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06-25-1998 - Joint Workshop w/City of New Smyrna Beach CITY COUNCIL OF EDGEWATER JOINT WORKSHOP WITH THE CITY OF NEW SMYRNA BEACH JUNE 25, 1998 4:30 P.M. DBCC SOUTH CAMPUS — ROOM 109C MINUTES CALL TO ORDER Mayor Vandergrifft called the Joint Workshop to order at 4 : 49 p.m. at the Daytona Beach Community College South Campus in Room 109C. ROLL CALL CITY OF NEW SMYRNA BEACH Deputy City Clerk Rhonda Haynes read the roll call for the City of New Smyrna Beach. Mayor James Vandergrifft Present Vice Mayor Joann O'Bannon Present Commissioner William Rogers Present Commissioner James Hathaway Present Commissioner Oretha Bell Present Liz Yancy and George Beazley were also present from the City of New Smyrna Beach. CITY OF EDGEWATER City Clerk Susan Wadsworth read the roll call for the City of Edgewater. Mayor Randy Allman Present Councilman James Gornto Excused Councilman Myron Hammond Present Councilman Gary Roberts Present Councilwoman Judith Lichter Present City Attorney Nikki Clayton Present Interim City Manager Kenneth Hooper Present City Clerk Susan Wadsworth Present MEETING PURPOSE The purpose of the joint workshop was to discuss matters of mutual interest and opportunities for cooperation between the two cities . Mayor Allman identified the meeting was brought about by Councilman Hammond bringing forth a suggestion at one of their Council meetings concerning the YMCA. 1 Council Joint Workshop w/City of NSB June 25, 1998 Councilman Hammond then suggested some talking points he wanted to discuss regarding the YMCA. Councilwoman Lichter didn' t know the background of the relationship with the YMCA with the City of New Smyrna Beach. She didn' t have the history lesson she needed to make some judgment to where they are now. She also wanted to know how the Christian Life Center factored in. Wayne Bostic, YMCA, identified they weren' t presently associated with the City Commission of New Smyrna Beach. He further commented on a joint venture three or four years ago with New Smyrna Beach that never happened. Mr. Bostic commented on the YMCA facility located in Port Orange and having a great relationship with them. They recently joined up with Halifax Hospital. They were hoping Bert Fish would be a partner down here also. Mr. Bostic identified they had a contract to sign with the church at their next Board meeting. Councilwoman Lichter questioned the money raising efforts . Mr. Bostic informed her they had just started. Councilwoman Lichter was wondering what indoor type facilities New Smyrna had at this moment, which New Smyrna Beach Parks & Recreation Director Liz Yancy identified at this time. City Manager Frank Roberts identified the only facility plan they had was for a Community/Senior Center at the old Brannon Memorial Library. He further spoke of renovations that would need to be made to the facility to make it more effective from a Community/Senior Center standpoint. Mayor Vandergrifft identified most all of the programs had a lot of folks from Edgewater. He spoke of a petition that was submitted with regard to the new Regional Library that had a good majority of people from Edgewater. He mentioned New Smyrna having a lot of indoor facilities. Vice Mayor O' Bannon asked if the City of Port Orange contributed financially to the running of the YMCA. Mr. Bostic informed her they did not and that they paid a lease payment to the City of Port Orange. It was being run with fees for memberships, programs such as the United Way, contributions, and special events such as golf tournaments . Commissioner Rogers heard through the grapevine that Councilman Hammond was looking to have the YMCA located at the City' s 26-acres, which was correct. He asked if it were to be built in the City of 2 Council Joint Workshop w/City of NSB June 25, 1998 Edgewater as a cooperative type program, how they would assure that Oak Hill and New Smyrna Beach would be properly involved in that situation. Councilman Hammond felt the lawyers would have to get involved on participation but he assumed how much they would put in would be the percentage they would get back. There was then a discussion regarding this being a long term commitment. Councilman Roberts felt they were emphasizing too much on how much they would need. He felt what they were looking to do on 10th Street was at least a $2 million project if not more. He felt it was very generous of the church to offer five acres but he was concerned that it would become landlocked as it was a very limited area. He felt the 26 acres offered a lot more possibility in the future and gave a regional effort a way to distribute the financial burden so a particular community didn' t feel it all at once. He also felt it would be more acceptable to the taxpayers in all of the areas . City Manager Roberts asked if Edgewater was aware they were in the planning stages of an outdoor recreation complex. He expressed concern with getting into a duplication. Councilman Roberts didn' t feel the duplication would be a problem with outdoor facilities . Councilman Hammond felt it would be convenient to have one location to send the children for outdoor