09-09-2002 - Regular
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CITY COUNCIL OF EDGEWATER
REGUI..AR MEE TING
SEPTEMBER 9, 2002
IMMEDIATELY FOLLOWING SPECIAL MEETING
COMMUNITY CENTER
MINUTES
CALL TO ORDER
Mayor Schmidt called the Regular Meeting to order at 8:50 p.m. in
the Community Center.
ROLL CALL
Mayor Donald Schmidt
Councilman James Brown
Councilman Dennis Vincenzi
Councilwoman Harriet Rhodes
Councilwoman Judith Lichter
City Manager Kenneth Hooper
City Clerk Susan Wadsworth
Legal Assistant Robin Matusick
Present
Present
Present
Present
Present
Present
Present
Present
INVOCATION, PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE
There was a silent invocation and pledge of allegiance to the
Flag.
APPROVAL OF MINUTES
There were no minutes to be approved at this time.
PRESENTATIONS/PROCLAMATIONS/PLAQUES/CERTIFICATES/DONATIONS
A. Recoqnition of appointed/reappointed Board and Committee
members
Mayor Schmidt informed the Council that Councilman Vincenzi would
be leaving us. Myron Hammond will be taking his seat. He
informed Mr. Hammond that they look forward to having him up
there with them.
CITIZEN COMMENTS
Dominic Capria, 606 Topside Circle, reminded everybody that
tomorrow is the Primary Election and to go out and vote. He
wanted to spread the word they have new registration cards and a
lot of the polling districts have changed.
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Doris Hill, 112 Lincoln Road, stated she wanted to speak about
Item 6B with regard to the closing of Boston Road and Item 9A
regarding the City Hall Site Selection.
Ms. Hill stated she believes the two ordinances that were passed
on the noise ordinance and the special activities permits are
really null and void because they were illegally passed under
State Statutes and under our own Comprehensive Plan. Those
changes carne under Article 21 Section 21-94.02 where it says all
modifications or text amendments to Chapter 21 shall be
consistent with the provisions of the Comprehensive Plan. Then
it gives the procedures, which she listed. She stated in this
case this never went before the Planning and Zoning Board. This
is according to the Florida State Statutes and our own Codes.
Ms. Hill stated since it has been passed they really never had a
fair hearing. It never went to the Planning and Zoning Board.
If it had, they would have had a hearing and given their
recommendations to Council. Instead the Council didn't want any
of that. She feels that wasn't fair to the people of this City.
She has consulted with an Attorney and she has been advised that
in fact that the laws have been violated. She told Council
tonight they have two subjects on the agenda relating to the No
Name Saloon, one directly and one indirectly. She is opposed to
closing off part of Boston Road. If they intend to park cars on
the road because they don't have enough parking space, she would
really be opposed to it.
Ms. Hill then went on to speak about the City Hall Site
Selection. The Siting Committee's first choice was the
McAllister property on u.S. #1. Councilwoman Rhodes informed her
we can't buy that. Ms. Hill stated when this carne before Council
that wasn't encumbered in any way. There were two hearings where
90% of the citizens were in favor of that site. She stated she
was here the night the Council talked about it and she heard one
Councilperson say that she would like to see the site on u.S. #1
but further south because of the No Name Saloon. She heard
another Councilperson say that he would not vote for a u.S. #1
site for any reason because of the No Name Saloon. The problems
with the No Name Saloon could have been resolved but they
weren't. She feels up to that point, the Council had done a
pretty good job. But on this job, she suspects they were
misinformed. They did not listen to the people because a
majority of the people did not want the Council to go the way
they went.
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Council Regular Meeting
September 9, 2002
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Andy Anderson, Pine Tree Drive, stated he understands the City
has invested in the stock market. City Manager Hooper stated
what we have invested with is a mutual fund company called
Principal that has invested some of the retirement funds. They
are in a mutual fund and part of those have been invested off and
on with the stock market. The City doesn't invest its funds in
it. That is the retirement funds done by a private company.
Mr. Anderson stated if you were to borrow money from a bank and
they wanted to know what you are doing with the money and you
said you are going into a fund or stocks they would deny you the
loan. His recommendation would have been AAA warranted bonds,
government backed that last year were paying between 7 ~% and 8%.
Mr. Anderson stated the Leadership held some hearings around the
City about where to put the new City Hall. He attended a couple
of those hearings and from what he saw the vote by hand was
between 95% to 100% for the McAllister property on u.s. #1. He
noticed in the paper. the City is looking at somewhere else now.
