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07-29-1985 & 07-30-1985 - Special/Workshop r Q u CITY COUNCIL OF EDGEWATER SPECIAL MEETING AND WORKSHOP JULY 29, 1985 MINUTES Mayor Baugh called the Special Meeting to order at 1:00 PM in the Community Center. He stated the reason for the meeting was to inter- view the Police Chief candidates. ROLL CALL Mayor Earl Baugh Councilman Louis Rotundo Councilman Russell Prater Councilman Neil Asting Present Present Present Present Councilman James Inman City Attorney Jose'Alvarez City Clerk Connie Martinez Lieutenant William Britain Present Excused Present Excused Mayor Baugh asked for a motion to adjourn the Special Meeting and go into the Workshop. Councilman Inman so moved. Councilman Asting seconded the motion. Motion CARRIED 5-0. Vincent Pishnery was introduced to Council members by City Clerk Martinez. Councilman Prater asked him his primary reason to seek this position and Mr. Pishnery replied that he's a resident of Edgewater and owns property here but his business is in Boca Raton where he's a polygraph operator. He said he's retired as a Police Chief in Ohio with 28 years of experience and he likes Edgewater. He stated that he feels he could do a good job for the City with his past experience and education. He advised Council that he brought his credentials and other documents with him if they'd like to review them. He said he was very embarrassed about the score he got but was very sleepy at the interview because he'd been up for 40 hours with the Broward Crime Commission with other job duties. Councilman Rotundo asked if he's familiar with this area and Mr. Pishnery replied yes, to a point. Councilman Rotundo asked what he'd do first to organize the Police Department. Mr. Pishnery replied that he'd interview the Police officers they have and survey what they have and then give the Mayor and Council his decision of what they have to work with and any improvements he feels they need to work with. Councilman Inman asked when he came to this area and Mr. Pishnery replied it was 11 years ago. Councilman Inman asked about the platoon system and Mr. Pishnery said it's a very good system with different zones. Councilman Inman explained the platoon system here is 8 hours with three shifts or 12 hour shifts with two days on and two days off. Mr. Pishnery said he tried that in his small Police Department but it seems that after 8 hours a man has done his duty and they don't get the proper rest and doesn't make for good Police offihers. Councilman Asting asked about budget expenditures and if there were money left over at the end of the fiscal year and his department would like to buy some- thing, what would he do about it. Mr. Pishnery said the purchase would be with the approval of the person in charge of the budget and he uses his budget like a Bible. Mayor Baugh asked his definition of vicarious liability and how it works within the Police Department. Mr. Pishnery asked the policy here now and Mayor Baugh said he just wants his interpretation as there are certain things the officers can or can't do. Mr. Pishnery said he teaches a lot of this at the college and according to what they were taught and the laws is what they go by. Councilman Prater asked his date of birth and noted it wasn't on his resume. Mr. Pishnery replied it's May 4, 1923. Councilman Prater asked if he has any health problems, physical or mental, and Mr. Pishnery replied no, and he works out mornings and takes a lot of vitamins and is in excellent health and could get a statement from his doctor. Councilman Rotundo asked the size of the city in Woodmere, Ohio, and Mr. Pishnery said it was 30,000 to 35,000 and is located in Northeast Ohio. Councilman Rotundo asked how many men he had and Mr. Pishnery replied 28. .' o Q Mr. Pishnery (Continued) - Councilman Inman asked about in house training for the officers and Mr. Pishnery said there are a lot of classes through the Police Chiefs' organi- zation and some community colleges offer the classes but he doesn't know what's available in this area. Councilman Inman asked about in house classes without utilizing community colleges and Mr. Pishnery said he would put on classes himself which he's qualified to do. Councilman Inman asked about the training and going to the firing range for proficiency with firearms and Mr. Pishnery said it would be once a month. Councilman Inman asked what type of: course he would have and Mr. Pishnery said a combat course is what they should be going to. Councilman Inman asked if that includes shotguns and Mr. Pishnery replied yes. Mr. Pishnery noted that in Ohio it's mandatory that they go to the range once a month. Councilman Asting explained that the City is organized in different departments and asked if he felt the Police Department should be separate from adminis- tration since the work is somewhat different. Mr. Pishnery said each depart- ment has its own work to do. Councilman Asting