02-12-2001 - Workshop
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CITY COUNCIL OF EDGEWATER
WORKSHOP
FEBRUARY 12, 2001
6:00 P.M.
COMMUNITY CENTER
MINUTES
CALL TO ORDER
Mayor Schmidt called the Workshop to order at 6:00 p.m. in the
Community Center.
ROLL CALL
Mayor Donald Schmidt
Councilman James Brown
Councilman Dennis Vincenzi
Councilwoman Harriet Rhodes
Councilwoman Judith Lichter
City Manager Kenneth Hooper
City Clerk Susan Wadsworth
Legal Assistant Robin Matusick
Present
Present
Present
Present
Present
Present
Present
Present
MEETING PURPOSE
The purpose of the meeting is to discuss the following items:
1) Interlocal Water & Wastewater Agreement, as requested by
Councilman Brown
2) Land Development Code Update
3) Fire/EMS Impact Fees
4) Street lights Master Plan
5) Water restriction fines
City Manager Hooper informed the Council he invited Oak Hill but
they have a meeting later on that evening. He and Don will be
going to Oak Hill and the April 26th.
City Manager Hooper commented on the new Future Land Use Map.
This will be a component of the Comprehensive Plan Update which
they are trying to do in April which will go to the Planning and
Zoning Board and should be back before Council in late April or
early May. He spoke about the County and city coming up with a
joint land use, which would cut out part of the State hassle they
run into.
City Manager Hooper commented on the Official zoning Map.
1) Interlocal Water & Wastewater Aqreement, as requested bv
Councilman Brown
City Manager Hooper spoke about the Interlocal Water & Wastewater
Agreement between the City and Volusia County and the area it
covers. He commented on areas in the City that will take extra
capacity. Our plant doesn't have excess capacity that had been
described many times to Oak Hill and the County without having to
expand our plant. He further commented on the Golf Course
community. He commented on a joint grant they have applied for
for $2 million between Edgewater and the County to bring in water
and sewer.
There was a brief discussion regarding New Smyrna having two
plants on one piece of property. City Manager Hooper commented
on having a backup system.
Councilwoman Lichter asked if Oak Hill has been objecting to the
location of the plant itself and not to the deal the City made.
city Manager Hooper stated he thinks they object to the plant
being close to Oak Hill. There is an environmental concern they
brought up. The deal the City made with the County is the only
way the County could have built the plant because the County
didn't have any real flow.
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City Manager Hooper spoke about the agreement being a good
business agreement. So far we have taken in $550,000 and our
maximum payout is $440,000 so it has made $100,000 in the first
twelve months. He commented on the money that will be made with
the Golf Course Community coming in.
City Manager Hooper further commented on the agreement. It is a
twenty year agreement. There would have to be a three year's
notice to end the agreement. At the end of seventeen years,
there is a requirement that one side or both notify each other
that the deal is going to go on in perpetuity.
Councilwoman Lichter spoke about the unit in Edgewater Landing
that has been recently worked on. City Manager Hooper stated
that is taking the flow from Edgewater Landing that went north to
our existing treatment plant and it is being re-piped and now
will go to the south. That is going to the County. The same
thing is occurring in Meadow Lake. They are planning to turn all
of this on on Friday.
Councilwoman Lichter asked if the one in Edgewater Landing was
with the original agreement with the developer that the City put
that in. City Manager Hooper stated the developer put it in and
dedicated it to the City.
Councilwoman Lichter asked if the County put the one in Hacienda
Del Rio. city Manager Hooper explained that was a small package
plant that existed. The County went in and bought the water and
sewer system. They have an agreement that when that plant came
offline they were going to sell, give or trade back that property
to the developer so he could expand that area. He spoke about
the poor quality of the water.
city Manager Hooper spoke about Edgewater having one of the
better water systems as far as capacity. We have good wells and
are talking of expanding our wells to the west along SR 442.
There is a good supply of water out there.
City Manager Hooper further explained part of the agreement was
the first 200,000 gallons of water that the County bought from
us, they paid cash for a portion and the balance they traded
sewer capacity. Edgewater Landing and Meadow Lake didn't have to
pay a connection or impact fee for the County. When Edgewater
Lakes comes in, they will have to pay full impact fees.