He feels the people have spoken and this is what they want and he
doesn't know why they are looking somewhere else.
Mr. Anderson stated when they call various City agencies they are
told on the phone they are on lunch break or not available right
now but will get back to you. By the time they get back he's not
home so they are calling him and he is calling them back and he
gets the same message. with the messages back and forth he never
gets to talk to anybody. Lots of times most of the issues don't
get resolved because they don't talk to anybody. He would like
to see something done about that.
Mr. Anderson then spoke about being stopped at the railroad
crossing on SR 442 and there was a train going by very slow.
There were 141 cars with three diesels pulling it. It took about
40 minutes to go by that intersection. He feels this should be
looked at.
Mike Visconti, 316 Pine Breeze Drive, stated he would like to
know about the new City Hall site. He works on u.s. #1 and two
weeks ago a sign was put up from Prudential Realtor Company on
McAllister's property. That makes him believe that something has
happened to that property or that somebody might be interested in
it. He spoke about the citizens wanting the McAllister property.
He spoke of Edgewater having no center of town. He feels it is a
shame they didn't consider the McAllister property when the
opportunity was there.
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Council Regular Meeting
September 9, 2002
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Mayor Schmidt stated that land is under contract right now. City
Manager Hooper stated that is what they will talk about under
Item 9.
CITY COUNCIL REPORTS
Councilwoman Lichter spoke about there being twelve children in
the three homes on Wilkinson Ave. Amy Vaughn told her she never
realized what a cross street that was. The Police Dept. have put
up two signs that say Caution - Children at Play. It is a cut
over from u.S. #1 and Park Avenue. She thinks part of the
problem is that there is no turn arrow on the stop light on Park
Avenue and u.S. #1. She feels there should be a left-hand turn
lane. She feels it is a street that is well traveled. She also
spoke of large trucks using this street. She has spoken to Mr.
Wadsworth who is going to think about possibilities.
Councilwoman Lichter then spoke about the Water Alliance getting
the other cities together in our County. Out of 16 cities there
are 15 cities that have said they will come into the Transition
Team and be part of forming the new entity which will give every
City in Volusia County a vote. She then mentioned a letter in
the Observer written by Joe Stitch. She feels the cities working
together is vital. The County Council wrote the Water Alliance a
letter that the County wants to expand their conservation program
and they are looking for help from the Water Alliance.
Councilwoman Rhodes had nothing at this time.
Councilman Brown informed the Council there will be a service at
the cemetery at 12:00 for 9/11.
Councilman Vincenzi asked what is going on with DBCC and the city
limit sign. City Manager Hooper stated they have approached DBCC
and the City of New Smyrna and they are working on getting signs.
It hasn't gone up yet. The college is going to offer to put
signs on their property and he thinks that will be done in the
next two weeks.
Councilman Vincenzi asked City Manager Hooper if he has looked
into the stop signs by 26th Street. City Manager Hooper stated
they have gone out and looked at the number of cars coming in and
he thinks the Police Chief's report back was that it didn't
warrant a change.
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Council Regular Meeting
September 9, 2002
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Police Chief Ignasiak spoke of having a periodic problem. He
stated what is causing that is all of the other streets have been
shut off. You only have three or four avenues that are exiting
out onto SR 442. They are putting officers in the neighborhoods.
In some cases they are issuing citations for running stop signs,
rolling through stop signs and speeding. They are dealing with
each location as it comes up. This problem will continue until
all the streets are finally open and everyone returns to a normal
flow path.
Councilman Vincenzi mentioned putting rumble strips in. City
Manager Hooper agreed to look at that.
Councilman Brown asked about Chief Ignasiak doing a study on
Wilkinson Avenue. Chief Ignasiak stated that road is heavily
used. It is a legal access road. People who are traveling south
on u.s. #1 if they want to make a left on to Park Avenue they
have to wait at the light. The light does not allow them to load
into a separate lane and make a turn which happens in most busy
intersections. They will stop a block ahead and there is a lane
there they can load off the side out of main traffic and make a
left hand turn and follow it right around and it is perfectly
legal. The speed limit posted is 15 m.p.h. and they have warning
signs up for children. It is an area where they have to exercise
caution. They have not identified a speeding problem, they have
identified a volume problem going on that road.
Councilwoman Lichter suggested asking DOT to get a turn signal
there. City Manager Hooper stated what they will corne back and
describe is turning movements, the number of turns and they would
do the same thing they have talked about on other signals and
warrant studies. He agreed to ask.