activities . He felt they should start working together and utilizing what they have instead of everybody trying to run around to different locations. He felt by working together they could come out way ahead on things like that. City Manager Roberts felt there should be coordination so they weren' t duplication an effort but that was a different story to the YMCA scenario. He hadn' t seen a good reason why it should be moved out of the potential area as they were talking about the building not the outdoor portion of the facility as it related to the size of the property. This was a more sensible location for the two major cities . Commissioner Hathaway felt if the Y was going to be put at the 26 acres that New Smyrna residents have already been excluded. He felt it wasn' t readily acceptable. He also mentioned residents that were members of the Port Orange YMCA. Mr. Bostic pointed out they had about 100 from Edgewater and New Smyrna. Commissioner Hathaway felt if they wanted to make things accessible that they needed to find a more centralized location that was accessible to the two major cities that would be involved. Councilwoman Lichter commented when they are dealing with Port Orange they are dealing with the YMCA and the City. She spoke of it being more difficult when dealing with three cities and that they needed a 3 Council Joint Workshop w/City of NSB June 25, 1998 conductor to orchestrate not only the building and the planning but the implementing. She admitted to coming in with predetermined ideas . She felt it would be nice for Edgewater to finally have something of its own and something that had been planned for a long time. She felt the planning of what was involved outside was as important to her as what was inside. She commented on the growth that could potentially happen. Unless someone can convince her that this can work she would be open. She commented on location being a factor but she felt orchestrating would be a factor as well. She felt it was an impractical setup with more than one city. Mr. Bostic identified with the Health Department that would be between the YMCA and the Hospital and would not be an issue with the cities but would be something they would be very proud of. Councilwoman Lichter confirmed with Commissioner Hathaway that the 26 acres was a bit out of the way location for New Smyrna residents . Commissioner Hathaway identified he would have a hard time to spend the City of New Smyrna Beach taxpayers' dollars if it were located outside of the City of New Smyrna Beach. He ran during the election and knew why this failed. He felt the YMCA would only succeed on outside people, corporate donors or sponsors and would not succeed if they get government entities involved in being the sole supporter or the main drive in supporting these things . Councilwoman Lichter wasn' t sure how the Edgewater residents would react either because they hadn' t been presented with that alternative. Councilman Roberts felt if it wasn' t for local government they wouldn' t have a YMCA in Port Orange right now. He felt they needed a starting point as the YMCA didn' t have millions of dollars just lying around to throw up a YMCA right now. He felt geographically there wouldn' t be a perfect location for this . He felt if they kept talking about where it would fit between Edgewater and New Smyrna rather than where it would fit in Southeast Volusia County as there was a lot more residents than just in the two corporate cities to consider, Oak Hill and the rural areas that he felt deserved facilities too. He also felt Volusia County should step up and be a part of this . Jim Ward, County Councilman?, felt when they start talking about regional it is a great idea but then most people want something in their own backyard. He further commented on how the YMCA in Port Orange got built. Commissioner Bell felt each of them was coming to the table saying they wanted one building for themselves . She questioned how they were going to plan together when they were each divided as far as where the building would be located. She questioned who would be the first to back off and give in. 4 Council Joint Workshop w/City of NSB June 25, 1998 Jim Russell, Chairman of the Southeast Volusia Chamber of Commerce' s Economic Development Committee, disclosed they had been in favor of a YMCA in this community for a number of years and had been working with Dr. Bill Sharp. He felt the YMCA needed to be built in this community. The sign at their proposed site says Edgewater-New Smyrna Beach YMCA, which he refers to as the Southeast Volusia YMCA. They wanted to be the coordinator. They have been the ones to put together people and funds. They needed the support of the County, the City of New Smyrna Beach, the City of Edgewater and the City of Oak Hill. Whether they have economic support from one or more of the government entities they would built a YMCA using private funds if they had to solely based on contributions from the private sector without asking for taxpayer money to support the facility. He spoke of Dr. Sharp' s organization providing a site for the people who were trying to get this facility built that will