explained the organizational structure of the City with the City Clerk/Administrator passing decisions and information from Council to the department heads and asked if the Police Department should be there. Mr. Pishnery said they should be right under there. Mayor Baugh asked if he's a certified officer in the State of Florida and Mr. Pishnery replied no but it would take him 48 hours to get it and he has applied for it. Mayor Baugh asked if the officers should be trained on their own time or on City time for Police Standards and Training courses. Mr. Pishnery said the City should pay for it as it motivates them a lot more. Mayor Baugh pointed out they get paid by the State for going to the courses and Mr. Pishnery agreed that then the City shouldn't pick up the tab for it. Councilman Prater asked if he can take orders as well as give them and Mr. Pishnery replied yes. Councilman Prater asked if he would be willing to go on a six month probationary period if chosen for the position and Mr. Pishnery replied yes, and he feels he should work the probation to prove himself. Councilman Rotundo asked if he's familiar with the purchasing policy they have to abide by and Mr. Pishnery replied yes. Councilman Asting asked how many hours the Chief should put in each week and Mr. Pishnery said he never saw just 40 hours and the hours are many because they have problems they have to get out and he wants to be on top of things. He added that he's very stringent in that area and will put in the hours. Councilman Inman asked about using charts in the department such as pins on a map to show accident areas. Mr. Pishnery said it's very good and he'd know to use priorities in that area and is a good guideline to validate an increase in patrol or whatever is needed. Mr. Pishnery added that he went to a school on traffic control. Councilman Inman noted that the City is getting weapons and leather per an agreement with the Association and asked his preference of the type that should be carried. Mr. Pishnery replied there's a standard weapon and leather and some departments get the fast draw holster but he doesn't approve of that. He said he wouldn't go higher than 357 and the 38 is normal but the standard leather is what they need and he opposes the fast draw holster. Councilman Inman asked about the holster that locks the weapon in and Mr. Pishnerysaid he isn't referring to that with fast draw. Councilman Asting asked what he'd consider for a starting salary during pro- bation and Mr. Pishnery replied it would be whatever the City decides as finances aren't a problem with him as he draws pension from the State of Ohio. Councilman Asting asked if he'd have problems with taking orders or instructions from the City Clerk/Administrator who is a lady and Mr. Pishnery replied no, if it's a valid order and he's never had problems before, but he doesn't always agree to everything. Mayor Baugh asked what he'd do if he'd made a decision and 4 or 5 officers told him they didn't agree with it. Mr. Pishnery said if he made a decision or put out an order, they'll work it his way and if it's wrong, he'll answer for it. He added that if it's job procedure, that would be different and he'd have to qualify what it would be. -2- Council Special Meeting & Workshop Minutes July 29, 1985 o o Mr. Pishnery (Continued) - Councilman Prater asked how he'd check it out. Mr. Pishnery said check it out. Mayor Baugh asked and Mr. Pishnery replied yes. Councilman Prater asked when he'd consider high speed pursuit warranted and Mr. Pishnery said when a felon is involved, such as armed robbery. handle citizens' complaints and if he'd want every complaint answered if he'd request a signed citizen!~ he'd and will complaint Councilman Asting pointed out that there's a speeding problem in parts of Edgewater especially in the morning hours and asked how he'd handle it. Mr. Pishnery asked if they have radar and Councilman Asting replied yes. Mr. Pishnery said he'd use it and the word will get around and they can have a car posted. Councilman Asting asked if he believes in setting up speed traps and Mr. Pishnery said he doesn't like them but if it warrants it, yes. Councilman Asting asked if he'd conceal them and Mr. Pishnery replied no. Councilman Rotundo asked if he'd had a chance to look at the Police Depart- ment building and facilities, and Mr. Pishnery replied no. Mayor Baugh asked if he'd have trouble disciplining an officer about a citizen's complaint and Mr. Pishnery replied no and he's done it many times. Councilman Inman asked his reaction if a patrol officer, especially on late hours, is caught sleeping in his patrol car. Mr. Pishnery said he'd find out what the problem is and if it's a first offense he'd want to go into it but if it's a second offense and no illness or problem he'd follow the City's rules regarding this. He added that at 4 or 5AM it's hard to stay awake and he's told his patrolmen not to sit out behind buildings