05-21-2007 - Regular
CITY COUNCIL OF EDGEWATER
REGULAR MEETING
MAY 21, 2007
7:00 P.M.
COMMUNITY CENTER
MINUTES
CALL TO ORDER
1.
Mayor Thomas called the Regular Meeting to order at 7:00
p.m. in the Community Center.
ROLL CALL
Mayor Michael Thomas Present
Councilwoman Debra Rogers Present
Councilman Dennis Vincenzi Present
Councilwoman Harriet Rhodes Present
Councilwoman Judith Lichter Present
City Manager Jon Williams Present
City Clerk Susan Wadsworth Excused
Deputy City Clerk Lisa Bloomer Present
City Attorney Michael Ciocchetti Present
INVOCATION, PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE
There was a silent invocation and pledge of allegiance to
the Flag.
2. APPROVAL OF MINUTES
There were no minutes to be approved at this time.
3. PRESENTATIONS/PROCLAMATIONS/PLAQUES/CERTIFICATES/DON
ATIONS
There were no Presentations at this time.
4. CITIZEN COMMENTS
The following citizens spoke:
Dominic Capria
, 606 Topside Circle, commented on City
Charter Section 3.11(b) Procedures on Page 8 which gives
the City Council to make rules governing the City Council.
At the April meeting they had a little bit of a dispute
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where the Mayor tried to include the response of questions
asked and that response for the three minutes from whoever
was making a response. He disagreed with this. He would
like the City Council to revisit the Charter and give their
opinion.
Mr. Capria then commented on a member of the Charter Review
Committee being invited to speak on the District 4 being
able to run for City Council again. He spoke to three of
the Councilmembers who all told him they were not advised
that speaker was invited to attend. The speaker spoke for
more than three minutes, which he had no problem with. He
also spoke to the speaker who told him he was not invited.
That he requested to attend. There is a big difference
there. His problem is they accuse people of lying and that
bothers him. He asked who really is lying?
Dave Ross
, 2803 Needle Palm Drive, stated he was quoted
recently in the News Journal having made a statement at the
P & Z meeting. He clarified what he meant to say. He
meant to say that the City Codes as they pertain to
professional office rezonings on SR 442 are inadequate and
is going to continue to cause the entire corridor to be
zoned as the Planning & Zoning Board sees fit over the
years because there will be numerous variance requests
because the Codes do not accommodate professional office
businesses on those residential lots. The City needs to
look at that and correct it. He feels it is totally
inappropriate for what basically should be zoning
ordinances to be written at variance hearings by the
Planning & Zoning Board. There are a number of issues that
can be addressed such as parking, ingress/egress, distance
of driveways from SR 442, setbacks and those types of
things that every house down there that goes professional
office is going to have to request variances around the
Code as it is written. The City needs to address it and
correct it so they don’t continue to run variances through
the Planning & Zoning Board. Councilwoman Rhodes agreed.
Terry Packer
, 1914 Sabal Palm Drive, informed Mayor Thomas
her questions were for him and informed him she was going
to ask them all at one time and he could answer them after.
Ms. Packer stated her understanding is at the last Council
meeting there were some discrepancies and there has been
continued discrepancies as far as Miami Tract Hunt Club.
She looked at some papers that were given to her and have
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discovered there are some discrepancies that she sees with
not only the numbers. She asked Mayor Thomas what his
lease agreement is with Miami Corp. She then asked where
exactly his main base or main pavilion is in conjunction
with the 6,000 acres that were just purchased and why after
all these years do they now need water?
Ms. Packer stated final question, non-profit organization.
Why on his information to the City of Edgewater did he put
Miami Tract Hunt Club down as second income?
Mayor Thomas asked her what the first question was. Ms.
Packer informed him how much his lease agreement is with
Miami Corp. Mayor Thomas informed her it is a closed
agreement. Ms. Packer stated what it says in the paper is
they pay $1,400 a year per hunter. Mayor Thomas informed
her it has varied. It started out at $1,100 and has gone
up $50 per year per hunter.
Ms. Packer stated he says he owns and paid for his personal
vehicles. She asked Mayor Thomas if he was subsidized at
all by Miami Tract. She asked why he would claim it as a
second income? Mayor Thomas stated they pay him a salary.
Ms. Packer asked if that is within the rules of a non-
profit organization? Mayor Thomas informed her it was.
Ms. Packer informed him she would check that.
Ms. Packer then asked why after so many years they need
water rights. Mayor Thomas stated they started the
organization in 2001. This was about the time that the
City of Titusville came up about 8 miles on the Miami
Corporation and drilled a well 100 feet from the Volusia
County line, which is in the aquifer that we are using.
They said they had the right to go on someone else’s
property to do that. Miami Corp. thinks they have the
mineral rights. They wanted to incorporate their own water
rights, which they did. They got approved for their own
water rights. 261 hunters use the water rights. He asked
who they want to use the water in our aquifer. Do you want
the City of Titusville using the water in our aquifer or do
you want 261 hunters. He feels it is beneficial for the
City for 261 hunters. He got a bill last month for three
months and they used 10 gallons. They paid $.01. How many
gallons of water do you think the City of Titusville is
going to use?