Councilman vincenzi asked City Manager Hooper to comment further
on Edgewater Lakes paying full impact fees. City Manager Hooper
explained they will pay the water and sewer impact fees directly
to the City. Department of Environmental Services Director Terry
Wadsworth stated the water impact fees are $1,000 and the sewer
impact fees are $1,425.
Councilman Brown questioned the County going up to a 5% rate
increase ever year. He asked if the city can as well. city
Manager Hooper stated both sides can. Councilman Brown asked if
that is planned or an automatic. city Manager Hooper explained
what would occur.
Mayor Schmidt stated they know how to measure water. He asked
what the master meter is like to measure the other lines. city
Manager Hooper stated there are two different kinds. Mr.
Wadsworth stated there is an ultrasonic there that is a lot more
reliable for waste material.
city Manager Hooper spoke about magnetic and ultrasonic being the
easiest and most reliable meters and calibrating meters.
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Council Workshop
February 12, 2001
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Mayor Schmidt asked who maintains the meters. City Manager
Hooper informed him they have in the agreement that the one that
owns the meter and the County owns the sewer and the City owns
the water.
Doris Hill, 112 Lincoln Road, stated when they arrive at the
decision about what to do it is apparent to her that it must have
taken a good bit of engineering. She asked if we had any outside
engineers come in. She also asked whose word they are taking for
this. She feels if the County is going to make some money from
this, why couldn't we have done it. City Manager Hooper stated
we could have done it if we built a plant to the south. We
didn't have the need to do it as soon as they did. We could have
expanded our plant to the north which would have cost about $4.1
million.
Ms. Hill commented on taking care of the sewer in Meadow Lake and
Edgewater Landing and not having any trouble. She spoke about
when this deal was struck the golf course wasn't an issue. She
thinks in the long run this isn't going to prove to be in the
City's best interest. She spoke about the City growing and not
wanting to fiddle around with the County.
City Manager Hooper stated it is a long planning process and much
thought went into what is good from a business deal. He is
convinced 100% the City will make a good business deal long term
out of going this route with wholesale agreements.
Councilwoman Rhodes stated when County Councilman Jim Ward was
here he said he felt this was a good deal for Edgewater but not
for the County. City Manager Hooper spoke about making profit in
the water business but not the sewer business.
Mayor Schmidt asked if we are going to talk to them about
bringing the reclaimed water back toward the golf course. City
Manager Hooper stated yes and commented on the design of the golf
course.
Dominic Capria, 606 Topside circle, asked what our capacity is on
the sewer. If we annex Cory Estates, Water Park, Edgewater Lakes
and all the annexations on Massey, will that still suffice in our
present plant. City Manager Hooper explained it is close. He
further commented on there being 2,000 vacant lots in Florida
Shores, 1100 acres out by I-95 and the Park Avenue/FIND/Massey
area. He feels the plant is at capacity.
Mr. Capria stated he is talking about a long period of time.
City Manager Hooper stated you are probably talking three to five
years.
Councilwoman Lichter spoke about building on that many lots in
Florida Shores that rapidly. City Manager Hooper stated our
building growth right now is going at about 480 to 500 units per
year.
Mr. Capria stated he asks questions because he is concerned.
Doug Kennedy, spoke on behalf of the City of Oak Hill Commission,
who send their regrets. They couldn't make it tonight due to a
scheduling conflict.
Mr. Kennedy asked what the
City has reached capacity.
plant. City Manager Hooper
is we will do more with the
more capacity.
City will do in three
He asked if the City
stated the intent is
south plant with the
years when the
will expand the
not. The intent
County and buy
Mr. Kennedy asked how big the County's plant is down south. City
Manager Hooper stated he thinks it is 600,000 gallons.
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Council Workshop
February 12, 2001
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Mr. Kennedy spoke about the County automatically increasing the
rate 4 1/2% per year. The rates for water and sewer will go up
which affects the wholesale customers. He stated it won't affect
the City's residents but it will affect those in Southeast
Volusia.