to sleep but to come into the department and get relief. Councilman Inman asked about officers drinking coffee in a patrol car and Mr. Pishnery said he's opposed to it because he's opened cars so often that had several cups on the floor. Council- man Inman asked about officers coming into the station for coffee and Mr. Pishnery said it's according to how long he's been on patrol and if it's close to lunch time. Councilman Rotundo asked how he'd handle abuse of sick time and Mr. Pishnery said if they're habitual offenders of sick leave they had to get a full report from the doctor as to why the illness came up so often. He added that he believes in running a stringent organization. Mayor Baugh thanked Mr. Pishnery for coming for the interview. Mr. Pishnery stated that he's a polygraph operator and licensed in the State of Florida and would like to develop a good, solid department. Mayor Baugh recessed the Workshop at 1:32PM to await the next candidate's arrival. City Clerk Martinez introduced Edward Overman to Council members. Mayor Baugh called the recessed workshop back to order at 1:53PM. Mayor Baugh explained the interview process to Mr. Overman. Councilman Prater asked his primary reason to seek the position. Mr. Overman replied that while with the City in the past he developed a relationship with the City and enjoyed the City and he's ready to become a Chief and would like to be Chief here and be a part of the process of what is to be done in the City. Councilman Rotundo asked what changes he'd make if he became Chief and Mr. Overman said he set up some rules and regulations and started an internal communications process and would like more community involvement which he started. He added that he'd like to continue what he did before and he thinks morale of the department was coming up at the time. Councilman Inman asked about the platoon system versus the 8 hours and Mr. Overman said he's in favor of 8-hour shifts. -3- Council Special Meeting & Workshop Minutes July 29, 1985 ~ o o Edward Overman (Continued) - Councilman Asting asked if he'd go ahead and purchase something he'd like to have for his department if he found he had surplus funds at the end of the fiscal year. Mr. Overman said he wouldn't take the end of the year money and spend it just for the sake of spending it but would ask for it if he felt it was something important. Mayor Baugh asked his definition of vicarious liability and Mr. Overman replied it's liability concerned with a supervisor regarding control of an individual and any incidents he should know about which he's responsible for. Councilman Prater asked if he'd work a six-months probation if selected and Mr. Overman replied yes. Councilman Prater asked if he can take orders as well as administer them and Mr. Overman replied yes. Councilman Prater asked about abuse of sick leave and Mr. Overman said when he first came to our City there was over 300 hours of sick time and he decreased it to about 178 hours, and sick time is sometimes a way for a man to say something and it must be controlled by management and shouldn't be abused. Councilman Inman asked about in-house training and Mr. Overman said they'd have to get the firearms training more than in the past and they should have some formal training to protect against vicarious liability. Councilman Inman asked how often they should go on the firearms range and Mr. Overman replied about twice a year. Mr. Overman said he liked the short course from DBCC. Councilman Inman asked if it would include shotgun training and Mr. Overman replied yes. Councilman Asting asked how many hours the Chief should work and Mr. Overman replied a minimum of 40 hours but a time can't be put on it, just whatever hours are necessary to perform the function. Mayor Baugh asked about off-duty activities of Police employees such as drinking and driving while drinking. Mr. Overman said an employee shouldn't do anything that would embarrass or bring discredit to the department. Councilman Prater asked how he'd handle citizens' complaints and Mr. Overman replied that every citizen deserves an answer but sometimes a citizen doesn't like the answer. He said they serve the citizens and all problems should be addressed. Mayor Baugh asked if they'd have to sign a citizen's complaint form and Mr. Overman said he'd require it if the complaint is against a Police officer but if it's civil or not criminal, he'd react to it. Councilman Rotundo asked if he felt the Police Department needs to be enlarged, both in building and personnel. Mr. Overman replied that the building was inadequate unless they've made additions and he'd have to look at personnel but he'd like 8-hour shifts which might require additional personnel. Mayor Buagh asked if they were on 8-hours when he was here and Mr. Overman replied yes. Mayor Baugh noted that they've gone back to 12 hours now. Mayor Baugh asked if he'd go against them if the employees wanted 12 hours and