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Ms. Packer stated she didn’t say it wasn’t beneficial to
the City of Edgewater but she questioned if it is a
conflict that Mayor Thomas is dealing with them as the
Miami Tract Hunt Club verses the City of Edgewater. Mayor
Thomas didn’t think so. Ms. Packer felt it was something
the Council should look into.
City Attorney Ciocchetti stated he would need more
information rather than if it is a straightforward
conflict. At the outset it doesn’t seem to be. He didn’t
see a reason for it. But he would need more specific
factual assertions as to why it would be a conflict.
Ms. Packer stated it is her understanding that Miami Tract
has only a lease agreement with Miami Corporation. Mayor
Thomas stated all the Miami Tract Hunt Club does is lease
the hunting rights on that property. She asked Mayor
Thomas if that was his standing with Miami Corporation.
Mayor Thomas informed her that was right.
Ms. Packer stated but now Mayor Thomas is telling her he is
getting water for the City of Edgewater. That’s as the
Mayor.
Mayor Thomas asked Ms. Packer if she felt it was beneficial
for 261 people to be using that water system or for the
City of Titusville to be using that water. Ms. Packer
stated that isn’t stopping Miami Corporation from selling
their water, their water rights. How is that benefiting
the City? Mayor Thomas stated he didn’t have anything to
do with that. That was approved by the State. Ms. Packer
asked Mayor Thomas if he was putting wells on the property.
Mayor Thomas informed her he wasn’t. There are three
original wells that the Miami Tract is using for the water
system.
City Attorney Ciocchetti stated it is his understanding
that this parcel of land is not in the City of Edgewater.
He was having a hard time understanding where the conflict
would arise. Ms. Packer stated she didn’t make it a
conflict in the beginning. He is saying that he did this
or this is much better for the City and she is trying to
figure out why it would be better for the City of
Edgewater. Miami Corporation sold 6,000 acre and that was
in the paper. She is assuming that is fact. Councilwoman
Rhodes stated they are all getting water from the same
aquifer. Ms. Packer understood that. Councilwoman Rhodes
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stated they aren’t in the City; they are in the County so
they are getting water from the aquifer as opposed to
Titusville getting water from the aquifer.
Councilwoman Lichter felt it might not be clear to the
audience who might not have been here the previous week.
This is a personal matter between Mayor Thomas and Ms.
Packer.
Ms. Packer stated it is absolutely not a personal matter.
She wasn’t here last time. She didn’t have anything to do
with the discussion.
Councilwoman Lichter stated it doesn’t pertain to the City
Council per say. She questioned not being able to abstain
from a vote. City Attorney Ciocchetti informed her there
are statutory provisions where you can abstain.
Councilwoman Lichter commented on other incidents where
people declared a conflict, explained it and then voted.
She asked if that is so or if this is something they better
look into. City Attorney Ciocchetti stated it is always
hard to render a general legal opinion without specific
facts. Without specific facts, he avoids issuing a general
rule because he doesn’t want it to be misconstrued or
misapplied. If there is an assertion of conflict of
interest he needs specific factual allegations so he can
say whether or not there is a conflict. With regard to
abstaining from voting, it is within the Florida Statutes.
Generally it is with certain financial parameters. There
are circumstances where you can disclose your financial
interests and vote or there are provisions where you have
to abstain from voting. They will deal with those on a
case-by-case basis.
Ms. Packer stated the only conflict she has is the
discrepancy between the financial statement to the City of
Edgewater where Mayor Thomas is claiming Miami Tract is his
second income and the statement he gave to the Florida
Department of Agriculture stating he made no money from
Miami Tract. She asked Mayor Thomas which one was true.
She asked Mayor Thomas if he wanted her to read his
statement to him. Mayor Thomas informed her yes.
Mayor Thomas informed Ms. Packer she had run out of time.
Ms. Packer stated she is asking the Council now with her
time limit. She informed them she would give them the
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papers and she would appreciate it if the Council could
check into it. She didn’t believe the Mayor had the right
to sit up there and call someone a liar when he isn’t
completely honest.
Carol Ann Stoughton
, 2740 Evergreen Drive, stated what the
public has to understand is it is the Miami Corporation
that will affect us in the future when they want to build
50,000 houses out there. Do you think we are going to get
that water over here? We are not. A developer doesn’t
care about us over here. That is really what she thinks
Mrs. Packer is trying to point out. There are things
behind the scenes that aren’t told but with the aid of a
computer you can find out an awful lot. She hears from the
men that work for the town that pick up the garbage that
their jobs are in jeopardy. They don’t even make $20,000
yet we have men at the top making $72,000 to $95,000 to
$105,000 plus perks. She thinks they ought to have a group
getting all the poor little people that keep our town clean
because it looks like their jobs are now in jeopardy
because of poor management of funds with the last City
Manager over the years. We have a member on Council that
is in foreclosure and she can’t meet her bills. She thinks
she just cleared it up however there are a lot of people in
town that don’t make the money yet the big guy on the top,
are they going to start taking jobs away from people that
don’t live in town or are they going to start with the
little guy at the bottom of the pile who keeps the town
clean.
