indicated they'd waive it because they have it and part time workers don't usually have insurance coverage. 2 Council Special Meeting/Workshop December 18, 1990 ~ -...... Council (Continued) Mayor Wessler asked about travel and per diem of $6,500. Mr. Johnson explained travel and per diem, page 28, was changed to $6,000 and they've spent $4,126 so far. Mayor Wessler said she doesn't think they'll need $6,000. Mr. Johnson said if they don1t spend it, it won't go anywhere. Mr. Billick stated the Manager can move the money out. Mr. Johnson explained he's transferred very little and before he makes any line item transfer he'll notify them, but he doesn't have to by Charter. He added they've approved the meet i ng in February (F 1 or i da League). Councilperson Gillespie asked if they go by what they have to attend when they set the budget. Mr. Johnson replied yes. Council person Gillespie asked how much they've allowed for MPO and others. Mr. Johnson replied prior Councils haven't charged mileage for meetings that he's aware of, such as Mr. Gold, who rode with him. Councilperson Gillespie asked if they're allowed to. Mr. Johnson said they charge for League of Cities meetings, Florida League annual meetings and annual legislative Florida League meetings. Councilperson Gillespie asked if all of them put in for what they're attending it would shoot that item. Mr. Johnson replied yes. Mayor Wessler asked about the other insurance for $300. Mr. Johnson replied that's the share of all the insurance. Mayor Wessler asked about rentals and leases for $100 on page 28. Mr. Munoz replied they have it there in case they have to rent anything and in the past they have spent some money there. Councilperson Gillespie asked if they rent buildings when they1re out of City space. Mr. Munoz replied they spent $92 last year. Mr. Johnson said if they buy stationery or business cards it will be charged to Council, and furniture for the office for Mayor and Council will be from this budget and when they have a budget revision, they'll make the changes. Councilperson Gillespie said they did charge 25 cents a copy and it went to 15 cents as the State required under the City Clerk's budget. Mr. Johnson explained they pro rate throughout departments for the copy machine based on volume. Mayor Wessler asked about the $250 for New Smyrna Beach High promotional since they just gave $500. She asked if they get a lot of requests during the year and if they could just take a certain amount for New Smyrna Beach High and they could dish it out. Mr. Johnson said they have various programs, such as Project Graduation, and policy adhered to in the past was if you didn't put a request in you don't get additional funds during the year. He added New Smyrna Beach and School Board also require them to put a request in in advance. Councilperson Gillespie said they usually gave to Show Dolls and Project Graduation each year and this was the one and only time the cheerleaders went to national. Mayor Wessler asked if the $500 will come from promotional. Mr. Johnson replied yes, and when they do the budget adjustment with the ordinance, theylll transfer from unappropriated funds since they approved it at a meeting, such as they did with the bike path. Councilperson Gillespie asked if it's a State requirement to put when they go to a convention under books, subscriptions and publications. Mr. Johnson replied yes, part of it, and the other part goes to another one. Councilperson Gillespie said she'd like to get the book from the League of Municipalities on tapes as George Musson said they're the best Sunshine Law tapes he has. Mr. Johnson asked her to check and have Susan order it. Mayor Wessler asked about $35 per spouse. Mrs. Wadsworth said it's in the budget so they can cut the checks and the person reimburses for that spouse. Councilperson Gillespie asked why they have miscellaneous and then another miscellaneous. Mr. Johnson replied it's for buying a conglomeration of books and publications and can be used for Sunshine Manuals, Florida Statute updates, and tapes. Mayor Wessler said New Smyrna Beach has $250 and Project Graduation is $250. She asked to cut the $250. Mr. Johnson said he thinks it was already paid. Mayor Wessler asked what it's for. Mr. Johnson asked Fred to get the requests. Councilperson Gillespie noted they just paid the yearbook ad. Mr. Billick asked about legality of 6.A., Employees Christmas Gift Certificates, as they cannot use taxpayers money. Council person Gillespie said that was pointed out to her by another city. Mr. Johnson stated it's been done the last 10 to 15 years. Councilperson Gillespie said she was told they changed wording so it's correct. Councilman Hays stated they don1t call them gift certificates, it1s called something else. Mr. Billick said New Smyrna Beach doesn't call it a Christmas party for the employees, they call it a banquet party. Councilman Hays noted it would be employee recognition. Mayor Wessler asked they check on wording. She said she talked with someone at Fame Plastics and the employees 3 Council Special Meeting/Workshop December 18, 1990 ~ .."" Council (Continued) in the City gave up their Christmas gifts and party and donated the money to the kids and bought hundreds of toys. Mr. Johnson said employees did that last year for the hurr i cane and the money was sent to South Caro 1 i na to buy too 1 s. Councilman Hays stated verbiage has to be addressed. Councilperson Gillespie said she likes New Smyrna's model where everyone gets a door prize at the end of the employees. banquet. Mayor Wessler asked that they check the $250 also and cut it if it's not already paid. There was discussion about the ads. Mayor Wessler asked about the citizen information and referral service. Mr. Johnson replied it's a referral service for those that need assistance and it's United Way. Mayor Wessler asked if it's used a lot. Councilperson Gillespie said they'd have to go to United Way to get the back up. Mayor Wessler called a 5-minute recess at 7:50 p.m. and called the meeting back to order at 7:57 p.m. Mayor Wessler asked about Volusia County of Governments. Mr. Johnson replied that IS VCOG and Counc il agreed to contr i bute a certa i n amount. Mr. Munoz explained it's 25 cents per capita. Mayor Wessler asked if they could break the agreement and reduce it. Mr. Johnson replied they tried to raise it to our projected population and be more than 25 cents and we wouldn't do it and this was all we'd pay. Citv Manaqer budget was reviewed. Mayor Wessler asked about $2,000 for overtime. Mr. Johnson replied that1s for Sue, his secretary. Councilman Hays asked about sick time and vacation time cash in and if they are anticipated dollar amounts they see year to year or a percentage of what's available to employees. Mr. Johnson explained that Fred does those people who are eligible and qualified based on the hours and it's all printed out. Councilman Hays said that's money available but not required or made to do. Mr. Munoz noted they may not cash it in. Councilman Hays asked if they can bank it. Mr. Munoz said some people build it up and cash it in every month because they hit the limit of 320 hours. Mayor Wessler asked about travel and per diem. Mr. Johnson replied it's $400 a month for a car and all these items are on his contract and are listed. Mayor Wessler asked if they pay mileage. Mr. Johnson replied outside of Volusia County he gets 21 cents a mile, otherwise car allowance covers it. Mayor Wessler asked if it's car payment and allowance. Mr. Johnson replied it's a car allowance and he's required to have a car and high insurance coverage to protect himself because of driving for the City. Councilperson Martin asked if it would be better to purchase a car. Mayor Wessler asked if his car is leased. Mr. Johnson replied no, because of insurance and most managers don't like to have automobiles because if they leave they don't have transportation. Councilperson Martin noted $400 a month, or $9,300 a year is a pretty good car. Mr. Johnson sa i d he doesn't' get $9,300 a year, that's all the meetings and he doesn't go to national meetings every year. Mayor Wessler asked if it goes back if it1s not spent. Mr. Johnson replied yes, to unappropriated funds. Al Keaton asked if the carryover of sick leave is a State law on limiting the amount of time they can have. Mr. Johnson explained it's based on union contracts and personnel policies and each city's different, with some paying 100% and some 8 hours after so many hours. Mr. Keaton referred to an incident when a Police officer had a problem and some gave theirs to him. Mr. Johnson explained it was a transfer for someone in dire need and Council has to approve it. Mr. Keaton said if they require more time they may be more flexible in carrying over more hours. Mr. Johnson said they're dealing with negotiated union contracts, and every hour they