Councilman Brown suggested putting in a speed bump or rumble
strips. Chief Ignasiak stated you could put rumble strips there
but they aren't going to change the situation. You aren't
finding vehicles going through fast.
Mayor Schmidt suggested they check with DOT first.
Councilwoman Rhodes suggested closing that street off. City
Manager Hooper agreed to look at this to determine if this is a
good or bad idea.
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Council Regular Meeting
September 9, 2002
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Mayor Schmidt asked about lake lily pad. Mr. Wadsworth stated
they are starting on it. Some of the chemicals they need to use
are backordered. They have some small spray units but until
October 1st they won't be able to get a decent size one that will
make an impact. When they do start it they will have to do a
little at a time because if they do a major kill it will take all
the oxygen out of the water and when that stuff falls you will
have a major fish kill. It will be a slow process to get rid of
all the weeds in that lake. They have started but they won't
make a dent in it for quite a while. They are shooting for a
goal of next Spring.
Mayor Schmidt asked why it is only that lake.
explained there are a lot of canals that are
Schmidt asked if they have to put an aerator
Manager Hooper stated that probably wouldn't
Mr. Wadsworth
the same way. Mayor
in that lake. City
help that problem.
PUBLIC HEARINGS, ORDINANCES AND RESOLUTIONS
A. Res. No. 2002-R-22, Joseph and Cvnthia Cvach requestinq
vacation/abandonment of an unopened/unimproved easement and
riqht-of-wav for a total of 30 feet in width located between two
parcels owned bv applicant, known as Coquina Drive, west of
Bradford Road
City Manager Hooper made a staff presentation.
Legal Assistant Matusick read Res. 2002-R-22 into the record.
Mayor Schmidt opened the public hearing.
Joe Cvach, 1600 Bradford Road, informed Council they recently
purchased the empty lot to the north. The easement has never
been used and will never be used. When they moved in, it was
used as a public dump. He is planning on fencing this property
off if he is granted this abandonment.
Mayor Schmidt closed the public hearing.
Councilwoman Rhodes informed Council Mr. Cvach called her a while
back and she went out and looked at the property. She commented
on the debris out there. She suggested to him at the time that
he apply for this abandonment so the City does not have to take
care of this property.
Councilwoman Lichter stated she had no problem accepting Planning
and Zoning's recommendation.
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Councilwoman Lichter moved to approve Res. 2002-R-22, second by
Councilwoman Rhodes. The motion CARRIED 5-0.
B. Public Hearinq, Tanva Girvan, owner of No Name Saloon,
requestinq a Special Activitv permit for Biketoberfest, October
11, 2002 throuqh October 20, 2002, as well as closinq Boston Road
from 106 Boston Road to US 1 October 17-19, 2002, from 4 p.m. to
midniqht
City Manager Hooper made a staff presentation.
There was a discussion regarding the closing of Boston Road and
no parking being allowed in the street. Councilwoman Lichter
questioned this being monitored. City Manager Hooper explained
it will be monitored and a barricade will be put up.
Councilman Brown asked about lighting if Boston Road is closed.
Tanya Girvan, 3109 Travelers Palm Drive, stated they right now,
even thought the lot on Boston Road isn't theirs, they pay
Florida Power & Light for a street light there. They also pay
for a light on U.S. #1 that lights up a large area. They aren't
only closing it off just for people to walk across. They want to
do this so motorcycles won't go to Riverside Drive and bother the
people that live on Riverside Drive.
Councilman Brown asked if they would be blocking this off to cars
and just motorcycles will be allowed to use it. Ms. Girvan
stated cars use the parking lot across the street. There will be
no cars parked on the street.
Councilman Brown expressed concern with it being extremely loud
when all the motorcycles leave when the bar closes.
City Manager Hooper stated he and Chief Ignasiak have spoken of a
lot more patrol for noise of bikes on other arterials this year.
There will be a lot more enforcement of those with pipes and
being able to make excessive noise than they have in the past.
City Manager Hooper further commented on his strong support for
closing Boston Road to keep the bikes away from residential.
Councilman Vincenzi asked if the people in the area have been
notified and if they had any concerns. City Manager Hooper
stated the advertisement went out to everyone within 500 feet.
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Mayor Schmidt stated it is easy to say no bikes will go down
Boston Road when it is closed off and hit Riverside Drive. She
asked if someone will be put down there. Ms. Girvan informed him
they always do and always have security in the parking lot for
safety reasons. She can't promise that people aren't going to go
down to the light at Falcon Avenue and go down that road and
drive by Mr. Anderson or Ms. Hill's house.