Mr. Overman said yes. Councilman Inman asked about a patrolman caught sleeping on duty in the early mornings and Mr. Overman said he'd send him home and would have a talk with him to find out why he did it and then would write it up. Councilman Inman asked about coffee breaks and drinking coffee in patrol cars. Mr. Overman said not in the cars, but he'd give them coffee breaks. Councilman Inman asked if he'd let them come into the station for breaks and Mr. Overman said yes, but they'd have to call it in and not abuse it and they could be doing office work then. Councilman Asting asked if the Police Department should be a separate entity from administration and Mr. Overman replied no, he doesn't see the need for it. Councilman Asting asked if the Police Chief should be on the same level as other department heads and Mr. Overman replied yes. Councilman Prater asked about traffic law enforcement and Mr. Overman said all laws should be enforced but some may be second to others and priorities must be determined. Councilman Asting asked how he'd control speeding in the City and Mr. Overman replied with radar units, clocking in the area, through citizen complaints and known speedways. Mayor Baugh pointed out that some roads are being paved in Florida Shores and asked if an officer should be kept in the Shores area. Mr. Overman said he broke the City in two zones and one is mostly the Shores. Councilman Asting asked if he should be cruising or parked to observe the traffic and Mr. Overman said cruising is a good method but some trouble spots may have to be watched. -4- Council Special Meeting & Workshop Minutes July 29, 1985 o o Edward Overman (Continued) - Councilman Rotundo asked what fair salary he'd expect and Mr. Overman replied that he felt that's premature and he'd made proposals, but it would be his sole source of income. Councilman Rotundo noted that his present job is at $30,000. and Mr. Overman agreed. Councilman Asting asked if he ha~ problems with administrative procedures or purchasing policies of the City and Mr. Overman replied no, and they live within the system they're in. Councilman Asting reviewed the liaison duties between the City Clerk/Administrator and department heads and asked Mr. Overman if he had any problems with that. Mr. Overman replied that he didn't have any problems in the past and wouldn't have any problems now. Councilman Rotundo asked if he felt the purchase orders are a good idea and Mr. Overman said he had no problems. Councilman Inman asked about using charts pinpointing accidents on a map of the City. Mr. Overman said he believes in statistics. Councilman Inman asked about the type of weapons and leather the officers should have. Mr. Overman replied he likes uniformity and they should all be the same. Councilman Inman noted that the Association contract requires this and asked the type of leather he'd choose. Mr. Overman said he'd remain with the leather and likes a 357, 4" and it would be uniform if the City is furnishing them. Councilman Inman asked if he prefers a revolver or automatic and Mr. Overman said he prefers a revolver. Councilman Prater asked if he'd prefer blue steel or nickel plate and Mr. Overman said he'd take cost into consideration. Councilman Prater asked when high speed pursuit would be warranted and Mr. Overman replied when they can't apprehend the person later and if it's a danger to the community. He added that the degree of crime is the key and the amount of danger in the pursuit. Councilman Asting asked if inspections of personnel are necessary and Mr. Overman replied yes, and he'd show up on lineups unannounced and look at the gear and vehicles. Councilman Asting asked if he'd inspect on patrol and Mr. Overman replied yes, but he wouldn't refer to it as an inspection. He added that he's done it in the past. Mayor Baugh asked if he made a decision and then 4 or 5 officers say they don't agree with it, how would he handle it. Mr. Overman said he felt he would have got their input before but if the complaints were legitimate and it didn't affect the functions of the department, he'd give in to them. Mayor Baugh thanked Mr. Overman for his time and he was excused from the meeting. Mayor Baugh recessed the meeting at 2:15PM awaiting the arrival of the next candidate. City Clerk Martinez introduced Lawrence Schumaker to Council members. Mayor Baugh called the recessed workshop back to order at 2:21PM, and reviewed the interview process with Mr. Schumaker. Councilman Prater asked why he's seeking this position and Mr. Schumaker said he spent 25 years in law enforcement in Massachusetts and moved to Florida a few years ago and after about a year of retirement he joined the State Corrections. He added that he likes Police work and would like to continue his career. Councilman Rotundo asked what improvements he'd make in the Police Department and Mr. Schumaker said change is frightening to everybody and he doesn't know what