City Manager Hooper stated he doesn't think that applies to
wholesale. What he has been told as recently as last week,
Thursday, they do not intent to do wholesale agreement
modifications. He further commented on when they adopted their
rate structure. It may go up but they have assured him it will
not at this point. Mr. Kennedy wished Edgewater could enter into
a five year agreement that the price could stay the same.
Mr. Kennedy asked how many homes will be in the golf course. City
Manager Hooper informed him about 700 homes. Mr. Kennedy asked
how much the City will pay the County to build their sewer plant.
City Manager Hooper informed him he traded water capacity for
sewer, $4.00 and $4.50 are the two numbers for water and sewer.
Mr. Kennedy asked City Manager Hooper if he thought the rest of
Southeast Volusia is going to grow as fast as the golf course.
He feels the County isn't going to take as much water as the City
is providing sewage. City Manager Hooper stated they are going
to take more water than he is sending sewage. Mr. Kennedy
explained why he feels if there is very little growth in
southeast Volusia and 700 homes are put on sewer, the sewer bill
is going to be double the water bill. He asked not to mislead
that this is a trade water for sewer. city Manager Hooper stated
the capacity is the trade, the treatment isn't. The County is
treating it and the customer is paying him and he is taking a
portion of their bill they are paying him and he is paying the
County to treat it. He hasn't lost a penny from his residents
and he hasn't increased the rates for his City residents.
Mr. Kennedy stated if you take the number of people that are
going to buy water verses the number of people that are going to
be put on the County system, the city is putting them in the
sewer business and paying them the impact fee, which he feels
could be put into the City's plant. City Manager Hooper stated
then he would have to expand the plant to do that. Mr. Kennedy
stated you are eventually going to have to expand the plant
anyway. City Manager Hooper informed him not really. Mr.
Kennedy feels the City has said this is all we are going to treat
then we are going to pay other people to do it and let them make
the revenue. City manager Hooper stated yes, on sewer. Mr.
Kennedy stated if the city of Oak Hill was to go for water
permits and put in water and do a five year area, the City will
lose that whole area. City Manager Hooper stated he wishes the
City of Oak Hill would do that. Mr. Kennedy stated maybe they
can accommodate them.
Mr. Kennedy asked what the water agreement was with the County
before it was amended. He asked City Manager Hooper if he
recalled the rates. He stated $8.32 per house and $2.72 per
1,000 gallons. Right now the County is paying a $4 one time fee
plus $2.75. There was an agreement for four or five years that
the City was getting $8 per house per month. It was traded in
for a $4 one time fee. City Manager Hooper stated they are
buying a lot more capacity. Mr. Kennedy stated where else would
they have gone for water. Edgewater is the only provider in
Southeast Volusia. He asked if the city has a 201 Plan that says
the City can handle everything to the Brevard County line. He
stated yes. The City Council vote for many years to get that
area and the County buffaloed them and they went under.
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Council Workshop
February 12, 2001
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city Manager Hooper informed Mr. Kennedy he is making some good
points and he agrees with some. He thinks part of it is what
Council looks at is not just water and sewer. There were other
areas with FIND and industrial areas. If they would have put all
of their money and built that plant, they would have tapped every
penny they had and the investments they put in to make other
areas develop and other industrial growth would have waited or
maybe never occurred.
councilwoman Lichter stated she could understand why some of the
residents in Oak Hill would be upset with the plant being built.
One of her goals for years was to have a better relationship with
the County. She doesn't understand why Oak Hill is so concerned
with the business deal that Edgewater works out with the County.
Mr. Kennedy stated the concern of the City of Oak Hill is
Edgewater is taking their sewage and running it down u.S. #1
through their city. They have become the dumping ground for
Edgewater. He feels the worst thing about it is everyone in Oak
Hill is on a well. He feels if this plant was designed from day
one with Edgewater and Regional he would have no problem. They
only came to Edgewater after they annexed into the City and they
lost the customers. They don't like the County coming and
putting the lines in, they have not obtained one permit or
followed their environmental regulations. They say they don't
have to because they are a small City and they will bankrupt them
and that they can't fight them. He questioned if Edgewater is
involved because of this being an after effect to save the plant.