carryover and reserve they have to account for and you have this money set aside in reserve in a financial report. He said they never had to account for it in the past up to a certain amount but now they have to account for all of it and it has to be on the books and our liability is $100,00 for that. Mr. Munoz said it was $130,354 as of 9/30. Mr. Keaton said it was no problem with people turning it over. Mr. Johnson said it depends on the people and the department. Council person Gillespie asked what he anticipates for $1,200 under miscellaneous. Mr. Johnson replied under his contract he gets up to $100 a month expenses. Mayor Wessler asked about miscellaneous other. Mr. Johnson replied it's in case of something not planned for, such as last year they weren't told the maintenance contract on the computers would have to be paid for and they had to pay for that. 4 Council Special Meeting/Workshop December 18, 1990 ......... ........, City Manaaer (Continued) Council person Gillespie said they have to take into consideration increased costs for gas and diesel fuel for the vehicles as it went up 30% since the budget was done. Mr. Johnson explained they anticipated a certain increase but itls decreased from $1.36 to $1.28 at one place in town. He added they'll look at it and give them a report at the end of the quarter. He noted they've asked everyone to be more conservative. There was discussion about mileage on vehicles and miles per gallon they get. Mayor Wessler asked about operating supplies. Mr. Johnson replied that's toner and things. Mayor Wessler asked about office supplies. Mr. Johnson replied it's stationery, paper, envelopes, pens, and pencils, and they buy in bulk through the City Clerk and sign out for what's used. Mr. Billick asked for justification for supplies being 166% over last year. Councilperson Gillespie requested a breakdown. Mr. Johnson said he'll get what they spent last year. Mr. Billick noted it says right there what it was. Mr. Johnson said those weren't audited figures. Mr. Billick said he used those figures and gave them to Council and now they're going back to audit the figures and he doesn't understand. Mayor Wessler requested he get costs for last year, adding it's so high for office supplies everywhere. Mr. Billick said operating supplies is 70% increase in this budget alone and it's every year. He asked if $309 in office supplies on page 30 was what was spent last year. Mr. Johnson replied that wasn't a fu 11 12 months. Mr. Billick said it's a filibuster. Mr. Johnson stated if the man has a complaint, he can file it. Mayor Wessler asked why it's not 12 months. Mr. Johnson explained when it's put together it's not 12 months' expenditures and Council knows it. Councilperson Gillespie said it was in August. Mr. Johnson pointed out every city and county does it that way, it's approximately 9 months, and the insinuation is that staff is trying to pull something but every penny spent on any account is audited by outside auditors. Mayor Wessler noted it wasn't insinuation, and she didn't know it was 9 months. Mr. Billick stated if you take $309 for 9 months, when you divide by 9 then multiply by 12, it's not that amount of money. Mayor Wessler asked for a breakdown and bring it back. Mr. Johnson asked if they want operating and office supplies. Mayor Wessler replied yes. Finance budget was reviewed. Councilperson Gillespie said they budgeted $13,000 for Ernst and Young and will they come in at that figure or less. Mr. Johnson noted they I re under contract. Mr. Munoz exp 1 a i ned th i s year I s contract is $35,000 but it's split out. Mr. Johnson explained this is the second year of their three year contract. Councilperson Gi 11espie referred to a newspaper article regarding an Ernst and Young overrun and that City wasn't told. Mr. Johnson said they did it last year and called him but he told them not to send a bill because they wouldn't pay it since they were under contract and prepaid. He noted if they go above our request for services, they have the right to bill, but for normal auditing services they don't have that right. He said the total's split in the different funds. Mayor Wessler asked about miscellaneous personal costs of $6,400. Mr. Munoz explained that's union negotiated increases and they didn't estimate individual salaries. Mayor Wessler asked about $1,500 overtime and how much was used last year. Mr. Munoz replied the biggest overtime is getting ready for the audit and responding to auditors' requests. He added they've usually closed with November by now but because of interruptions they couldn't get daily closing and month end closing that Karen does. Councilperson Gillespie asked if they audit every account or select some. Mr. Johnson replied they have a percentage they check and they check certain things and read minutes to see what was approved and check invoices and the purchasing procedure, but it's not the way audits were done in the past. Mr. Munoz exp 1 a i ned they come in the summer and look at i nterna 1 controls and depending on how comfortable they are will determine the amount of detail work they do, and they do a lot of analytical work and assign some to staff and then review it. Mr. Johnson pointed out last year was a hard year because it was their first year and prior auditors wouldn't give them work papers and by law they have to be through and filed by March and they're supposed to be done in house by February. Mr. Munoz added field work will be done by Friday and the other is in January. Councilperson Gillespie noted by the time they finish, they're about ready to come back again. Mr. Johnson agreed. 5 Council Special Meeting/Workshop December 18, 1990 ......... 'WfII Finance (Continued) Mayor Wessler asked if he and the Finance Officer go to seminars. Mr. Munoz replied yes. Mayor Wessler asked who takes care of business. Mr. Munoz replied staff, and the longest is 5 days in Sarasota, the other is 3 days. He explained he attends some seminars and Karen attends different ones to cover the entire curriculum. Mayor Wessler asked about miscellaneous seminars. Mr. Munoz replied the customer representatives get mileage to drive their vehicles to the post office or the court house and any miscellaneous travel. Mayor Wessler asked why it's not under travel and per diem. Mr. Munoz replied it's going to DBCC. Mr. Johnson sa i d they had computer courses at DBCC. Mr. Munoz sa i d they had a supervisors course. Councilperson Gillespie asked if new equipment training will be in house or away. Mr. Munoz replied in house. Councilman Hays asked if the company will supply that training. Mr. Munoz replied yes. Mayor Wessler asked about miscellaneous maintenance besides IBM. Mr. Munoz replied if they repair calculators, any printers are not covered, and typewriters. He recalled they had expenses this last year with the system hit by lightning. There was discussion about protective measures taken for power problems. Mayor Wessler asked about printing and binding. Mr. Munoz explained it's accounts payable checks and payroll checks and they take in 65% of the costs. Mayor Wessler asked if it would be cheaper to use one printer. Mr. Johnson replied they bid them and prices vary. Mr. Munoz explained they try to use the same printer as in the past because they'd have the plates. Council person Gillespie noted they have the new computer and asked if he's fully equipped. Mr. Munoz said there's a CRT for himself which he's purchased already. Council- person Gillespie said she's had requests for a drive through window where Finance is because the drop slot won't accommodate handicapped. Mr. Johnson said there's a safe involved and he'll look at it to see if they can accommodate handicapped. Mayor Wessler asked about clothing allowance. Mr. Munoz replied it's per union contract. Mayor Wessler asked about tuition reimbursement since they have misc- ellaneous seminars. Mr. Munoz replied that's travel in regard to seminars. Mr. Munoz said they have FGFOA membership and there's a fee to apply for the certif- icate and reimbursement for classes at DBCC and Stetson, such as he's doing. Mr. Johnson pointed out if they leave the employment within a certain time they have to reimburse the City. Councilman Hays asked if continuing education is keyed to their certain jobs. Mr. Johnson replied yes. Councilperson Gillespie commented on recognition and p.r. with certificates for financing. Leaal Counsel was reviewed. Councilperson Gillespie said sheld like to cut it completely and let all legal bills come through Council until they get a new attorney. Mr. Johnson said nothing will be spent unless they approve it because they don't have an attorney. Mayor Wessler stated according to Nikki Clayton normal procedure is helll stay during the interim of hiring a new attorney and will continue to get his retainer and his hourly fee. She asked if his retainer was