equally serve both of the two large communities and the County as a whole. They needed everybody' s help and the support of everyone in the room. Mayor Vandergrifft pointed out Mr. Russell was the Mayor of Port Orange when they got the YMCA. He believed it was built through a bond issue and the YMCA was going to pay the debt service back for the bond to Port Orange. He asked Mr. Bostic if it was possible to have a gymnasium offsite of where the YMCA would be. Mr. Bostic felt anything was possible but pointed out it would cost more staff wise. A facility that has an onsite management team would be better off no matter where it was at. Councilwoman Lichter read Dr. Sharp' s letter in the newspaper. She was wondering if Dr. Sharp had anything he wanted to add. Dr. Bill Sharp, Christian Life Center, identified they weren' t locked into a particular structure. The ballfield was not part of the YMCA concept but was a part of their long range plan. He wanted to see them partner together and felt they had the most strategic place. Last week they were taking over $65, 000 worth of donated batting cages into storage that Buddy World gave them. They didn' t have the money today to build a ballfield but felt it could be part of the total project where everyone could be coming to one area. Dr. Sharp spoke of having other plans such as a storm shelter and a Feed a Florida Family and had fed almost 20, 000 people since the storm last November. They were asking for grants to help them with this program. He spoke of the YMCA having a pool and gymnasium which was all part of their master plan. He felt Edgewater was coming in after the horse had gotten out of the barn in talking about this. They had a site and felt why not go with it. They didn' t have to involve the City politics and drag this around for a number of years to redo this again. Mr. Bostic informed his congregation he had given up on this until they offered the property, which he offered 3 years before Bill Roe came into his office to accept this offer. From his standpoint this was not an indefinite option and that there were time 5 Council Joint Workshop w/City of NSB June 25, 1998 frames involved as other people were interested in doing things on their property also but their priority was to keep this option open for the YMCA. They didn' t want this to drag on. They were honored that they could be a part of this and maybe a catalyst to help this go forward. He didn' t want to see the land continue to sit there and wanted to see a focal point for the community. They were there to offer their help. Mayor Vandergrifft thanked him for stepping up to the plate. He felt everything they did was so unique to the community, including the radio station. Mayor Vandergrifft spoke of already having plans to build a gymnasium on their site and suggested if they kept the site and put a gymnasium on their site they could offer some things back to the City of Edgewater and do some of their programs in the gym. Mr. Bostic informed him the YMCA stood ready to work with anybody in any way. If they didn' t do the YMCA on the 26 acres in Edgewater, maybe something they could work with would be to do baseball in Edgewater' s facility and soccer in New Smyrna. Councilman Roberts stated one way or another they were going to try and give their citizens a recreational facility for their tax money. They have committed to spending a certain amount of money. He spoke of the issue not being on the table indefinitely and that eventually they will have to make a decision. If it worked out with a joint effort and a regional YMCA, that would be great but if it didn' t they had money ready to go and an engineering firm ready to go to put together something for Edgewater' s citizens . It was an option some of them felt was open for discussion because they did have a large piece of land that other communities don' t have. He felt 26 acres was a large parcel and they could put quite a complex on it. They were looking at different options of how to ease the burden on the taxpayers of Southeast Volusia. Councilman Hammond further commented on trying to avoid duplication as Edgewater had $1 million and 26 acres. He felt if everyone worked together they could have something real nice in this area and a full facility for everybody. Vice Mayor O' Bannon asked if they were thinking of indoor swimming within the complex and all of the things a YMCA would have. Councilman Hammond informed her they were going to build a gymnasium with basketball and other multi purposes but no indoor swimming pool . Councilman Roberts spoke of having Aqua Park, who had expanded in the last few years, which he felt was a benefit. He then commented on middle school and high school students from Edgewater going to New Smyrna and everybody going to New Smyrna for the beaches . He didn' t feel it would be odd for people from New Smyrna Beach to come to 6 Council Joint Workshop w/City of NSB June 25, 1998 Edgewater and be a part of our community as well if the YMCA was put in Edgewater. City Manager Roberts felt the YMCA should be put together by groups other than politic entities and the location that was best for that group. He