City Manager Hooper stated it is not an after effect to save the
plant. He has described that previous administration, Managers,
Engineers and Council tried to convince them they could do
something with this plant. He feels this is truly a business
deal. If they have a problem with the plant they should have
appealed the permits from the State that let them build the
plant.
Mr. Kennedy stated the plant location was moved and Oak Hill
wasn't notified of the other until it was too late. DEP never
sent the changing. As far as they knew up until a year ago it
was out Beacon Light Road. Because of their money woes and
shortage they moved it closer to cut down on pipe and moved it
into an environmentally sensitive location. He feels if
Edgewater still has capacity in their plant, why should they be
forced to take it and treat it. He further spoke about Oak Hill
wanting water years ago and the County said the City couldn't put
the water lines down their right of way.
Councilwoman Rhodes asked if before all of this occurred did Oak
Hill want Edgewater's water. Mr. Kennedy stated yes, they have
wanted it for years. City Manager Hoper stated he has never had
a request. If Oak Hill said tonight they wanted water, he would
run a water line down there. Mr. Kennedy asked at what cost?
City Manager Hooper stated if he has Oak Hill send him a letter
that says they would like to negotiate water service he agreed to
put that line in and they will be talking. Mr. Kennedy stated
unfortunately the City Commission passed a moratorium by the
voters and it is very loosely written and been interpreted by
different attorneys. If there is no cost to the City of Oak Hill
and Edgewater wanted to provide it and made a proposal and the
city of Oak Hill didn't have to along with the rate structure,
they could possibly accept it.
councilwoman Rhodes asked what kind of business deal is that.
That they will provide for Oak Hill and Oak Hill isn't going to
pay for it. Mr. Kennedy stated each customer would pay for it.
Councilwoman Rhodes asked when the moratorium was enacted. Mr.
Kennedy stated five years ago and goes out in 2002. Councilwoman
Rhodes stated so before any of this Oak Hill didn't want
Edgewater's water.
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Council Workshop
February 12, 2001
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Mr. Kennedy stated they did it because the County came down and
said they were going to put a sewer line down River Road and Oak
Hill's portion would be $1 million for 38 houses and Oak Hill
said they couldn't afford it. They wanted Oak Hill to get an SRF
loan and that is when they backed out and some citizens got
concerned and passed a moratorium foolishly saying sewer and
water but the County would not allow the lines to come.
Mr. Kennedy stated the moratorium was put on the Council not to
discuss this. He feels if Edgewater came down with a rate
structure and recover the fee over five or ten years and charge
double or a percentage of, there is an opportunity for Edgewater
to get the customers. Councilwoman Rhodes stated there isn't an
opportunity for Edgewater to get the customers because there is a
moratorium until 2002. Mr. Kennedy stated the Council can not
come to Edgewater and request it because they are under a
moratorium. If somebody offered it and it didn't cost the
Council, they could accept it according to one latest legal
opinions. Mr. Kennedy stated Oak Hill qualifies for every grant
in the world. If the City wants to bring water down now and
offer it to individual houses, he doubts they would stop you.
Councilwoman Rhodes stated she doesn't think they want to do that
for free. Mr. Kennedy stated it wouldn't be for free. Give them
a price per house.
Councilwoman Lichter stated if they can't talk about water and
have them sitting here and talk with each other, she isn't sure
she wants to be in that kind of business relationship with
individual homes. City Manager Hooper stated you run into all
kinds of legal problems. If there is an interest, he would like
to talk to the Mayor. Mr. Kennedy stated he would need to talk
to the City Attorney, Richard Stadler. Mr. Kennedy had a meeting
with him this afternoon about this very issue and how to get
around it and how to provide it.
Mr. Kennedy stated the biggest concern the City has is that
Edgewater came into the deal late and it is not an efficient
plant they are building down there. The customer base will bear
the burden. Regardless of what they spend, they have to collect
125% because of their bonds by raising the rates. No tax dollars
go into the system. The County, when they decided to build that
plant, had 40 wastewater customers.
Mayor Schmidt asked what is going to happen to Oak Hill the day
EPA and st. John's tell them they have to get rid of their septic
tanks. Mr. Kennedy stated he would imagine they would get rid of
their septic tanks and there would be a grant. He feels there
would be no problem with putting Oak Hill on sewers if they use a
vacuum system because Oak Hill could obtain grant money. He
spoke about a grant the County obtained for South Waterfront
Park.