just raised. Mr. Johnson replied it was raised $500 a month. Councilperson Gillespie pointed out the old contract said they cannot cut the salary but didn't say they cannot cut his hours. Mr. Johnson said the retainer's a fixed amount and it was approved by the budget and they'd have to ask an attorney. Council- person Gillespie said they'd ask an attorney if they can put it back to pre- budget. Mayor Wessler asked if he's been paid the increase. Mr. Munoz replied yes, for October, November, and December. Councilperson Gillespie said they have to keep the dedicated phone line and others until they get it cleared up. Mr. Johnson said it's up to Council with the fax machine and he needs legal advice with items daily. Mayor Wessler stated they have to keep an open line of communication with Mr. Alvarez until they hire someone else and Mr. Johnson will look into how much it will cost for a full time attorney. Councilman Hays said they'll get that with ad responses. Mr. Johnson explained a full time attorney needs a legal secretary at about $20,000, most attorneys are in the $45,000 range, and they have benefits of about 30%. Councilperson Gillespie said a legal secretary is about $14,000. Mr. Munoz said itls $16-$18,000. Mr. Johnson stated they also need furniture. Councilperson Gillespie stated she didn't say in-house but service is full time which means he doesn't work for any other cities. Councilman Hays said they had an attorney who worked for the City, and for himself, and Orange City. Mr. Johnson said they'll contract that he canlt be an attorney for other cities. Councilperson Gillespie agreed. 6 Council Special Meeting/Workshop December 18, 1990 '-" ....., Leqal Counsel (Continued) Councilman Hays said on books, publications, and subscriptions, held like to strike that or put a hold on the expenditures because he saw in the monthly report a $120 subscription to a legal magazine. Mr. Johnson said it comes to him before it's paid. Mayor Wessler said they need to find out any books or publications paid for in the last 8 years and get them back. Mr. Johnson asked when. Mayor Wessler said when they get a new attorney because he is our attorney until such time as their attorney says no. Georqe Ewinq asked if helll continue getting a retainer. Mayor Wessler replied when they voted to let him go last night it was against their attorneyls judgement and when she called her she was told normal procedure is to continue to use the services until they get someone in his place but they don't know if Mr. Alvarez wants to do that and she's trying to contact his attorney who is difficult to get in touch with. Mr. Ewing asked if they can use another attorney. Mayor Wessler replied they'll see if he's available. Mr. Ewing asked if they'll request his advice. Mayor Wessler replied yes, if they need to, otherwise they'll have to pay this attorney and it would be cheaper to continue with Mr. Alvarez. Mr. Ewing asked if they'll continue to pay a retainer if they ask for advice. Mayor Wessler replied right, if they ask for advice. Mr. Johnson said his retainer covers basic things and anything above that is billed on a fee basis. Mayor Wessler asked if what he's asking for is basic stuff. Mr. Johnson replied yes, he has a letter needing response and some things pending. Mayor Wessler said it's a $30 hourly fee. Mr. Johnson pointed out they increased his fees, not just the retainer. Mr. Billick said it doesn't show in the line item. Mr. Johnson said it was discussed and approved by Council to be $50 an hour and $2,500 retainer. Mayor Wess ler asked what Greenburg IS retained for. Mr. Johnson replied the special exception through the County, for preparing documents for settlement with the environmental group about dumping in the river, and representing the City in the lawsuit regarding the restaurant. Mayor Wessler asked if Mr. Alvarez could have done that. Mr. Johnson replied Mr. Alvarez represented the City or the individuals and it was split. He noted LDRA and Council members were personally sued. Mayor Wessler asked if it's part of his job to represent all of them. Council person Gillespie said the contract says it. Mr. Johnson explained he gets the Attorney's budget and Council tells him what to do the same as with Council budget and they make determinations. Mayor Wessler said they're done with him except for the restaurant. She stated they paid $16,000 the last 3 weeks. Councilperson Gillespie said it's $50,000 total. Mayor Wessler asked if they could retain a law firm. Councilperson Gillespie said they could have a whole firm under retainer. Mr. Johnson replied that was the City's intent originally when they hired Greenburg. Mayor Wessler asked if they can hire a law firm to represent them in house and if there are other problems go to them. Councilperson Gillespie suggested they find a firm with an expert in every field. Mr. Johnson replied it's different with different cities and if there are special cases the attorney goes outside. Councilperson Gillespie stated New Smyrna Beach is in house and he only called in one the last year. Mayor Wessler suggested they not pay any more Greenburg bills unless they're itemized and Council sees them first. Councilperson Gillespie stated part came out of self-insurance. Mr. Johnson asked if they want to stop anything regarding the lawsuit. Mayor Wessler replied just let them know since they have other legal fees besides the $44,000 in Mr. Alvarez's budget. Dominick Fazzone stated the firm in Miami represents the defendants, the individuals, and Mr. Alvarez represents the City and the suit was in court and has been thrown out against the defendants and cannot be filed with a higher court as it was thrown out with prejudice. Mayor Wessler asked if it's just a suit against the City, and if Mr. Alvarez can do it. Mr. Johnson said any bills that come in he'll get from Fred Munoz to give to the Mayor. Council person Gillespie noted they paid their last bill with the effluent settlement. Mayor Wessler asked when it was dismissed. Mr. Fazzone replied sometime last week. Councilperson Gillespie asked if they dismissed both individuals. Mr. Fazzone replied Mr. Alvarez got it thrown out against the individuals and it's still pending against the City. Mayor Wessler said they have to be sure it's turned over to Mr. Alvarez now so they don't have to pay outside counsel. Councilperson Gillespie stated he asked for an outside attorney for the two members of LDRA and it should clear it back to him. Planninq and Zoninq was reviewed. Mayor Wessler asked about the new Code Enforcement Officer. Councilperson Gillespie stated she'd like to freeze any open positions and not hire anyone for open positions. Mr. Johnson said the need 7 Council Special Meeting/Workshop December 18, 1990 ..... -... Plannina and Zonina (Continued) is there and theylll cut if they get to a point but they arenlt to that point. Mayor Wessler stated theylre about to embark on the CIP and she agrees to cut it. Councilman Hays asked how theylre providing services now. Mr. Johnson said they have one person and with the size of the City and number of complaints to be sure it1s followed up is too much for one person. Councilman Hays asked how much overtime the person gets. Mr. Johnson replied no overtime unless he comes in with a problem as they did with one person doing it on the week-end, and there are a large number of cases and preparing cases and follow through to comply with the law. Councilman Hays asked how many cases arenlt in compliance with the law regarding investigations and follow up. Mark Karet, Planning & Zoning Director, stated there were over 1,800 the last 11 months, 11 months prior to that was 830, and they went from 75 violations to 164 a month. He pointed out Pat DiLeva doesn1t work as full time code enforcement because he also serves as Safety Director. Mayor Wessler asked if all cities have Safety Directors. Mr. Johnson replied most cities do and that's how we keep our insurance down. Councilman Hays asked if cases are classified according to seriousness, such as 1, 2, 3, or if theylre equally investigated. Mr. Karet explained they work under two systems, one is a complaint system and they investigate all whether a name is given or not and he goes out and personally verifies a violation occurred and he spends his day patrolling the City looking for Code violations. He noted there is a range of violations and some are more serious than others. Councilman Hays said a large amount are probably minor, some are mid-range, and a small percentage are more serious violations. Mr. Karet agreed. Mr. Johnson pointed out any violation is a violation and itls serious to the person that calls in and therels a lot of area to cover. He added the additional officer request came from the Mayor and Council because they couldnlt cover all complaints. Mr. Karet said there are far more violations they