changes he'd make at this time but the primary function of the Chief is to organize the Police Department to meet the objectives of the Department. Councilman Inman asked what in-house training he'd have for training the officers. Mr. Schumaker said he retired as Major and went to various seminars throughout the country and developed a well-rounded knowledge of what Police work entails and the Chief will have to get involved in day to day operations but he would prefer the subordinates do it. He added that he'd talk to each officer and see what weaknesses he had and see what's needed. He noted that he'd have classes in the evenings to get the department the way it should be running. He said he feels comfortable in his ability to communicate and address problems as they come up. -5- Council Special Meeting & Workshop Minutes July 29, 1985 o Q Lawrence Schumaker (Continued) - Councilman Asting asked if money was left in the Police Department budget at the end of the fiscal year, would he use it for something the department needs. Mr. Schumaker replied he wouldn't do it without discussing it with the City Clerk or head administrator in charge of the budget. He added that he wouldn't indiscriminately purchase items. Mayor Baugh asked his definition of vicarious liability and Mr. Schumaker replied it's the type of liability where they're held accountable for the actions of their officers. Councilman Prater asked how he'd handle citizens' complaints. Mr. Schumaker said it would be a straightforward, open door policy and if a citizen is paying taxes in the community they should have the opportunity to file a complaint. He added that he'd listen to them and get details. Councilman Prater asked if he'd require a signed complaint and Mr. Schumaker replied that he would if it's a complaint against an officer. He added that it would be investigated with the facts in the document and it allows the officer to defend his case. Councilman Rotundo asked about abuse of sick leave and Mr. Schumaker agreed that happens and he'd review the situation for a pattern and then talk to the officers and then take other actions if the problem isn't solved. He noted that abuse usually occurs in departments where morale is low. Councilman Inman asked if he understands the platoon system and Mr. Schumaker replied yes. Councilman Inman asked if he prefers 8 hours or the platoon system for the men and Mr. Schumaker said he doesn't know the problems here. Councilman Inman reviewed the 8-hour and l2-hour shifts. Mr. Schumaker noted that with the 12 hours they tend to burn out the last couple of hours and it would depend on what the officers want and efficiency of the department and amount of coverage. He added that it would also depend on what the people want and what they expect. Councilman Asting asked if the Police Department should be a separate entity from other departments and through the administrative chain. Mr. Schumaker said it should be in a particular chain in the municipality but everyday operations should be the responsibility of the Chief, who would be responsible to Councilor the Mayor or the City Clerk. Councilman Asting asked if he'd have problems taking instructions from the City Clerk/Administrator who is an executive to the Council. Mr. Schumaker said he'd welcome it and would like to discuss operations of the department, perhaps on a weekly basis, and he feels dialogue is good. Mayor Baugh asked if he made a departmental decision and other employees didn't agree with the decision and gave him a reason why, would he listen to them. Mr. Schumaker said he'd listen to them and review his decision but if he decides that it's right, he'd stand by it, or would change it if he thinks it's wrong. Councilman Prater asked if he'd agree to six months probation if selected and Mr. Schumaker said yes. Mr. Schumaker said he talked with his superiars and they told him he could come back to them but he feels he can do any job he's given. Councilman Rotundo noted that they advertised for $22,500. and asked if this would be satisfactory. Mr. Schumaker said yes and he'd applied with the knowledge of that salary and it's above average for this size department. He added that he has a pension from Massachusetts and he feels he'll make a qualified man for $22,500. and will do a good job. Councilman Inman asked how often he'd require the officers to go on the firing range and Mr. Schumaker replied a minimum of every year because of the liability, and he'd recommend every six months if possible if there are funds for the ammunition. Councilman Inman asked the type of course he'd prefer and Mr. Schumaker replied PTC. Councilman Inman asked if it would include shotgun training and Mr. Schumaker said shotguns are overrated in Police work but if the town carries shotguns in the cars, it's absolutely necessary, and if not, he'd question the validity. -6- Council Special Meeting & Workshop Minutes July 29, 1985 o o Lawrence