Mayor Schmidt asked why Oak Hill doesn't go after a grant to
upgrade the plant if they are so worried about the system. Mr.
Kennedy stated you can't do it because it is a unified system, it
is all County assets and it is pledged under bonds. Why would
you go into a system that is fiscally irresponsible? Their own
figures with their growth is going to lose money for 18 years.
They just pass it on to the customers. He spoke about the
Edgewater water that comes down there, they are going to wind up
at 4 1/2% increase a year paying the brunt so Edgewater benefits.
City Manager Hooper stated Mr. Kennedy is making his point that
it is a good business deal for this City.
Councilwoman Lichter stated if the lawyer for Oak Hill and City
Manager Hooper can have any dialogue that wouldn't break the
moratorium then that would be alright.
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February 12, 2001
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Mr. Kennedy stated the biggest gripe that Oak Hill has with the
County system is the sewage from Edgewater is being sent down to
their back yard and they place everything where they wanted to
place it without the consent of Oak Hill. Mayor Schmidt asked if
it is on County property. Mr. Kennedy stated it is not on County
property and they have violated the City's jurisdiction. He
asked if the County can come up here through DOT and run a line
through Edgewater without the City's permission. City Manager
Hooper informed him yes. He can go through the County on County
roads but would need a use permit. They can't deny it unless
they find that there is some major issue.
Patrick Gilmore, waterway Park, informed City Manager Hooper if
he brings that water line they will sign up. City Manager Hooper
stated they have a letter coming to them. The County has taken a
survey and they have given him the results and the County and
City have jointly applied for a $2 million grant this year and
they will be receiving a letter from his office asking them as a
group to come in and meet and talk of water. The meeting is
supposed to be scheduled during the month of March.
Mr. Gilmore stated there are quite a number of people that are
elderly. The water is black and can't be used. City Manager
Hooper stated there are there or four areas they want to sit and
talk of. They are talking of annexation to make this happen. A
lady in the audience asked if they can't get the water unless
they annex. City Manager Hooper stated he didn't say that but he
would prefer they annex. A lady in the audience stated Cory
Estates has water and they were not required to annex. City
Manager Hooper stated they are talking further with them because
some signed up and some didn't and now they want in.
2) Land Development Code Update
City Manager Hooper presented an update on the Land Development
Code. He proposed to the Council that they talk some of the
Committee's recommendation. He would like to bring the Code back
to Council in sections.
City Manager Hooper commented on temporary carports and canopies
and would like to speak further about this so what is there today
can be grand fathered and ended but that the not proliferate or
add anymore to that. He feels those that have use could continue
those but they would not be issuing any permits and they would
cease and desist any additions or expansions to those.
Councilman Vincenzi stated so what is here now stays and no one
else would be able to legally put up a temporary carport. City
Manager Hooper stated they would probably have a phase out. What
they have would stay until it is destroyed or wears out and then
they couldn't replace it.
There was a brief discussion regarding tracking the temporary
carports.
City Manager Hooper commented on some of the items discussed by
the Committee.
Councilwoman Lichter referred to Page 3 Item F. She has a
problem with how many donor vehicles will be allowed to be stored
on property to supply parts. She also referred to Page 5 Item I
regarding additional vehicles may be parked in those areas for no
more than 2 weeks.
City Manager Hooper stated donor vehicle now has the same
responsibility as the restoration vehicle and is going through
the same requirements. He spoke of only having one vehicle per
4,000 square feet.
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Council Workshop
February 12, 2001
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Mayor Schmidt asked if someone were to come into town and open a
storage lot, would they have the ability to put the canopies up
for the people that were storing their boats. City Manager
Hooper stated no. Ms. Plaskett explained they don't allow that
for commercial or industrial storage. She further commented on
canopies that are going up that aren't installed properly.
There was further discussion regarding canopies and installing
them properly.
Councilwoman Lichter feels it needs to be spelled out clearly.