cannot handle with two additional officers. Councilperson Gillespie said sheld like to look into this because it was suggested they have someone part time to assist to do patrolling and looking for violations and it never came before Council to discuss it and this Council could look into it. Mr. Johnson said held rather not have that and itls best if they can do the citations. He said they need to split the City in two parts and each one would work one of the areas, and they check for business licenses. Mayor Wess ler asked what the Safety Director does. Mr. Johnson replied he investigates any accident involving a City vehicle or City personnel. Mayor Wessler asked about Police. Mr. Johnson explained Police donlt investigate their own accidents, this helps with insurance, and Pat gives safety lectures and works with the insurance company. Councilperson Gillespie asked if Mike Hayes could check licenses when he does fire inspections. Fire & Rescue Chief Bill Vola stated there were never any inspections other than new businesses prior to Mike being hired and they havenlt caught up with one-third of the Cityls businesses and Mike is swamped. Council- person Gillespie said then it would be annual and he could check the licenses then. Mr. Johnson said therels the matter of the person that comes in and opens without a license and it depends on whether they want aggressive code enforcement or not. Mayor Wessler asked about $4,000 overtime when they get a new Code Enforcement Officer. Mr. Johnson explained the overtime is documents until they get done with DCA. Mr. Karet said they use a lot of overtime because they have a lot of boards that meet and provide support for some and every time a secretary or staff person goes they pay overtime. Councilman Hays asked if it's anytime someone attends a meeting in the evenings or week-ends other than regular time they1re paid overtime. Mr. Karet noted itls not Department Heads. Councilperson Gillespie said they have two vehicles and one Code Enforcement Officer. Mr. Johnson explained the Safety Officer has it at night and the other will be left at City Hall. Mayor Wessler asked if the Safety Officer goes out at night. Chief Vola noted on the arson fire Pat came and he comes to just about any structure fire and video tapes actions of officers to have photographic record of conditions found as well as actions and activities of firefighters to review what they did to prevent any workers comp incidents. Mr. Johnson referred to the acc i dent th i s week at 30th and Kumquat and Pat I s photographs. Mayor Wessler asked if Pat will go out at night when they get a new Code Enforcement Officer or will the new person be trained as Safety Officer. Mr. Johnson replied Pat will be Safety until he retires, when he leaves, whoever takes his place will be trained to do that. Councilperson Gillespie asked who drives the other vehicle. Mr. Johnson said itls parked. Mr. Karet replied itls for a new officer, itls a 1981 Dodge with over 100,000 miles. 8 Council Special Meeting/Workshop December 18, 1990 ~ .. .."" Planninq and Zoninq (Continued) Councilperson Gillespie asked if telephone lines are dedicated to call anywhere in the County. Mr. Johnson replied no, just to the City Attorney. Mayor Wessler said it's $89,000 over last year's budget and it's too much. Council person Gillespie asked for justification for the GIS program. Mr. Johnson explained it ties into the County system and they couldn1t afford to do it all and records are updated. Councilperson Gillespie asked to see justification because not every city got involved in it. Mr. Johnson said most cities are involved in it now and have had it several years. He explained some of the features. Mayor Wessler said she'd like to cut a substantial amount from this budget, whether where they want to or let him figure it out. Councilperson Gillespie agreed. Mr. Johnson said the budget is up $21,000 from last year. Mayor Wessler noted last year was 175. Mr. Johnson explained that wasn't the full year and they need to compare the budget to what was requested. Councilman Hays asked if it's 220. Mr. Johnson replied those aren't audited figures, the 1989 budget was less because code enforcement wasnlt there, it was taken from another area, they were without a Planner for some months and therel s an increase in insurance. He pointed out they have revenue to offset part of it with a State grant. Mayor Wessler stated she wants to cut out the Code Enforcement Officer or freeze it. Councilman Hays suggested they could freeze it until March when they have a quarterly report and they can pursue it then. Councilperson Gillespie agreed. Mr. Johnson stated helll just the fill the position for Pat DiLeva. Mayor Wessler asked about clothing. Mr. Johnson replied itls under operating supplies for three employees. There was brief discussion about copies required for the Comprehensive Plan. Councilperson Gillespie asked the cost of Code books. Mr. Johnson replied they do supplements and it depends on how many ordinances they send in, but they don1t buy the books, just the supplements, and they have a contract with Municipal Code. Mayor Wessler asked about the telephone answering machine. Mr. Karet replied there's none. Mayor Wessler asked about the 35MM camera with flash and date stamp for $475. Mr. Johnson explained that's code enforcement and safety and it's saved them several thousand dollars in insurance claims because it has a date on it. Mayor Wessler asked if they could write the date on the back and if they can set the date on the camera. Mr. Karet agreed they could do it. Mr. Johnson said they've held up and itls the same with the video tape. Mr. Karet said it's not questioned the same way. Mayor Wessler asked about mobile radios. Mr. Johnson replied that's to contact them and radios are in the vehicles. Mr. Karet exp 1 a i ned one is for the Code Enforcement Off i cer and the add it i ona 1 officer would have one. Mayor Wessler said that will be cut now. Mr. Karet agreed it would not be purchased. Councilperson Gillespie asked if he wears a beeper for fire. Mr. Johnson replied yes. Mayor Wessler stated thatls too much for a camera and a dated film you can adjust, and asked to find out from the insurance company if it can be written on the back. Mr. Johnson explained this was for the new Code Enforcement Officer because they take pictures of any code violations. Councilperson Gillespie asked if theylre required by the State to take pictures with date and time. Mr. Johnson replied no, but to keep them from getting in legal problems, it's like an investigation, itls kept claims down and has paid for itself. Council person Gillespie asked if they need that particular camera. Mr. Johnson explained they bought one last year and wanted one with all the features. Councilperson Gillespie asked if it was County purchase or if they can get a better deal buying with someone else. Mr. Johnson replied it's not an item on State bid. Mayor Wessler asked if Police pictures have a date. Chief Schumaker replied no. Mr. Johnson stated itls a different situation and they're talking about insurance investigation. Mayor Wessler stated they can put that on hold. She said each mobile radio is $470. Mr. Johnson replied yes. Council person Gillespie said she'd like more prices on radios but there's nothing wrong with Motorola. Mr. Johnson said the radios are under State bid. Councilperson Gillespie said she likes to work with the County and State where we usually do better. Mayor Wessler said they're already up over $4,000 for office supplies and it's only been four budgets. City Clerk budget was reviewed. Councilperson Gillespie asked if they purchase City directories for reference. Mrs. Wadsworth replied yes, plus subscription. Council person Gillespie asked how many subscriptions they have to the News Journal and News Observer. Mr. Johnson replied one for the City Clerk, Planning and Zoning, and for ads. Mayor Wessler asked why they have a paper for Planning and Zoning. Mr. Johnson replied they get ads published in the paper. Mayor Wessler asked to get the ones from the City Clerk when they have deadlines. 9 Council Special Meeting/Workshop December 18, 1990 'lIw' .....