Councilwoman Lichter asked if anything has been done about the
sound stage. The alley behind that going to Cameron's was where
the noise was the loudest. Ms. Girvan stated they didn't do
anything. All they did was abide by the City's decibel readings.
They had somebody come out twice a day to take a reading and they
were not over those. Councilwoman Rhodes stated she did tell
them she was going to do that. Ms. Girvan stated she did and she
was told to stop and hold off on everything until the ordinance
stuff was going also. She could put an egg crate barrier if
Council would like her to do that.
Councilwoman Lichter stated she heard the noise the most at the
end of the alley next to Boston Road. Ms. Girvan again agreed to
put up an egg crate barrier.
Councilman Vincenzi stated after the last round of problems, they
were supposed to do surveying and other things like that to bring
their property into compliance. City Manager Hooper explained
Ms. Girvan and her dad had applied to add an additional bar area,
additional impervious, and to expand that site meant it had to
come into compliance. It is a non-conforming site today because
it extends into the right-of-way and doesn't have the property
setbacks. Since that time, the owners have withdrawn that
request and haven't added anything.
City Manager Hooper stated he has spoken to them about the
parking which is still a safety issue with regard to parking
outside and parking along u.S. #1. Since then he hasn't seen any
vehicle parking. He has seen a few bikes there but along those
lines they have made efforts and there are cones and signs that
say no parking.
Mayor Schmidt opened the public hearing.
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Doris Hill, 112 Lincoln Road, asked city Manager Hooper how many
parking places must they have to be in compliance. With a
special activity permit, there is not a specific number. He
asked city Manager Hooper what the restaurant would require
beyond that. Chief Planner Darren Lear stated he would have to
check on the number of seats and tables they have.
Ms. Hill then asked if they still have permission to use the
McAllister property for parking. City Manager Hooper informed
her yes.
Ferd Heeb, 115 N. Riverside Drive, feels that the citizens of
Edgewater don't want this to be an event city. What they have is
a number of businesses that are springing up saying they want to
make Edgewater an event city and they want to attract this kind
of a tourist attraction or trade. He doesn't know what the
answer is. Ms. Girvan's arguments are compelling and the
arguments on the other side of the fence are compelling. He
expressed concern with the closing of Boston Road. What that
tells him is the City is subsidizing a special event by allowing
that entity to use public property. In addition they are
subsidizing this event by increasing the number of police
officers, patrols and traffic control to accommodate the events
of this particular enterprise. He disagrees with closing Boston
Road so they can have the use of that road for their event. He
likes the idea of keeping bikes off Riverside Drive but there is
no way they are going to keep the noise of bikes off Riverside
Drive. He then commented on hearing the traffic on Ridgewood
Avenue. He feels the Council is exacerbating the problem because
there are going to be thousands of motorcycles going up and down
u.s. #1 and the reason is because this Council is allowing this
City to become a special event destination. He is opposed to it.
Councilwoman Rhodes stated Boston Road is not being closed so Ms.
Girvan can use it. It is being closed to keep the people that
are going to Ms. Girvan's place off of Boston Road. Mr. Heeb has
an issue with closing Boston Road because they shouldn't be
parking on Boston Road and they shouldn't be creating those
problems because closing it is to allow access from the parking
lot to the establishment across Boston Road.
Ms. Girvan stated you will be able to get on Boston Road from
U.S.#l. You will not be able to go beyond 106 Boston Road.
Councilwoman Rhodes stated you will be able to go on Boston Road
but you won't be able to go any further on Boston Road than her
property.
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Mr. Heeb stated so that is not giving her access to that
property. Councilwoman Rhodes stated she already has access.
She owns it. What she doesn't own, she has permission to have
people park there. Mr. Heeb stated the arguments are compelling
but he is opposed to it and he is opposed to the increase in
special events in this community.
Councilwoman Rhodes stated she thinks closing Boston Road is the
best thing to do for the public.
Councilwoman Lichter asked if they
to monitor the end of Boston Road.
her no, we are not. Ms. Girvan is
the normal patrol that we have out
they do anyway.
are paying for extra policemen
City Manager Hooper informed
paying for an officer and on
they will go by that area like
Mike Visconti, 316 Pine Breeze Drive, asked the No Name Saloon to
beautify and landscape the front of their property.
Mayor Schmidt closed the public hearing.
Councilwoman Rhodes moved to approve the Special Activities
Permit for the No Name Saloon for Biketoberfest activities from
October 11, 2002 through October 20, 2002 as well as the closing
of Boston Road from 106 Boston Road to u.S. #1 October 17-19,
2002 from 4 p.m. to midnight, second by Councilwoman Lichter.