Schumaker (Continued) - Councilman Asting noted that there's a speeding problem in certain areas and asked how he'd bring it under control. Mr. Schumaker replied with visibility of Police officers. Councilman Asting asked if he'd have a plan and Mr. Schumaker said he'd have to look at the entire situation and get the community involved for traffic safety. He said he'd check to see if outside residents are causing most of the problems and would increase patrols in areas during the hours needed and radar or engineering might be a solution. Mayor Baugh asked about off-duty activities of officers and drinking and driving. Mr. Schumaker said there's very little control over it once they leave the command, but an officer has to have a degree of stability in his private life as well as professional life. He added that he'd talk to the officer and tell him it will not be tolerated and if there's a union, he'll talk with them. He noted that a department is built by the officers in it and they shouldn't drink in this town but elsewhere if they want a cocktail. He added that if he can't explain it to the officers or they don't listen, he'd get rid of them. Councilman Prater asked if he has any health problems and Mr. Schumaker replied no. Councilman Asting asked how many hours the Chief would have to work and Mr. Schumaker replied probably about 50 as a minimum. Councilman Asting asked if he'd expect pay for that and Mr. Schumaker replied no. Councilman Asting asked if he'd commute from Deland and Mr. Schumaker said it's only 34 miles from his home and he'd like to commute durip-g the probation period and until the Betts situation is resolved as he wouldn't want to buy a home here and then find out he's not Chief. He added that if the effectiveness of the department isn't as it should be, then he'd change and move, but he feels he can do the job from where he lives, and the drive back and forth gives him thinking time. Councilman Asting asked the area in Massachusetts he comes from and Mr. Schumaker said it's the Melrose and Chelsea area. Councilman Inman asked how he'd handle a patrol officer caught sleeping in the early morning hours and Mr. Schumaker said he doesn't know of any officer not falling asleep at some time but he'd review his files on the officer and check how many hours he'd been on duty before that but would let the officer knowit can't be tolerated. Councilman Inman asked about drinking coffee in the cars and Mr. Schumaker said he'd prefer they go on signals to go out of service because of trash and cups in the cars and spills during chase. Councilman Inman asked if they could come in if a place isn't open and Mr. Schumaker said no, he'd rather know where they are. Mr. Schumaker added that drinking coffee presents a poor image and misconception of what's in the cup. He noted that he also doesn't like smoking on duty. Mayor Baugh asked if he'd wear a uniform and Mr. Schumaker said yes if the City provides one because he's worn one all his life and is proud of it. Mayor Baugh asked if he'd expect the City to provide a car back and forth to Deland and Mr. Schumaker said no. Mayor Baugh asked if he'd come in the middle of the night and Mr. Schumaker said he'd be here. Mayor Baugh thanked him for coming for the interview. Mayor Baugh recessed the workshop at 2:57PM awaiting the next candidates arrival. James Bivens was then introduced to Council members. Mayor Baugh called the recessed meeting back to order at 3:03PM. Mayor Baugh reviewed the interview procedure with Mr. Bivens. Councilman Prater asked his reason to seek the position. Mr. Bivens said he moved to Edgewater to retire and liked the area and when he found out the position was vacant he felt his qualifications, background, and interest in the quality of government in the City he lives in would make him a good candidate. -7- Council Special Meeting & Workshop Minutes July 29, 1985 -. r o o James Bivens (Continued) - Councilman Rotundo asked what improvements he'd make in the department and Mr. Bivens said he'd have to know the situation and problems and then study and make a determination for a course of action. Councilman Inman asked which work shift he'd prefer, 8 or 12 hours. Mr. Bivens replied that it would depend on the situation in the community, such as work load demand, morale of the people, etc. Councilman Inman asked for clarification of morale, whether it was morale of the employees or the citizens and Mr. Bivens replied it's both. Councilman Asting asked if he'd buy something the department needs if he had surplus funds in his budget at the end of the fiscal year and Mr. Bivens replied that it would depend on the system in the City and if it was his money in the budget then it would depend on the policy and procedure of the City government. Councilman Asting asked about leaving it unexpended and Mr. Bivens said he wouldn't spend it on something unnecessary but if it was needed then he would. Councilman Asting