- Other Qovernment services (Continued) Council person Gillespie said if they have date 1 ine attached, it makes it a legal article and they can run copies of it. Mayor Wessler stated only the City Clerk needs a newspaper and the rest can buy their own. A gentleman in the audience asked if there I s a reason why he hasn I t seen a building permit in the paper for 6 to 8 weeks. Chief Vola replied the County puts those in. The gentleman said they have building sales but not permits. Mrs. Wadsworth explained they supply the County with a copy of our building permits and itls up to them. The gentleman said they used to be in the Pennysaver. Mayor Wessler asked about printing and binding. Mrs. Wadsworth replied it's printed City stationery. Mayor Wessler asked about $9,000. Mrs. Wadsworth said she supplies all the copy paper. Councilman Hays asked about travel and per diem for elections clerks on page 48. Mrs. Wadsworth replied they have to pay elections clerks' mileage to take results to Deland. Councilman Hays said he thought the County paid that. Mrs. Wadsworth explained itls shared with them. Mayor Wessler asked about clothing. Mrs. Wadsworth replied itls for Lisa and Mary Ann. Councilperson Gillespie asked if pet tags is cost effective. Mrs. Wadsworth replied yes. Mayor Wessler asked about dues and tuition. Mrs. Wadsworth explained it's for her and also Lisa will be going to the Occupational Licensing seminars due to a new requirement in 1991. Councilperson Gillespie asked about her course tuition. Mrs. Wadsworth said it's the City Clerks Institute. Mayor Wessler asked about a scanner. Mrs. Wadsworth replied it's a full page scanner, it scans and copies a full page of materials for upcoming newsletters and publications because she does have a PC computer. Councilperson Gillespie stated they could use a City newspaper, and asked about the cut of the d i sp 1 ay termi na 1. Mrs. Wadsworth rep 1 i ed that was the one position that was cut. Other Qovernment services was reviewed. Mayor Wessler asked what this covers. Mrs. Wadsworth replied it's City Hall left over like bug spraying. Mayor Wessler asked how many contracts they have for bug spraying. Mr. Johnson replied two. Mayor Wessler asked if it would be cheaper to go with one. Mr. Johnson replied this is what they did when they went out for quotes. Councilperson Gillespie asked if it's a different type of service with grounds to be sprayed. Mayor Wessler asked if $1,000 for a negotiator is no matter how long it takes. Mr. Johnson replied it will be over that and once it's settled, it will be over. Councilman Hays asked who it is. Mr. Johnson replied Tom Johnson. Councilperson Gillespie commented on the figure shown for street lights as she thought there was less in the fund. Mr. Johnson explained this is what they pay lease for street lights and they add on constantly when people put requests in and then they notify the power company. He added there's a legal issue in court about the impact fee and they need to talk to the City Attorney about it. He noted this will go up as development occurs, it's a flat fee per pole per month, and if power lines are in back, they have to secure easements and pay costs to get lines from the back to the front. Mayor Wes s 1 er asked about the postage mach i ne renta 1 of $130 a month. Mr. Johnson repl ied it feeds letters through and stamps and weighs them. Mayor Wessler asked if it's water bills. Mr. Johnson replied that's through a permit. Mayor Wessler asked about the mail system. Mr. Johnson replied that's the weighing system and openers. Councilperson Gillespie asked if they own it or are buying it. Mr. Munoz replied it's Pitney-Bowes, they don't sell them. Councilperson Gillespie asked if it includes maintenance. Mr. Johnson replied yes, and calibration periodically when they check it. Mayor Wessler asked how it went from $277,000 down so low. Mr. Johnson replied the computer system was purchased and financed and costed out that year. Councilperson Gillespie asked if there was no where else to categorize and these are left over. Mr. Johnson explained they're not charged to one department, it's like an administrative department where insurance goes and all budgets usually have one category. Mayor Wessler asked about the two new registers. Mr. Johnson said that's the system for receipting and registers and training goes with that. Councilperson Gi llespie noted they went through Counci 1. Counci lman Hays asked about software. Mr. Johnson said it ties into the computer system and writes up right then. Mayor Wessler asked the number of years for debt service for computer equipment. Mr. Munoz replied it's over 3 years, as of 9/30 they owe $44,000, and they pay $22,000 in February-March and the other $22,000 the following year. Mayor 10 Council Special Meeting/Workshop December 18, 1990 ........ ......" Other Government Services (Continued) Wessler asked how much interest they'd save to pay it off now. Mr. Johnson replied per the Comprehensive Plan obligation, they're required to keep certain amounts in reserve for the capital improvements elements and they can use it and if it's over a certain percent of interest they should consider paying it off. Mr. Munoz explained interest was 7.53 on the computer and fire trucks was 12. Councilperson Gillespie asked if they're financed or lease option. Mr. Johnson replied lease option and it will be City property when paid off and most cities go for lease option for fire trucks. Mayor Wessler asked how much is owed on Lanier. Mr. Munoz replied $7,803 as of 9/30. Mayor Wessler asked when payments are due. Mr. Munoz replied itls monthly payments of $311.86. Councilperson Gillespie said they could pay it off. Mr. Johnson said they'll corne back with proper documents to pay it off. Mayor Wessler asked about another computer. Mr. Munoz said they have debt service on principal and then interest expense and it's separate. Councilperson Gillespie said if they payoff Lanier, how much will he put on debt. Mr. Munoz replied it's less than $7,803 because they1ve been paying on it. Mr. Johnson pointed out they'll still have to pay maintenance. Maintenance budget was reviewed. Councilperson Gillespie asked if Parks and Recreation does painting of buildings. Mr. Johnson replied no, the Maintenance Department does. Parks and Recreation Director Jack Corder stated he purchases materials. Mayor Wessler asked about painting the van for $450 and if it's been done. Public Works Director Carl Overstreet replied yes. Mayor Wessler asked about travel and per diem schooling. Mr. Overstreet replied the foreman was sent to DSCC for a management course. Mr. Johnson explained they do all basic maintenance. Mr. Overstreet noted they do school bus stops. Mayor Wessler asked if they could buy small tools rather than rent them. Mr. Overstreet explained he may need a pavement breaker for a couple of hours and not need it for a year so it's not feasible to purchase it and maintain it. Mr. Johnson stated they rent when they change lights on tennis courts and pay one day's rental. Councilman Hays asked if the small hand tools are replacement items. Mr. Overstreet explained they moved from one division to another and are in the process of building the inventory and they secure the tools in the bin. Mayor Wess 1 er asked about other current charges on page 58. Counc il person Gillespie asked how many tools they are talking about for three men as it's a high cost. Mayor Wessler said if it comes in under bid, it would be less. Mr. Overstreet explained itls the type of thing they use periodically and don't have. Councilperson Gillespie said she knows they need work boots and they're expensive. There was brief discussion about hard toe shoes. City Enqineer budget - Councilperson Gillespie said she had no questions on this and would like to put some back. Special Recreation Facilities was reviewed. Mayor Wessler asked what this is. Mr. Johnson replied the Community Center, shuffleboard area, and the janitor for setting it up. Council person Gillespie suggested they raise rents for City buildings. Councilman Hays asked why the radio for a van on page 63 wasn1t approved. Mr. Johnson rep 1 i ed they had money in 1 ast year I s budget and it was purchased. Councilman Hays said it1s just as important that he have it as some one else. Councilperson Gillespie noted he's on the road all the time. Mayor Wess ler asked about operat ing supplies. Mr. Johnson replied that IS uniforms and flags and cleaning supplies and she keeps the facility very clean. Council person Gillespie again suggested they look at increasing rates. Mr. Johnson said they'll look at it between now and the next budget. Mayor Wessler said she doesn't know about increasing rates in the Community Center because there's no where else for the community to go. Councilperson Gillespie stated this isn't the only place they rent and it would help to raise it from $22.50 to $25.00. She asked to have the exact cost. Police budget was reviewed. Council person Gillespie asked the status of the evidence building. Mr. Johnson replied they have one until they do the CIP and the sewer plant and then they'll need something and it will be behind Carl's office. Councilperson Gillespie said it has to be a locked, secured building. Councilman Hays asked if the open positions Johnson replied there are no open positions. 