The motion CARRIED 5-0.
Councilwoman Rhodes agreed with Mr. Visconti regarding the
beautification of No Name Saloon.
C. Public Hearino, an appeal of the Technical Review Committee
(TRC) denial of the proposed site plan for the expansion of
Coastal Tire, located at 1701 S. Ridoewood Avenue
City Manager Hooper made a staff presentation. Staff recommends
denial of the driveway application because of a public safety
issue. Staff also recommends denial of the sign.
Ron Carwile, 1701 S. Ridgewood Avenue, went over additional
information that was included in the Council's packet with regard
to the driveway.
City Manager Hooper went over what he feels is a safety issue per
the request of Mr. Carwile. He commented on there being a
traffic problem created by the driveway.
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Mr. Carwile referenced a letter from DOT regarding how much they
appreciate this driveway being talked about being moved and the
location where they want to move it. Once the traffic is on his
property it is his responsibility unless the City wants to give
him a hold harmless and assume the responsibility of traffic on
his property.
Mr. Carwile passed out the letter to the Council from the
Department of Transportation.
Councilwoman Lichter feels eliminating the end driveway in the
north part is excellent. The letter only addresses the fact that
the state thinks that was a good idea with regard to the two
driveways that are left.
Councilwoman Lichter made mention of all the arrows within the
property being a potential safety hazard because they are coming
and going. She asked if in any way that is the City's
responsibility if something happens. City Manager Hooper
elaborated on what occurs.
Councilwoman Lichter questioned the reason for not doing one way
in and one way out. Mr. Carwile commented on servicing large
trucks and the trucks not being able to make that turn. He feels
this driveway should have never been a concern. It was never a
problem until the last meeting. He referred to the second page
of the 8/13/02 comments from the TRC with regard to the Police
Department.
Councilwoman Lichter asked if there is a possibility that he
writes off on the liability to the City. City Manager Hooper
stated they could get a release of liability and hold harmless
approved. City Manager Hooper stated he is sure the City
Attorney would tell them that that would not suffice.
Mr. Carwile stated unless the Council can prove there is
something unsafe about it, he can't see why they would want to
deny a driveway that DOT obviously wants moved. Councilwoman
Lichter stated the DOT part isn't the problem. It is the
interflow within, the turning within the narrow confines of the
area. Mr. Carwile stated unless the City wants to have its
engineer draw up his driveway and assume the responsibilities of
it, he doesn't think Council has any choice on this. Mr. Carwile
stated they had engineers draw this up.
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Councilman Vincenzi stated he doesn't see that there is a safety
issue. It has been this way for 42 years. Mr. Carwile stated
they have never had an accident and they have two driveways that
do the same thing that these two do except the other driveway
they are eliminating has an entrance and an exit.
Councilman Vincenzi stated it hasn't been a problem for 40 years,
why is it going to be a problem now. City Manager Hooper stated
because he is greatly expanding his business. Mr. Carwile stated
he is refurbishing the building, adding on some office space, and
moving the tire store to the south end of the property.
Councilman Vincenzi stated even if there is an increase in
traffic flow, they are still only traveling four mile per hour.
City Manager Hooper recommended to Council that the driveway come
in and there is a right in and you are able to make that swing
and come out or you can come out on Hardin. Mr. Carwile
explained there is no way to drive a 20-ton truck around that
center driveway back into his driveway.
Mr. Carwile stated they aren't going to give up the driveway.
They have been there for 42 years and they haven't been a
problem.
Councilman Vincenzi feels somebody suing the City if there is an
accident on Mr. Carwile's property doesn't seem plausible to him.
Mr. Carwile again referred to the comments made by the Police
Department and none of them deal with what City Manager Hooper is
talking about. Councilwoman Lichter suggested signage may help.
Councilwoman Lichter would like the City Attorney to inform her
that the responsibility would come on to us if the City approved
a variance. She further spoke about the other businesses on u.S.
#1 that have been here for a long time and many code changes
involving grandfathering. She would like this to totally be Mr.
Carwile's responsibility and wondered if they could accomplish
that if something happens within.
Councilwoman Rhodes asked if that was a vacant lot and somebody
wanted to build a business on that lot would they be allowed by
our Codes to have two driveways. City Manager Hooper informed
her no.
Councilwoman Rhodes questioned why Mr. Carwile needed two
driveways for trucks. Mr. Carwile explained that trucks can not
make the turn.