Councilwoman Lichter has a problem with vehicles on the actual
boundary line. Ms. Plaskett stated most people that have a boat
will put in on the driveway and not on the side unless they can't
put it in the front because they use their garage. Councilwoman
Lichter feels they should anticipate that situation and suggested
one foot from the boundary line. City Manager Hooper commented
on the problem getting into the enforcement and measuring. He
spoke about being able to change this if they find it to be a
problem.
City Manager Hooper asked for Council direction to bring these
back in ordinance form. They will take it through the Planning &
Zoning Board and he would like direction that they would like to
see the Land Development Code broken up in no more than three
articles at a time and over a two month period have each of these
brought back to them.
It was the consensus of Council to do that.
There was a ten-minute recess at this time.
3) Fire/EMS Impact Fees
City Manager Hooper commented on impact fees.
City Manager Hooper referred to and commented on the Fire/EMS
Impact Fee Study. He spoke about having a cost each time they
respond to a call for Fire/EMS. He went over the fees associated
with other cities.
Councilwoman Rhodes questioned the fees for Volusia County and
New Smyrna Beach being lower than ours. City Manager Hooper
commented on the difference in fees.
Councilwoman Rhodes asked Ms. Hill if impact fees is a big factor
when people build homes. Ms. Hill stated she didn't think so.
City Manager Hooper informed Council he wanted to bring Police
impact fees back, which will be about half of this amount. There
are some road issues he would also like to talk to Council about.
The County has road impact fees that are for County roads. We
have City roads we want to expand but right now we only have the
General Fund.
Councilwoman Lichter asked about schools. city Manager Hooper
stated the County School Board can develop a school impact fee
and can approach the City letting them know they want to charge
it. They haven't but he feels they should.
Mayor Schmidt asked if there is a school impact fee right now on
new construction. City Manager Hooper stated there is a school
impact fee in the unincorporated County, which is fairly new.
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Council Workshop
February 12, 2001
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City Manager Hooper stated this one is in its final state and is
ready to go the Planning & Zoning Board and have public hearing
then come back to the Council. He asked Council if this is
consistent with the philosophy with user pay, growth pays for
itself and try to take the burden off the existing residents for
General Fund for anything in the future growth and move on with
this and direction to bring the others back.
Fire Chief Barlow briefly commented on New Smyrna Beach's impact
fees that were assessed in 1991 and they're getting ready to go
back and re-evaluate their impact fees.
Councilwoman Lichter asked the status of the 700 homes in the
golf course. city Manager Hooper stated the property owner, Tim
Howard, has filed an annexation to come into the city. He goes
in front of the Planning & Zoning Board on March 14th. He will
be in front of Council asking for some plan amendments and the
begipning of the process for zoning probably in May.
Councilwoman Lichter asked what is going on with the
environmental permits. City Manager Hooper stated Mr. Howard has
to do an environmental assessment analysis, he has to go out and
flag the wetlands and have the State agree on the boundary. He
turns all that in as the development review for the City for us
to look at. As each step comes in front of Council they will
have that information. It will all be packaged and sent off to
DCA. It won't be transmitted to the State until Council
authorizes transmittal. The State will review it and it will
come back to Council about 90 days later. Then Council has a
second and final vote to approve or deny.
It was the consensus of Council to move forward.
City Manager Hooper asked to switch the next two items.
4) Water restriction fines
City Manager Hooper commented on st. John's issuing water
restriction and water restriction mandates. They are interested
at staff level in adding some teeth to the enforcement. Right
now there are warnings handed out and that is the extent of it.
He commented on methods the County is looking at. He also
commented on the City of Altamonte Springs enforcement procedure.
City Manager Hooper stated that is the process they would like to
use and develop an ordinance. We have some violations that are
more so with the reclaimed water than the other issues. He will
provide Council with a copy of the City of Altamonte Springs
ordinance. He would like to put that together and if they give
him direction he would like to place it on the agenda.
Mayor Schmidt asked if it is tied to their water bill and they
shut the reclaimed off, it will not affect their water bill. It
is just going to have an ongoing balance that they owe for that
until they pay for it. City Manager Hooper informed him yes.