asked how long he's been in Edgewater and Mr. Bivens replied since January, but he'd visited the area before. Mayor Baugh asked his definition of vicarious liability and Mr. Bivens said it's the liability of the City for the actions of any person of the City, particularly the Police Department as it's the most likely place to be sued. He added that he went to the Chiefs' seminars regarding this and is familiar with situations that could be a problem. Councilman Prater asked about handling citizens' complaints and Mr. Bivens said each citizen's complaint should be investigated. Councilman Rotundo asked the size of Bluefield and Mr. Bivens replied about 16,000 and they had 28 sworn officers and several civilians. Councilman Inman asked about in-house training for officers and Mr. Bivens said there'd be inservice training at roll call and as much outside training as is avilable but he's not familiar with what's in the area. He added that training is one of the most critical areas and is applicable to vicarious liability. Councilman Inman asked how often they should go to the firing range and Mr. Bivens replied a minimum of twice a year. Councilman Inman asked the course and Mr. Bivens said the Close Combat course that incorporates the types of situations they get into, night fire, firing under stress, etc. Councilman Inman asked if he would include shotgun training and Mr. Bivens replied yes. Councilman Asting reviewed the organizational structure of the City and asked Mr. Bivens if he felt the Police Department should be a separate entity and report to Council. Mr. Bivens replied that it's a part of the City government and should be a part of the entity. Councilman Asting asked if he had any problems with taking instructions from the City Clerk/Adminis- trator and Mr. Bivens replied no. Mayor Baugh asked about off duty activities, such as drinking, etc. Mr. Bivens said the Police officer has the right to a private life but has an obligation to conduct his life in an exemplary manner, but it there was conduct unbecoming to an officer he'd review it. Mayor Baugh asked if an officer can take a drink in this town and Mr. Bivens said he didn't see a problem, and in D.C. they couldn't take a drink in their own precinct. Mayor Baugh asked if he made a decision and some of the employees felt the decision wasn't right, would he listen to them or stay with his decision. Mr. Bivens said he believes in participatory management and would have dis- cussed it prior to the decision and wouldn't have made it if it caused strain or discomfort without getting their approval and support of it. Councilman Prater asked if he'd work six months probation if selected and Mr. Bivens replied yes. Councilman Rotundo asked if he'd agree to the $22,500. salary and Mr. Bivens said yes, no problem. -8- Council Special Meeting & Workshop Minutes July 29, 1985 . o u James Bivens (Continued) - Councilman Inman asked about using charts to pinpoint accidents on a map, and breakins, etc. Mr. Bivens said it's an excellent tool and he imple- mented it in Bluefield for crime analysis. Councilman Inman asked what type of leather and weapons he'd prefer for the officers as the Association contract requires these be furnished. Mr. Bivens said he'd want it to be uniform and well maintained but doesn't like cross draw holsters and the standard police service 38 is usually satisfactory. Councilman Inman asked if he'd prefer a revolver over an automatic and Mr. Bivens replied yes, in most circumstances. Councilman Asting asked what inspections he'd conduct and Mr. Bivens said a roll call inspection daily, and weapons. Mayor Baugh asked if he'd conduct the inspection, or if the Sergeant would. Mr. Bivens said whoever is there and it could be very informal. Councilman Asting asked if he'd check the patrols and Mr. Bivens replied yes, that's part of the inspection function and as Chief he can't work 9 to 5 five days a week and do the job right and he'd put out more than they're used to. Councilman Asting asked what he would consider the normal work day and Mr. Bivens said he'd be available during the work day and during regular work hours and at odd hours otherwise. Councilman Asting asked if he'd expect to be paid after 40 hours and Mr. Bivens replied no. Councilman Prater asked if he has any health problems and Mr. Bivens said no. Councilman Rotundo asked if he's familiar with purchase orders and Mr. Bivens said yes and the system is similar to the one in Bluefield. Mayor Baugh asked if he's certified in Florida and Mr. Bivens replied he is not but he's certain he wouldn't have any difficulty. Mayor Baugh asked what he'd do if he had to go 360 hours and Mr. Bivens said he'd do it and it wouldn't bother him a bit. Councilman Inman asked how he'd handle an officer asleep in a car in the early morning hours. Mr. Bivens said it would depend on the type of officer he is and he'd take some type of disciplinary action. Councilman Inman