11 on page 69 are st ill open. Mr. Councilperson Gillespie said Mrs. Council Special Meeting/Workshop December 18, 1990 ,....... ...., Police (Continued) Floyd is on maternity leave and Jeff's to go to Saudi. Chief Schumaker said yes. Councilperson Gillespie said he's only short handed by two. Mr. Johnson explained they.re getting into administration and he's discussed it with the Chief, they're going to get through the end of January and he'll come back to them after he eva 1 uates it and he strong 1 y supports the Po 1 ice Department. Councilperson Gillespie asked if another officer will work the schools while Mrs. Floyd1s off. Mr. Johnson replied Cheryl Osborne's handling it. Chief Schumaker explained open positions are the two auxiliary for 15 hours a week that were cut from the last budget by the last Council. Mr. Johnson said they couldn't find qualified people for the positions and other positions have been filled. Mayor Wessler asked about $45,000 for overtime. Mr. Johnson replied that will probably be low. Mayor Wessler asked about hiring another officer. Mr. Johnson explained that won't solve the problems and the holiday time off granted by Council will generate overtime plus for water and wastewater. He said overtime changes from 40ls to high 60.s and they have a manning schedule and have to have so many on the road all the time and they have to cover vacations and some have been here for years and get up to 5 weeks. Mayor Wessler asked about professional services. Mr. Johnson replied it's rent a cop and we get reimbursed when people need security or something's going on. Chief Schumaker explained the carnival may hire two Police officers. Council- person Martin asked if it's ours. Chief Schumaker replied yes, but the problem with doing it on their own time is if an officer's injured it's a complex problem on how he gets paid by workers I comp as they're paid by the City and the City's reimbursed by the vendor. Mayor Wessler asked about Dr. Vanis. Mrs. Wadsworth replied that's the vet. Mr. Johnson explained they have an Animal Control Officer and if there's a problem they deal with the vet. Mayor Wessler asked about repair of vehicles. Chief Schumaker replied they have 4 cars with 100,000 plus miles and the cars take a beating because of unpaved roads, especially in the Spring when it's a washboard and they travel at high speeds at times. He said they're trying to maintain them as much as possible. Mayor Wessler asked how many marked cars they have. Chief Schumaker replied 13. Mayor Wessler asked how many unmarked. Chief Schumaker rep 1 i ed 5. Mayor Wess 1 er asked how many sworn off i cers. Ch i ef Schumaker rep 1 i ed 28, add i ng they have an ACO truck a 1 so. He exp 1 a i ned how vehicles are on 12 hours and then off 12 with an average of 2,100-2,500 miles a month per car. Mayor Wessler asked about communication services for car phones on page 72. Mr. Johnson replied detectives have car phones and the Chief has one and the cost is cheaper than radios. Chief Schumaker referred to an informant's contact with an officer in the field using a phone where he couldn't have done it on the radio. Mr. Johnson said they keep tabs and review bills and if they look out of line, they check them out. Councilperson Gillespie said someone on a scanner can pick it up on a cellular. Chief Schumaker explained they have to be in the range. Mayor Wessler asked about pager rentals, and if they buy them. Mr. Johnson replied no, it's for detectives and changes periodically. Chief Schumaker explained you buy the service when you rent it and the tower. Mr. Johnson noted you get a wider range. Mayor Wessler asked about a lease car. Chief Schumaker replied it's in case there1s a need. Mr. Johnson stated one officer will be assigned to a drug area this year. Mayor Wessler asked about re-roofing the Police building. Mr. Johnson replied that will be taken care of and they've had the building repainted inside and out through Community Services. Mr. Johnson reviewed the reimbursement process for training under the County fine system. Mayor Wessler suggested they cut his newspaper and he can use the City Clerk IS. Councilman Hays said on page 74, furniture for new Detective and Lieutenant and replace worn out, they could use in Council's new office. Mr. Johnson said it's already purchased and what was there wasn't worth using. Councilperson Gillespie asked about educational materials for programs for schools and if there's enough for bike safety because money doesn't come from the State any more and they have 1,500 elementary kids. Chief Schumaker said if Diane or Cheryl decide to purchase, that's fine. He said they put on Officer Phil the last 4 years but opted out of it because it served its purpose and it's too much of a burden to collect money and get it from the place in New Jersey. 12 Council Special Meeting/Workshop December 18, 1990 '-- ...., Police (Continued) Councilman Hays asked about typewriters. Mr. Johnson said they were purchased and the Lieutenant does a lot of reports in house without secretarial help. Councilman Hays said there's a computer purchase he thought was replacing a typewriter. Mr. Munoz noted it's a CRT. Mayor Wessler asked about $500 miscellaneous. Mr. Johnson said he has detailed requests. Mr. Munoz noted he spent $2,262 this year. Councilperson Gillespie asked about the roof. Mr. Johnson replied it will be transferred later on and helll give them a memo but they're deciding what type of roof. Mayor Wessler asked if they're replacing 4 vehicles. Chief Schumaker replied they're turning in 4 and buying 3. Mayor Wessler asked about the other officer that dr i ves the other car. Ch i ef Schumaker rep 1 i ed they had a traff i c car assigned to each traffic officer but now have put both traffic officers in one car. Mayor Wessler asked what a traffic officer does. Chief Schumaker explained they're responsible for 50% of traffic enforcement and do traffic investigations and accident homicides and answer citizen complaints about speed with a daily report submitted of activity. He noted they're averaging $12-$14,000 a month in fines back to the City. Mayor Wessler asked if they ride together. Chief Schumaker replied no, two days on and then two days off. Mayor Wessler asked if it will last longer. Mr. Johnson replied he doesn1t think it will make a difference this year and he asked Council to cut one car and next year they'll budget it. He added it will sit a shift every once in awhile and instead of 3 back up cars they'll have 2 for when they1re being serviced or repaired. Mayor Wessler called a recess at 9:50 p.m. and called the meeting back to order at 9:56 p.m. Fire budget was reviewed. Counci lperson Gi llespie stated the request for additional air packs were held until tonight. She said Dragers are manufactured in Germany and she called a man from Metro Dade who had purchased 1,000 of them and she's talked to other departments. She added there's nothing wrong with the equipment but she wanted additional justification they needed equipment at this time which he said he'd provide. She said the only problem is they have a reciprocal agreement with other departments and they use Scott air packs and this requires a lot of training and it's recommended minimum 40 hours per man. She said their department made several changes in equipment after they put it into use. Fire and Rescue Chief Bill Vola said he most definitely needs the air packs and proof was the arson fire because every air pack they had was in service and there was nothing in reserve for any additional alarms. He said he's running with two pumpers and an attack truck with air packs and two pumpers that don't have air packs. He pointed out that all firefighters are required 40 hours of air pack training annually regardless of who manufactures it. He added that regarding compatibility, they used some Scott air packs and Cliftons with the Drager. He reviewed who manufactures the composites and said they went with the upgraded pressure to have smaller tanks that are lighter weight. Councilperson Gillespie asked if it's buddy breathing. Chief Vola replied yes, and Scott doesn't have that, and in the last 3 years their equipment went through OSHA and other approval process. He stated he trained on Scott 15 years ago, it's been upgraded but doesn't represent state of the art nor is it compatible with other particular tanks and they've had problems with the local Scott vendor. He said he's a certified trainer and they had recalls on Scott and he didn1t receive notice nor did New Smyrna Beach, DBCC, or the water plant, and he notified New Smyrna Beach and provided DBCC and the water plant with repair kits. He said volunteers and career people felt, based on those shortcomings and the fact this was a piece of equipment their 1 ives depended on, it was the most desirable piece of equipment. Councilman Hays asked if they tried it themselves. Chief Vola replied yes and Council received a report. Mr. Johnson replied the men tried them. Councilperson Gillespie stated number 1 is what the men want. Chief Vola stated what they had before was non-certified and wasn't meant to be fire- fighting equipment. Councilperson Gillespie asked if they got rid of Cliftons. Chief Vola replied yes, at the next auction or will advertise in AWWA because they're suitable for water or sewer plants but aren't acceptable for fire. Councilperson Gillespie asked if the Water Plant's was refurbished. Chief Vola replied one was because an OSHA inspector said it was okay for water plant use. Councilperson Gillespie asked if he'll carry one in his vehicle. Chief Vola replied yes. Councilperson Gillespie asked if he drives his vehicle. Chief Vola replied they also use it to go to Orlando to take tests and the Fire Inspector's has over 250,000 miles. There was brief discussion about trading of vehicles. Councilperson Gillespie asked if he'll be adequately supplied with the Dragers. 