Councilwoman Lichter asked about the wells. City Manager Hooper
stated they would try to attach that to the garbage or water
bill. The fines would be there but they would not have the same
leverage as far as turning off the reclaimed water.
Councilwoman Lichter would like to see Code Enforcement
Officials, Police Officers and utility Meter readers all
involved. City Manager Hooper stated they are getting that with
Code Enforcement, the Police Department and the CAPS folks.
It was the consensus of Council to put this together as an
ordinance and bring it back.
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Council Workshop
February 12, 2001
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Councilman Vincenzi asked City Manager Hooper if he had any idea
of what kind of fine schedule he would like to implement. City
Manager Hooper stated he was going to copy verbatim the Altamonte
ordinance which is $50 the first time. It goes to $500 on the
fourth time.
Councilman Vincenzi stated he is all for two warnings and a fine
or two but he doesn't want to get a fine up to $500. He would
rather turn their water off when it gets up to $100 and make it
clear that they know they aren't supposed to do it. City Manager
Hooper agreed to develop that. When the ordinance is front of
them, they can do that. Just say they are going to cap it at
$100 but it is cut off at $100.
5) street liqhts Master Plan
Parks and Recreation Director Jack Corder went over the street
light layout currently within the city. There are a little over
1,000 street lights in the city. He commented on concerns
expressed on the wattage. Currently they have 876 lights at 70
watts. There are 15 at 100 watts, 13 at 150 watts and 105 at 200
watts. He commented on the cost for these street lights.
Councilwoman Lichter asked the total amount per month being paid
to Florida Power & Light. Mr. Corder informed her right now we
have a yearly budget of $100,000.
Mayor Schmidt asked if we rent the poles. Mr. Corder stated
roughly half, yes. Mayor Schmidt asked how much it is to
purchase the poles. Mr. Corder stated depending on the size, you
are looking at $300 and up. If we buy our own poles and one is
snapped, they are responsible for the maintenance.
Mr. Corder commented on the field survey they did. He spoke
about the cost factor going up if they add more street lights.
Councilwoman Lichter asked if they have intent someday where
there are no lights at all to put them on the perimeters of each
section. Are they going to fill in where there are no lights in
Florida Shores? Mr. Corder stated the intent was to do the
survey and come back and ask Council what they wanted to do. He
commented on the way this was operated in the past. Florida
Power & Light recommends roughly 250 feet between lights.
Councilwoman Lichter spoke about people asking for extra lights
to prevent crimes with more street lights. She feels just for
that purpose may not work and there has to be a combination and
finding out what the reason is.
Councilwoman Rhodes asked if there is a general light policy.
Mr. Corder stated he has been in charge of this for two years and
he has been using common sense depending on what is there but
usually no closer than 250 feet together.
Councilwoman Rhodes asked about the corners in Florida Shores
that don't have lights. Mr. Corder stated those are areas they
are going to have to be looking at. He further commented on
lights being installed, if possible, when they were called and
requested in the past. In the two years he has been doing this,
he has had maybe ten phone calls.
Mr. Corder commented on an instance where he installed a light
and two neighbors called and complained they wanted it down.
Councilwoman Lichter spoke about not having this problem in the
future because it will be part of a developer's plan to install
lights. City Manager Hooper stated every new subdivision that
comes in will install them and pay for them.
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February 12, 2001
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City Manager Hooper suggested letting Mr. Corder upgrade the
wattage on some of them. He spoke about putting a blurb in the
newsletter. He suggested responding to it through a program that
they would adopt over multi-year with the budget.
Councilwoman Rhodes spoke about having a street light on the side
of her house and it would never occur to her to call to up the
wattage but if they up the wattage she would be thrilled.
Mr. Corder spoke about except for a few isolated areas in Florida
Shores, there are a few areas where they can run lights or poles
without additional costs. They have come to a point between the
blocks where that cost factor is going to jump immensely on a one
time basis.
Councilwoman Rhodes mentioned identifying the places that don't
have lights where lights could be put that it would not cost any
more than the minimal amount. City Manager Hooper stated he is
not sure they want to put them unless there is a request to do
so.