asked if he'd allow officers to drink coffee in the cars and Mr. Bivens said yes. Councilman Inman asked if the men could come into the station for a coffee break and Mr. Bivens said he didn't mind if it's not interfering with getting their work done. Councilman Asting asked how he'd put a stop to the speeding in Florida Shores in the morning and evenings. Mr. Bivens said he believes in selective enforcement based on needs, either by statistics or complaints. Councilman Asting noted that they tried checking it in the past but it only lasted for a short time. Mr. Bivens said it's lack of supervision and they have to follow the traffic enforcement. Mayor Baugh called a short recess at 3:23PM. He called the meeting back in session at 3:29PM. Councilman Asting suggested they consider all the applicants overnight and meet the next day to make a recommendation. Mayor Baugh agreed they could recess until the next day. There was a discussion of the time for the meeting the next day and it was agreed to meet at 3PM. Mayor Baugh suggested a motion to adjourn the Workshop and go into the Special Meeting. Councilman Prater so moved. Councilman Asting seconded the motion. Motion CARRIED 5-0. Mayor Baugh asked for a motion to recess the Special Meeting until the next day at 3PM. Councilman Asting so moved. Councilman Prater seconded the motion. Motion CARRIED 5-0. Meeting was recessed at 3:34PM. -9- Council Special Meeting & Workshop Minutes July 29, 1985 o Q JULY 30, 1985 MINUTES Mayor Baugh called the recessed meeting to order at 3:00PM in the Community Center. ROLL CALL Mayor Earl Baugh Councilman Louis Rotundo Councilman Russell Prater Councilman Neil Asting Present Present Present Present Councilman James Inman City Attorney Jose'Alvarez City Clerk Connie Martinez Lieutenant William Britain Present Excused Present Excused Mayor Baugh stated the purpose of this meeting is to consider the people who were interviewed the day before for Police Chief. Councilman Rotundo stated that he was impressed with the interviews of all the candidates and felt they all expressed themselves well and he thought the money spent to have them evaluated was worth it. Councilman Asting stated that anyone of them could fulfill the position but his choice is Mr. Schumaker for Chief. Councilman Inman said he graded the candidates by their answers and reactions and the highest score was for Mr. Schumaker and he seemed very knowledgeable about what has to be done and didn't quibble about the salary offered. He added that he felt they'd have a trouble area with one of the candidates regarding salary but he's a good man. He said he didn't feel the City can afford him. Councilman Asting agreed with Councilman Inman. Councilman Prater pointed out that the salary for the man was spelled out in the fourth paragraph of his letter and he stated that Mr. Schumaker was his #1 choice. Councilman Rotundo stated that Mr. Schumaker was his choice also. Mayor Baugh said he was impressed with all of them but Mr. Schumaker with his experience and knowledge who has been to departments allover the U.S. for training is who he feels would be the best person for Chief. Councilman Asting suggested they name Mr. Bivens as alternate in case Mr. Schumaker was unable to take the job. Mayor Baugh said he didn't think they need an alternate. Councilman Asting moved that Mr. Schumaker be offered the position of Chief of Police of Edgewater with a six month probationary period, subject to a background review, and offering a starting salary of $21,000. during the probationary period. Councilman Prater seconded the motion. Mayor Baugh asked if he'd be increased after probation and Councilman Asting agreed if he successfully completes probation he'd be raised to $22,500. Councilman Inman asked what the advertisement stated and City Clerk Martinez said it was a salary range of $20,000. to $22,500. Motion CARRIED 5-0. Mayor Baugh said they need to appoint someone for the background check because the City shouldn't do it, and it should be an outside agencey. Councilman Asting suggested the City Clerk/Administrator handle it. City Clerk Martinez said she knew two firms that were suggested by the City Attorney. Mayor Baugh suggested they contact FDLE to see who they'd recommend. Councilman Asting suggested it be done as soon as possible. City Clerk Martinez pointed out that they need to get some signed releases. Councilman Prater suggested letters be sent to the other can- didates. Mayor Baugh suggested a motion to adjourn. Councilman Asting so moved. Councilman Prater seconded the motion. Meeting was adjourned at 3:09 P.M. Minutes submitted by: ATTEST: ~:-~~ CITY CLERK ~ Approved this~day of ~~198~. YOR ~ COUNCILMAN -~ ONE ~~ COUNCILMAN - ZONE TWO 7l-u vxC... -t:-:---7- COUNCILMAN C/ZONE THREE ~~ -z:r/ ~-? ~___ ~UNCILMAN - ZONE FOUR _lO_Council Special Meeting & Workshop of July 29, 1985 and July 30, 1985(Recessed) Minutes ~ Lura Sue ~oser ~y~o , .-I!"/~ V-