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Councilwoman Lichter would like to see if they can get out of the
liability if something happens within. She would like to move on
to the sign issue. She doesn't think Mr. Carwile has too much
leeway because it is an older lot, an older setup that is close
to the street.
There was further discussion regarding trucks not being able to
make the turn and trucks exiting onto u.S. #1 which has a 45
m.p.h. speed limit.
Councilwoman Rhodes asked Mr. Carwile why he would need the
middle driveway to be both directions. Mr. Carwile elaborated.
He stated he doesn't have to build this building. It is going to
cost him over $1 million and they thought they had all of the
things worked out when they were here a year ago.
Councilwoman Rhodes stated they aren't telling Mr. Carwile to
eliminate the driveway. They are telling him to eliminate the
traffic flow he has going from the driveway. Mr. Carwile asked
how to do that. Councilwoman Rhodes informed him to have it go
one way, one way in and one way out. Mr. Carwile commented on
the thousands of dollars they have spent drawing this up three or
four times trying to appease the City. They drew it to what they
asked them to draw. Unless the City wants to give him a hold
harmless and the City assume the way the arrows move, then they
can do that or he could build a single story instead of a two-
story building. He thought the driveway was one thing he was
giving the City that the City wanted.
Mr. Carwile asked the qualifications of Mr. Lear and City Manager
Hooper for drawing the arrows. City Manager Hooper stated they
are trying to tell him there is a problem with the traffic. It
is not consistent with our Land Development Code. On the August
plan submitted by Mr. Carwile the driveway was not on there. Mr.
Carwile stated the landscaping plan is the same plan they showed
the City that had the driveway on it. They only moved the
driveway after the second, third or fourth TRC meeting.
Mayor Schmidt suggested the trucks go around the back of the
building. Mr. Carwile informed him there isn't enough room.
Mayor Schmidt stated there are arrows there so there has to be
enough room for vehicles. Mr. Carwile stated there is a 15 foot
driveway around the back of the building but it isn't enough for
a 20-ton truck to make traffic around through there on a regular
basis.
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Councilwoman Rhodes stated the driveway is not in the plan that
the Council saw. Mr. Carwile stated City Manager Hooper asked
him to move it. City Manager Hooper stated he asked him to close
it. Mr. Carwile stated he originally asked them to close it and
then he asked them to move it which they agreed to do.
Councilwoman Rhodes asked Mr. Carwile if he had any minutes from
any meetings to that effect. Mr. Carwile stated those were a
private meeting outside and he wasn't in on those private
meetings so the Council would have to speak with Mr. Martin on
that.
Councilwoman Lichter felt the sign issue would be resolved
simpler. Sometimes when you get into problems you get an
arbitrator, someone else to take a look at just this issue. She
expressed concern with legally getting out of anything that might
happen within. She feels having the extra driveway on the corner
is only an improvement and having the traffic go out from the
little street on the side is only an improvement. She wondered
if they could get a hold harmless agreement letter and give him
the variance.
Councilman Vincenzi stated he still doesn't think that is
necessary. City Manager Hooper and Mr. Lear have not proven to
him that it is a big safety issue that really needs to stop this
guy from doing what he wants to do.
Councilwoman Lichter stated some signage in there wouldn't hurt.
Mr. Carwile agreed to put up small signage.
Mayor Schmidt opened the public hearing.
Noritta Harris, 2425 Orange Tree Drive, spoke of a hold harmless
agreement she was granted and there were damages and the City
didn't have to pay for them. She had to put new driveways in.
She doesn't see why it can't work for this gentleman.
Joe Martin, East Volusia Engineering, stated he was the engineer
on this project. In the discussions with the staff with respect
to moving the driveway or eliminating it, it was requested that
they eliminate that driveway and basically have one. His
response, a compromise, was they would move it. That is
essentially what they did. Councilwoman Lichter stated and that
was agreed on. Mr. Martin stated it was not agreed on. It was
in a discussion with the TRC.