13 Council Special Meeting/Workshop December 18, 1990 ,... ~ Fire (Continued) Chief Vola replied it will be 19 Dragers and he doesn't want to mix air packs especially in a volunteer mixed environment and will put Scott in a secondary role and the water plant is going to try to buy two of them for the new plant. Councilperson Gillespie asked about masks for each man. Chief Vola replied he agrees with it but doesn't think it's realistic with volunteers using it also and it1s $115. Councilperson Gillespie asked if they can use Clorox for sealing. Chief Vola replied yes. Don Gillespie asked if there's more than one source to refill the Dragers. Chief Vola replied at any certified breathing compressed air source and it has to be class E air or better. Councilperson Gillespie said he's getting the air packs. Mayor Wessler asked about the Ranger pick up with extended cab. Mr. Johnson said it's to haul people and supplies and equipment to the site. Councilman Hays asked if the king cab is for air packs. Chief Vola replied yes plus the inspector's library. Mr. Johnson pointed out Mike Hayes responds to fires also. Councilperson Gillespie asked if that's adequate equipment to protect volunteers and paid men. Chief Vola replied yes, all but two are trained on these air packs, and one who missed the session put the air pack on and was ordered out of the bu il ding because they won I t take 1 i ab il i ty of an untra i ned person. Councilperson Gillespie said she'd talked with him about ordering smaller sized gear for females. Chief Vola said they1ve started manufacturing smaller sizes. Mayor Wessler asked about the water bill. Chief Vola said it1s to fill fire truck tanks and for training because they don1t pump salt water or untreated water through the vehicles. Mayor Wessler asked about janitorial supplies. Chief Vola replied he has three facilities, station 1, station 2, and the administrative offices, and this is for all three buildings. Councilperson Gillespie asked about promotional activities as held mentioned something for Fire Prevention Week and they started into the first program at both schools put on by State Farm. She asked what programs he I d put in for $2,500. Chief Vola replied insurance industry programs seem to be self serving and he1s interested in teaching children fire awareness on an NEA recognized and developed program which is called "Learn Not to Burn" and it includes stop, drop and roll. He added they teach the teachers how to follow the curriculum. Mayor Wessler asked if they give handouts. Chief Vola explained each teacher gets a curriculum course book, it1s copyrighted and was developed with NEA and it costs for that program but it's proven itself across the nation as well as Volusia County. Councilman Jones stated it's a good program and they have it in New Smyrna. He explained he adopted a third grade class and teaches them throughout the year on all these subjects and he had to take a course. Chief Vola said he doesn't have staff to do that. Councilman Jones explained the program used at Coronado Elementary and Read Pattillo, adding it's an excellent program and will save a lot of lives. Councilperson Gillespie asked if the volunteers in uniform could do it. Chief Vola replied part of the problem is volunteers are working then. Mayor Wessler asked if itls both schools. Chief Vola replied just Edgewater Elementary because they weren1t sure when the other school would open. There was discussion about the number of students held planned on. Councilperson Gillespie asked if firefighters from volunteers could adopt a class because coming in with a uniform is more effective. Chief Vola replied the scheduled duty personnel will be going into the classroom but teachers will conduct the curriculum and they go in on a quarterly basis. There was brief discussion on education needed to teach it. Councilperson Gillespie asked if it's an annual expense or one time. Chief Vola said one time for this elementary school and next year he'll ask for the other school but they1re contingent on the curriculum counselor and principal of the schools. Councilman Hays asked if we pay it completely. Chief Vola replied yes. Council person Gillespie said itls non- recurring after the initial purchase. Chief Vola agreed. Mayor Wessler asked if film developing is for fire inspections. Chief Vola said Mr. Barlow is the official photographer and he's taken pictures that have been very helpful. He pointed out they try to photo document for training purposes and for documentation of the situation and actions. Councilperson Gillespie stated people are talking about trucks on the road. Mr. Johnson explained he1s dealt with firefighters 25 years and if they leave the trucks in the station and they1re going to do inspections and have to go back 14 Council Special Meeting/Workshop December 18, 1990 ~ """"", Fire (Continued) to the station, it1s an increase in time and if someone has a heart attack they'd have a serious problem. He pointed out volunteer response time compared to full time firefighters is a difference and that's because he's in the truck and is available and it gets there in a hurry. He added volunteers have a good response time but Mike Hays can be on an inspection and he drops it and goes to a fire. Councilperson Gillespie explained they aren't complaining about the fire inspector but the big trucks. Mayor Wessler asked if they do this in New Smyrna Beach. Councilman Jones replied all the time and rarely are they in the station. Chief Vola said it's the same in other cities. Mr. Johnson said the first time a person's life isn't saved is when they'll have a problem and that's why they put additional firefighters on as they'll have 5 days, 24 hour coverage and volunteers will cover week-ends. He pointed out one of the biggest services is rescue. Councilperson Gillespie said they don't want to get in the business of transport. Mr. Johnson agreed. Councilperson Martin said she spoke the other night about fire trucks because she lived on the outskirts of a city and had paid firemen and could see trucks running around town because they could get to the fire easier but they never did. Chief Vola said some places have tried fire patrol and it doesn't work. Council- person Martin said she sees them on the road all the time and doesn't appreciate it. Councilman Jones explained they have driver engineers and trainees and they have to get so many hours to be able to handle a truck and they have pre-fire training. Councilperson Gillespie said she sees fire trucks with everyone at Fat Bob's and the post office and bank and the public sees this and they don't like it. Mayor Wessler said she'd tell them to put themselves in a position where they're dropping dead of a heart attack. Councilperson Gillespie said they're seeing the fire truck and not ambulances and they're at the same restaurant. Chief Vola said it's because they're across from the fire station. Council person Martin asked liability if they're involved in an accident not concerned with going to a fire. Mr. Johnson said they're on duty. Chief Vola replied it's the same as a Police car on routine patrol or him going to City Hall. Councilperson Martin stated they don't expect a fire truck to be on routine patrol. Chief Vola said they don't make frivolous runs and prior to the gas crisis they were told to make two trips to City Hall during the day for mail and equipment pick up and they combine trips in case they have to go by the bank or to pick up equipment and they don't make special trips for personal errands. Mayor Wessler suggested they weigh complaints compared to a lawsuit they may get if they have to go back to the station. Councilman Hays said these men are human and have to take care of creature comforts and have to go to the bank. Councilman Hays asked about books, publications and subscriptions for $8,225. Mr. Johnson explained the budget's not just for full time but also for volunteers and training programs. Mayor Wessler asked if any can be cut out. Chief Vola replied this was already cut. Councilman