felt the two cities should get together and develop the outdoor recreational facility and figure out they aren' t duplicating the effort. He felt that would be appropriate and that they should leave the YMCA alone. Councilwoman Lichter spoke of Edgewater having plans for an outdoor facility in the future also. She saw a need for a stage eventually. She felt they should let the YMCA be the YMCA. Dr. Sharp asked what parliamentary procedure they follow and questioned if this was agreed upon they would have to vote at a regular meeting. He asked how long it would before they could put this on their agendas. The soonest for New Smyrna was August. Mayor Allman identified they were talking about indoor facilities and the YMCA would only be one indoor facility and that both cities would need indoor facilities . He commented on being two separate entities and felt there were other ways for the two cities to get together to make this a very viable activity. He felt the YMCA, Edgewater and new Smyrna were separate entities and that if they started mixing politics it wouldn' t work. Mayor Vandergrifft identified they had the high school in New Smyrna with the facilities that the high school uses that they put all of their tax dollars in that all of the Edgewater kids come up and utilize. Over the years he has asked Edgewater to help them with some of those facilities because it was a high school for everyone in Southeast Volusia but New Smyrna had always funded that. They put an awful lot of money into the high school that Edgewater didn' t have to. Councilwoman Lichter pointed out Edgewater had been writing letters to the City of New Smyrna asking for assistance with the fireworks for the last five years . Mayor Vandergrifft informed her if they would help them with the football stadium he would give Edgewater $5, 000 for fireworks but he guaranteed her the stadium cost a whole lot more. Councilman Roberts spoke of a lot of community recreational facilities being incorporated into local schools, which he felt they lacked. He felt it was unfortunate that the cities do not have control over their own schools and have a County School Board. They are going to work out the best thing for their citizens and their kids, one way or another. Jim Foster, Southeast Volusia Hospital District, identified the Hospital District supported wellness and health fitness as it pertained to the older population. The commitment of the Hospital 7 Council Joint Workshop w/City of NSB June 25, 1998 District was clinical care, acute health care, and home health care. He commented on the extension the Hospital District had made over the last several years . The debt service there was significant and the kind of money Edgewater was planning to spend was simply not there from the Hospital District' s standpoint. He was skeptical there was a large lead gift to make this thing fly if municipal governments were not involved. He was pretty excited that maybe collaboration between two of their major employers in Southeast Volusia would see this thing as a reality. He expressed concern with where the $2 . 5 million was going to come from. The Hospital District was committed to health fitness and wellness. There was tremendous gain to the community if people are healthy. He further commented on the debt service needing to be covered as it pertained to membership. He felt the Southeast Volusia YMCA needed to start off with a very solid and very low debt service. Mr. Bostic informed him the Board of Directors of the Greater Daytona Beach YMCA would not start off with a debt service more than they can operate. Mr. Ward spoke of Port Orange being able to work with the YMCA in structuring their lease payments . A gentleman heard rumors of over $250, 000 in pledges . He asked if it would be appropriate to ask the Hospital District how much they might be willing to put into this. Mr. Foster felt the Hospital District would participate if there were significant other participants . He felt it would be possible that the Hospital District Board of Commissioners would make a commitment for a given year that was a capital contribution. He felt they had to start off strong by municipalities and other government units getting together within the County in some kind of a recreation authority. If they could establish something they could all commit to that was convenient for all that was what he thought had to happen. Councilman Roberts asked realistically when they would have enough money to start construction. Mr. Bostic informed him they had promises, pledges and money in the bank. He understood the amount combined was approximately $140, 000 to $150, 000. They couldn' t build the YMCA if it wasn' t going to work economically but they believed with the support of the business community such as Coronado Paint and Boston Whaler it could happen. Councilman Roberts spoke of Edgewater putting an offer on the table because the main concern was money. Mr. Bostic informed him they needed the financial assistance, cooperation and support of New Smyrna, Edgewater, Volusia County and Oak Hill . Dr. Sharp questioned if this had already fallen by the wayside in New Smyrna