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Mr. Martin presented some insight where he comes from as a design
professional. He feels the Land Development Code should be
something he can rely on without frequent recourse of staff
interpretation. Where a clear case of ambiguity is believed to
exist and its incumbent on him its prudent to contact staff and
see if they can't work out an interpretation before proceeding
with the design. He referred to Article II in the Land
Development Code. It does not contain a definition of commercial
center or shopping center therefore other means have to be used
to determine if Mr. Carwile is entitled to more than one pole or
ground sign. He then referred to Article VI which is the sign
regulations. As presently written there is no ambiguity with
respect to Mr. Carwile's entitlement. This article describes the
type of signs and relates their use to two unique categories,
residential and non-residential. He arrived at this conclusion
by considering 21-61.02 which covers development signs or signs
that a developer would put up. If Mr. Carwile wishes to erect a
development sign to advertise this project, he would have to be
granted a permit under the non-residential category. They aren't
asking for a development sign. Within the non-residential
category, reference is made to two subcategories, commercial and
industrial properties. Within the two subcategories it certainly
isn't industrial, which is not permitted in a B-3 zone, therefore
it has to be considered commercial and Mr. Carwile is entitled to
two pole or ground signs per 21-67.07. With respect to the
access driveways, he doesn't believe there is any ambiguity in
this case either. He then referred to 21-52.02C which says you
must have a driveway at least 630 feet from Hardin. This does
not apply to this project. It is already there. He then
referred to Section 21-52.02C means that in order to have a
driveway onto U.S. #1 the minimum spacing between streets coming
off U.S. #1 would have to be over 1,320 feet or 1/4 of a mile. A
majority of the street between 10th Street on the north and
Indian River Blvd. on the south are much closer than this, which
means a majority of this U.S. #1 frontage can not be redeveloped
without seeking a variance. You can not deny a variance because
you can not deny a person use of their property. Why require
them to expend the time and funds to go through a variance
request and that deals only with that 630 feet space. If the
intent for the use of 21-52.02C is to create an upscale U.S. #1
frontage patterened after the Dunlawton corridor in Port Orange,
then the City must acquire the B-3 frontage and much of the
residential property behind B-3 and redevelop it with frontage
roads on each side. If this is not the intent, then the City
needs to change the language of that Article in those paragraphs.
He commented on a report written by the Industrial Board years
ago where there were twelve recommendations and one of them was
to approve the appearance of U.S. #1.
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Council Regular Meeting
September 9, 2002
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Councilwoman Rhodes asked Mr. Martin if he helped write the Land
Development Code. Mr. Martin stated he didn't help write it but
he had 14 pages of comments but he thinks he missed this one.
Mayor Schmidt asked about the south driveway and wanting the
trucks to be able to make a u-turn. He commented on the proposed
Drive-thru roof over. He is assuming the trucks can fit
underneath there. Mr. Carwile informed him that is correct.
There was a brief discussion regarding what type of trucks Mr.
Carwile works on. Mayor Schmidt has concerns with the u-turn in
the middle of the parking lot. Mr. Carwile stated it actually
goes through the bays and through the back with a double driveway
back there and around the building and back out.
City Manager Hooper explained regarding parking, our compromise
from staff was to allow the internal bays to be used as parking.
Mr. Carwile stated they are parked when they are doing service on
them.
Mike Visconti, 316 Pine Breeze Drive, asked the difference
between the driveway at Riverside Bank compared to this driveway.
Mayor Schmidt stated they have room to go all the way around the
building.
Mayor Schmidt closed the public hearing.
Councilman Vincenzi stated he thinks Mr. Carwile wants to do a
lot of improvements to his property and he is putting a lot of
time, money and effort into it and this is a minimal point that
is not worth arguing about. He doesn't feel the safety issue has
been addressed properly.
Councilwoman Rhodes agreed with Councilman Vincenzi. The reason
she doesn't like it is because anybody else couldn't do it.
Councilman Vincenzi moved to accept Mr. Carwile's proposal to
design the driveway as he specified, second by Councilman Brown.
The motion CARRIED 4-1. Mayor Schmidt voted NO.
Mr. Carwile made a presentation regarding signage. He feels
somebody should be assigned signage according to what the
frontage of their property is on u.S. #1.
Councilman Vincenzi asked City Manager Hooper when they went
through the Technical Review if he was willing to compromise on
the signs.
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Council Regular Meeting
September 9, 2002
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City Manager Hooper stated they talked of the compromise. If the
driveway could be avoided that they just went through they were
willing to give on the sign. He commented on this being an
aesthetic issue, not a public safety issue. Mr. Carwile
explained how he would be going from five signs to two signs, one
which would be an anchor sign and one would be a tenant sign. He
then spoke of there being nine or ten units that will be involved
in the new building. There is no way to operate nine or ten
businesses with 60 square feet of sign. He feels the sign
ordinance should be looked at again.
There was a brief discussion regarding a height limit on the
signs.
Mayor Schmidt asked how the signs would affect the driveways if
they are ground signs. City Manager Hooper stated he doesn't
think they will affect the driveways.
Mr. Carwile commented on where the ground signs will be placed.
Due to there being no comments, Mayor Schmidt opened and closed
the public hearing.