Hays said this is required for these people to be able to function in their job. Chief Vola agreed. Councilperson Gillespie said they could do away with the washer/dryer. Chief Vola replied yes, but the Jaws of Life is 10 years old and the pump failed and Hurst said they couldn't even rebuild it and the cost of replacement without the conversion kit would be $1,400, not including labor, and it came to $1,850 and they can't do without the Jaws of Life, and bought the Hurst instead of the washer/dryer. Councilman Hays asked if new positions are filled. Chief Vola replied no. Mr. Johnson explained he cannot advertise until January and by the time they get them on board it will be the middle of February. Councilman Hays asked if they will be full time 7 days a week. Chief Vola replied Monday through Friday with 24 hour coverage. Councilperson Gillespie asked if they1re coming from our volun- teers. Chief Vola replied he has 2 volunteers and the second may not be eligible because he failed his program and will retest after Christmas but he isn't a certified EMT. There was brief discussion about qualifications of candidates. Mr. Johnson noted they're getting good response from females as well as males. Councilman Hays asked if professional services drug screen and inoculations are bid out. Chief Vola explained the information is from Fish Hospital Lab and hepatitis is from Volusia County Health Department and he'll administer the inoculations, this is ~ost of the screen and serum and post series screen to be sure they have antibodies in the blood. He said pulmonary, career stress and drug screen was Fish. Councilman Hays asked if it's 30 at $71 each for drug screen. Chief Vola replied yes, and it's a physical and EKG test and then the urine test. Mayor Wessler asked the number of volunteers. Chief Vola replied 15 Council Special Meeting/Workshop December 18, 1990 ~"W' ~ Fire (Continued) 28 active and the former rolls showed active, retired, and inactive. He said they've broken down into 4 response teams, each works a 12 hour shift or covers that 12 hours, and all teams are on active call for an alarm of significance. He noted the total count was 23 Edgewater firefighters and 4 from New Smyrna for Fat Bob's fire which was an excellent turn out. He explained each team has a leader that coordinates their activities to make sure calls are covered. Councilperson Gillespie said the only additional cost is if they're exposed to hazardous waste. Chief Vola agreed. Council person Gillespie requested a curriculum on that. Mayor Wessler asked about vehicle repairs and maintenance for $10,000. Chief Vola replied it's rolling stock. There was discussion about the blue machine. Mayor Wessler asked about engine work on attack 1. Chief Vola said it's a mini attack truck and it carries the Hurst tool and is quicker to operate. Councilman Hays said they want to upgrade to get it to the scene quicker. Chief Vola stated it didn't meet Federal guidelines for acceleration. Mayor Wessler asked if oil and grease are under maintenance. Chief Vola replied no, that's gas, oil, diesel expenses. Councilman Hays asked about University of Cincinnati. Chief Vola said he'll go. Mayor Wessler asked if he has the car telephone. Chief Vola replied he does. Councilperson Gillespie asked if pagers are for paid men. Chief Vola said it's a combination, himself, the volunteer battalion chief, Lieutenant Carson, and fire inspector Mike Hayes, and one other and they're $11 a month. Councilman Jones asked about the Cascade system. Chief Vola said it was just ordered and it's 5000 PSI bottles for the tanks and they can't store air and bottles they have are 9-10 years old. Mayor Wessler asked about mobile repairs. Chief Vola said it's mobile radios and they have three different kinds, base station, mobile in the vehicles, and walkie talkies. Councilman Jones asked the brand of walkie talkies. Chief Vola said they have Motorola MT 500 about 9 years old to re-equip and some were inherited from the Police Department. He said they can't use either of the channels and need their own dispatch frequency and it costs a lot to re-crystal radios and it outweighs the cost to replace them. Councilman Jones reviewed the radios they'd gone through, adding they're better off to buy better radios and Motoro 1 a is one of the best. Mr. Johnson agreed they 1 ast longer and maintenance is less but you pay more to start with. Chief Vola pointed out they have to consider the County.s looking at an 800 Megahertz system and equipment they use now would be totally useless because it isn't compatible. Mr. Johnson explained both Chiefs are on a committee to discuss this and it will probably be 2 years or longer until they find the money. Councilperson Gillespie said she'd heard there's grant money for fire safety and health reasons. Chief Vola explained they got a grant last year but word is grant money's much lower this year and it's strictly EMS grant money that goes on alcohol related traffic citations and moving violations. He added there's no money for other grants from FEMA and they tried through Civil Defense. He said grants from the 70's and 80's are gone. Council person Gillespie asked if he watches for them. Chief Vola replied he approached one in Orlando but the City's low on their list. Mayor Wessler asked about recordkeeping of $600. Chief Vola said that's the fireproof safe. Mayor Wessler said it's office supplies on page 81. Chief Vola said that's a computer program to link up with the State fire net. Mayor Wessler asked about the secretary's work station. Chief Vola said it's a desk and chair for the secretary at the Fire Station and it was purchased. Councilperson Gillespie asked if he has applications for the openings but will not be ready to hire in February and will place 2 then. Chief Vola replied it depends on Council's decision. Mr. Johnson explained the approximate time frame for processing applicants. Councilman Hays asked if this is all 4 or 2. Mr. Johnson replied it's all they1re going to hire and they'll go through a training program as a Police officer does with a training officer. Councilman Hays asked how long they have for orientation. Chief Vola replied 40 hours hands on orientation with their people, and it may take 10 days. Councilman Hays asked if it's all at once. Chief Vola replied yes. Councilman Hays asked why he went with a Ford Ranger. Chief Vola replied it's on State contract. 16 Council Special Meeting/Workshop December 18, 1990 , . ........, ~ Fire (Continued) Mr. Johnson stated he was asked to set up a class on Parliamentary Procedure and Lois Wescott is certified as an instructor and without any cost will come down and put on a class the first or second week in January. He asked they look at their calendars and let him know the night. Councilperson Gillespie suggested the third week in January. Mr. Johnson said Florida League has a meeting then. Councilperson Gillespie moved to adjourn. Councilman Hays seconded the motion. Councilperson Gillespie then rescinded her motion and Councilman Hays withdrew his second to the motion. There was discussion about the purchase of the Drager air packs that had been discussed at a prior meeting. Mr. Johnson suggested the motion be to purchase them under the bid that was originally submitted to the City. Councilperson Martin so moved. Councilman Hays seconded the motion to purchase under the original agreement and that was the one they saw last time. Motion CARRIED 5-0. Mayor Wessler asked if under Legal budget they discussed if Mr. Alvarez doesn't want to represent them as of last night's decision is it all right to retain Nikki Clayton, that she'd temporarily do it, and it wouldn't be $165. Mr. Johnson asked if the City Clerk and he should put an ad together for their review and run it in the League magazine that would be 60 days or the Orlando papers. Councilman Hays suggested it be Orlando, Daytona Beach, and News Observer. Councilperson Gillespie moved if Mr. Alvarez does not wish to represent the Council during this transition period they temporarily retain Nikki Clayton to represent the Council. Councilperson Martin seconded the motion. Mayor Wessler asked to include it's providing it's not at $165 an hour. Council person Gillespie said for general municipal services at a lower rate. Motion CARRIED 4-1. Councilman Hays voted NO. Councilperson Gillespie moved to adjourn. Councilman Jones seconded the motion. Meeting was adjourned at 10:47 p.m. \\ ~ MA1/ ," co~7f - ..~~ ,~ ~l,~ COUNCILPERSON - ZONE TWO '--h ( //j;i, ~.-?~~~~~( /.~ < ftlcdP~,f.,-) ~ COUN ILPERSON - ZONE THREE ~ Minutes submitted by: Lura Sue Koser ~ .".< --.,'/ /'~ / ,/ /,,//....7//. / COUNCILMAN -v~6NE FOUR /'/ /' ------ / ATTEST: A~/ lU~~ CITY CLERK / . A~.rloved this lj day of ~ -:I99...L. ':~~'~""-lI (\, \~ 'G\ Cl.l;, 4tv-. YOR (,,j ~ 17 Council Special Meeting/Workshop December 18, 1990