and Edgewater and the property being offered because it had 8 Council Joint Workshop w/City of NSB June 25, 1998 failed before. Councilman Roberts spoke of having a lot more land which would give it a lot more opportunity for expansion in the future. It could become a much bigger and more regional facility on 26 acres rather than five acres no matter where it was located in Southeast Volusia. Margaret Roberts wanted them to go away from the meeting today with one thing in their mind that they would continue this dialogue. They had not reached resolution based on the nature of the comments but that didn' t mean they stop here today. She suggested they continue to communicate. He asked the Council and Commission to ask that a representative who had the ability to pull all of the cities resources together to make a good overall decision and work with other representatives to come up with some ideas of how this puzzle might come together. She questioned if they were in a position to compete and if they had the financial resources to be competitive right now. She felt the gymnasium question was a tough one but felt it was worth looking at further and that the question on outdoor recreational facilities was a lot easier. She felt they had to pool their resources. She suggested they get a focal point and run with it and see what happens . Steve Dennis, Southeast Volusia Chamber of Commerce, felt there was essential information that was missing before they could make some more progress. He questioned if there had ever been a real feasibility study done to determine if all of the Southeast Volusia communities could support a facility. He suggested they look at all of Southeast Volusia as an overlay and compare overall what Southeast Volusia provided in indoor and outdoor facilities to determine where the cities could and couldn' t work together. He spoke of the population explosion in Florida Shores. He felt they needed to determine whether or not they had a population base that could afford it. He felt the Christian Life Center needed a decision because their offer was not going to be open forever. He also identified there was legislation out there to try and consolidate hospital districts . Mayor Vandergrifft identified they came with a few other ideas to put together to work with Edgewater. He felt there were a lot of areas of opportunity they have between the cities of Edgewater and New Smyrna to work together. Mr. Ward spoke to Joe Sullivan, Director of the Boys & Girls Club of Volusia County and identified there was nothing on this end of the County like that that he was aware of in Southeast Volusia County. Mr. Sullivan informed him he never wanted to compete with people like the YMCA because dollars are so scarce. He wasn' t seeing a whole lot down here for the youth and felt the Boys & Girls Club might be something this community might be interested in looking at. George Beazley asked if the City of Edgewater should it be chosen as the location for the new YMCA was ready to donate the land or if it 9 Council Joint Workshop w/City of NSB June 25, 1998 would be a lease that had to be paid back. Councilman Roberts believed it would be a lease as well but that no commitments had been made. He believed Port Orange had a lease set up. Mr. Bostic informed him they had a lease on the building but identified that Port Orange provided the land. Councilwoman Lichter felt the YMCA was more than a recreation complex and had certain principles and purposes. She spoke of different goals that a YMCA may have than a city recreational complex may have. She understood why a City would want control and wasn' t sure how many cities were working in sync with the YMCA. Councilman Roberts spoke about the growth in the population of Edgewater because of Florida Shores, which still had the potential for 2, 000 more homes in that one subdivision. A gentleman identified the population in Port Orange was 41, 000. New Smyrna and Edgewater added together would come up with the population of Port Orange to support a YMCA. Councilman Roberts pointed out it wasn' t just their two cities and also included Oak Hill and Volusia County. There was then a brief discussion regarding naming some individuals to the Board. Ms . Roberts informed him the Council and Commission could do that at their next meeting. Ms. Roberts then asked Jim Ward what Port Orange was projecting for the payoff on the debt for the YMCA. Mr. Ward identified how it had been changed. Mayor Vandergrifft felt if they had another joint meeting they needed to bring back some other areas they needed to work together on. Councilwoman Lichter felt the study group they were working on with all of the cities was bringing up some of the issues they have in common in the Southeast Volusia area. Ms . Roberts asked if the Chamber could have the opportunity to have a representative attend each of the City' s meetings and offered to assist in any way they could. ADJOURNMENT There being no further business to discuss, the joint workshop adjourned at 6:23 p.m. Minutes submitted by: Lisa Bloomer, CMC Deputy City Clerk City of Edgewater 10 Council Joint Workshop w/City of NSB June 25, 1998