Councilwoman Lichter felt the signs will be an improvement and
had no objection.
There was a brief discussion regarding Mr. Carwile being able to
have two signs due to having two parcels. City Manager Hooper
stated one site plan, one use. Mr. Carwile explained it is would
actually be one use once it is altogether and done. Until this
project is done, it is certainly different use properties.
Councilman Vincenzi moved to accept Mr. Carwile's proposal and
allow him to put the signage he requests, second by Councilwoman
Lichter. The motion CARRIED 4-1. Councilwoman Rhodes voted NO.
There was a ten-minute recess at this time.
BOARD APPOINTMENTS
There were no board appointments at this time.
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Council Regular Meeting
September 9, 2002
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CONSENT AGENDA
There were no items to be discussed on the Consent Agenda at this
time.
OTHER BUSINESS
A. City Hall Site Selection - staff presentinq site options for
a new City Hall
City Manager Hooper made a staff presentation regarding the site
options for a new City Hall. He also made mention of a site that
is south on u.S. #1 that was mentioned by Tim Howard that
consists of about 15 acres. He thinks the three sites they are
down to are McCaskill's site out by 1-95 and SR 442, May's
property south of the new middle school, and Mr. Howard's site
which is south on u.S. #1.
Tim Howard, 3028 Willow Oak Drive, spoke to the Council about the
site he has proposed.
There was discussion between the Council regarding the proposed
sites. They agreed on Site 2 and the new site proposed by Mr.
Howard. Councilwoman Rhodes made mention of the citizens wanting
to see City Hall on u.S. #1. Whether they want it so far down on
u.S. #1 is another issue. She feels the citizens will want it to
be further south on u.S. #1 rather than further west on SR 442.
Councilman Vincenzi asked City Manager Hooper to keep an eye on
the McCallister property in case the deal falls through.
B. Memorandum of Understandinq - staff recommendinq supportinq a
Comprehensive Potable Water Interconnect Proqram for coastal
entities and authorize the Mayor to execute the document
City Manager Hooper made a staff presentation.
Councilwoman Lichter moved to accept supporting the Comprehensive
Potable Water Interconnect Program, second by Councilwoman
Rhodes. The motion CARRIED 5-0.
C. Animal Shelter Facility - staff recommendinq 1950 S. Airpark
Road as the site for the construction of an Educational Center
and Animal Shelter Facility and authorizinq the City Manaqer to
execute a Lease Aqreement with Pet Society, Inc.
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Council Regular Meeting
September 8, 2002
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City Manager Hooper made a staff presentation. Staff recommends
approval of this particular site.
Mayor Schmidt asked if they have had any complaints. City
Manager Hooper and Legal Assistant Matusick stated neither had
received any complaints.
Councilman Vincenzi asked about the two sites they were looking
at. City Manager Hooper stated they narrowed it down to Airpark
Road and Park Avenue. He further commented on the Park Avenue
site and this being an area that can't be developed.
Councilwoman Lichter stated she is a member of the Pet Society,
she is not an officer and she is not acting as their spokesperson
in any way.
Councilwoman Rhodes moved to select 1950 S. Airpark Road as the
site for an Education Center and Animal Shelter Facility and
authorize City Manager Hooper to execute a lease agreement,
second by Councilman Brown. The motion CARRIED 5-0.
OFFICER REPORTS
City Clerk Wadsworth reminded everyone to vote tomorrow.
City Attorney
1) Stipulation & Settlement Aoreement relatino to local
amendments to the Florida Buildino Code
Legal Assistant Matusick presented an update on the Florida
Building Code Challenge that was brought up by the Florida
Homeowners Association.
Councilwoman Lichter moved to accept the Stipulation &
Settlement Agreement, second by Councilwoman Rhodes. The motion
CARRIED 5-0.
City Manager Hooper had nothing at this time.
CITIZEN COMMENTS/CORRESPONDENCE
Mike Visconti, 316 Pine Breeze Drive, asked if a site has been
chosen for City Hall. He was informed no. Mr. Visconti then
asked if they are contemplating a golf course. City Manager
Hooper informed him no.
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Council Regular Meeting
September 9, 2002
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Donna Wagner, Pet Society Inc, thanked the Council and informed
them of a fundraiser they have already started. She has raffle
tickets for a Lazy Boy chair.
ADJOURNMENT
There being no further business to discuss, Councilwoman Rhodes
moved to adjourn. The meeting adjourned at 11:05 p.m.
Minutes submitted by:
Lisa Bloomer
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Council Regular Meeting
September 9, 2002