Mr. Corder spoke about other areas, not in the Shores, such as
Roberts Road from the school to the corner where there is only
one light. He feels this needs to be looked at. He also spoke
about the light on Park Avenue. He feels they need to look at
that also.
Mayor Schmidt asked City Manager Hooper what he needed from them.
City Manager Hooper asked if they want them to do anything
different than go through and up the wattage, put in the
newsletter a story about lights and see what they get. They
could develop a plan and say they are going to add ten or twelve
lights per year and target some areas. He suggested they wait
and see if there is a demand for it.
Councilman Vincenzi asked about target areas where they will
increase the wattage and putting an announcement out and seeing
what people want.
Mr. Corder stated they will go out and target a few areas to
increase the wattage and put an article in the newsletter and see
what kind of response they get. Councilwoman Lichter feels they
will have mixed reactions if they up the wattage allover the
City. If there is no problem or complaint, she doesn't think
they should up it unless there is a lot of crime or work with the
Police Department. City Manager Hooper stated that is the next
step. They will get the officers on night patrol to make notes
in areas that either are crime potential or areas they notice
that are dim and could be lit up.
Mr. Corder again suggested they do an article in the newsletter
and see what kind of response they get from that and they will
bring it back to Council if they get a large response.
Councilman Vincenzi feels before they do anything, if they have
isolated a certain block that needs increased wattage or another
light, he thinks they should solicit input from the residents
around it and find out what the consensus is before any action is
done.
Mayor Schmidt asked if they will look at Roberts Road no matter
what. Mr. Corder stated yes.
Councilwoman Lichter spoke about bus stops and making sure the
lights are there due to kids leaving for school when it is dark.
Councilwoman Rhodes also suggested Votran stops.
Mr. Corder stated there are 520 bus stops in the City and he is
has got it down to 90 that needs light.
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February 12, 2001
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Mayor Schmidt spoke about when SR 442 is widened and even
Riverside Drive about possibly doing lights like Dunlawton Avenue
where the lights are lower and the light is more focused on the
sidewalk. He asked if that is something they need to think about
and work into the designs if they want to do that. City Manager
Hooper stated it is being done on Park Avenue. As Park Avenue is
expanded it will have that look to it. The State they are
talking to on SR 442 has some struggle because of the large
poles. Mayor Schmidt feels even with the large poles, if they
can get them to put the lower lighting in, it is just less accent
on those poles. Councilwoman Lichter feels those poles are a
disgrace.
City Manager Hooper stated they look horrible but keep in mind
they were directed to put them in by a previous Council.
Councilwoman Rhodes asked Mr. Corder when he goes to Florida
Power & Light and he tells them he wants lights or a new pole
there, how responsive are they? Mr. Corder stated currently with
the work orders he has turned into them, the time frame they told
him was four to six weeks but it varies depending on weather.
Councilwoman Lichter spoke about the medians on SR 442 and some
of the poles being taken down. She asked about the other poles
that are there. Mr. Corder stated the poles that are there are
cross lines and a lot of that is either telephone or cable.
City Manager Hooper agreed to do the newsletter and upgrade the
wattage and continue.
Councilwoman Lichter feels safety first.
Dominic Capria, 606 Topside Circle, stated he knows the developer
platted it and they have to pay for their lighting. He stated on
Homeport Terrace there are 4 lights. One was knocked down
recently. He is not sure whether that is part of the platting.
He would like to see that checked out.
Mr. Capria spoke about annexations and the developer paying to
have the street lighting put in. He asked if they will pay the
Florida Power & Light for the street lighting after they are put
in. City Manager Hooper stated yes.
City Manager Hooper informed Council tomorrow is the bid opening
for FIND at 2:00 p.m. if anyone is interested.
City Manager Hooper informed Council they have received a grant
for Phase II of the design of FIND in the amount of $284,000.
They will get price quotes from the current engineers and will
advertise to see if they have new engineers to do Phase II.
Mayor Schmidt asked what the grant money will pay for. City
Manager Hooper stated the permit and design for all of Phase II.
ADJOURNMENT
There being no further business to discuss, Councilwoman Rhodes
moved to adjourn. The meeting adjourned at approximately 8:15
p.m.
Minutes submitted by:
Lisa Bloomer
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February 12, 2001