Ms. Stoughton stated it took her years to find out the
City’s debt, which is now down from $48 million to $43
million and now we are going to sell land in ParkTowne
fiasco for less than the going price. We are going to sell
it for a million less than what we can get for it. That
doesn’t take much brains to do that. It is a damn shame
they got into that can of worms along with nobody ever told
them how much they spent on water meters. She has heard it
is up to $15 million. She thinks that is a sin. There has
been so much spending. We bought 23 new vehicles and we
have 201 employees in this town and at least 27 of them are
making over $50,000. She isn’t knocking a lot of people
like Mrs. Wadsworth and many other people. They work long
and hard in this town. She feels they need to start
downsizing from the top and give the little guy the raise
that you guys shouldn’t be getting.
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Pat Card
, 3019 Willow Oak Drive, informed the Mayor that
people accuse him of things that are absolutely beyond
comprehension to him. He knows he did not support him but
he had a great deal of respect for the fact that he was
honest and straightforward about his work with the Miami
Tract Hunt Club. He remembered seeing Mayor Thomas when he
was getting ready to take juice to the boys on Saturday.
He isn’t a member of the club and doesn’t have a whole lot
of feeling for the Miami Corporation even given the fact
that it was originally an Ohio group. It owns land all
over this country. He commented on material he brought to
Councilwoman Rhodes five years ago that was important then.
He has a respect for Mayor Thomas and he thinks other
people in this community should understand that he made it
perfectly and crystal clear that he had a connection with
the Miami Corporation through the Hunt Club during his
campaign and election. He appreciated that openness.
Elaine Leaf
, 1503 Willow Oak Drive, stated she and her
husband moved to Florida Shores in 1996 because they find
it to be a very gentle, wonderful and safe town. What
worries them right now is the lack of what they feel is
concern and response for their first responders, the police
officers. These are the men and women who are here to
protect us. If you cut their salaries, their benefits,
their manpower and their incentives, then what they do is
they cut the residents’ safety. They are the ones who are
out there twenty-four hours a day. They are the ones who
are called out for the drug dealers, traffic fatalities,
domestic violence and the robberies. They are their line
of protection and they only want the best. They feel they
have the best right now. They are concerned they won’t get
the best and won’t keep the best if their benefits and
salaries are cut. They understand that it is dollars and
cents and business but they depend on the Police Department
and they are depending on the City and they hope they won’t
hurt them because in the final analysis then they hurt the
residents.
Marty Hurst
, 2502 Umbrella Tree Drive, Local President,
Fraternal Order of Police, stated they all know city and
county governments are trying to make cutbacks. The last
place they want to see that happen is with the law
enforcement officers. The fact that the City Manager has
opened 19 articles in this year’s contract for the Police
of Edgewater as opposed to the FOP only opening 2 articles
the majority of the articles will impact the individual
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officers financially as well as their families. Primary
articles under attack this year are health care, vacation
and sick time, pay increases and special assignment pay.
The fact that the City Manager has inquired about utilizing
Volusia County for public safety services and the impact it
would create to the citizens. The fact that the City
Manager continues to state it is the will of the Council as
he persistently pressures upper management to continue to
cut already strained resources. Is the will of the Council
that they deprive the citizens of services they have come
to expect? The fact that gutting the benefits of the
employees will ultimately result in the gutting of services
to the City. He reminded the Council that they get what
they pay for. The fact that Edgewater Police Department
has one of the lowest percentages of officers to population
compared to other municipalities in Volusia County. 1.55
officers per 1,000 persons. The average is 2 to 4 persons
per 1,000 persons throughout Volusia County. The fact that
Edgewater Police Department has maintained a high level of
safety to the citizens. The City has the third lowest
crime rate for cities of its size comparable populations in
the State of Florida. The Edgewater Police Department has
maintained this average for the past fifteen years. The
fact that Edgewater Police Department is actually smaller
in personnel than it was eight years ago. The fact that
Edgewater has been able to retain qualified and experienced
personnel. The fact that high level of public safety
services is a double edge sword. This level of services
causes a feeling of security but it can also cause a
feeling of complacency. This complacency has become
evident from statements of Councilmembers who have been
annoyed by the sounds of sirens and statements implying
that being an Edgewater officer is a lot safer and easier
than being a Port Orange officer. He reminded the Council
to keep in mind that they are here for liberty and justice
for all and they would like to see that happen for
Edgewater Police Officers.
John Cordeiro
, 1515 Pine Tree Drive, stated he worked for
Eastern Airlines for 32 years. They threw them out the
door, they liquidated the airline and he along with
thousands lost their jobs. He lost all his benefits and
2/3 of his retirement. They didn’t go to the City of Miami
and ask to help bail them out. He got another job as quick
as he wanted to go back to work and then he got another job
after that that had a better future in it. He knows the
policemen and firemen are all shook up about losing their
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jobs but there are other jobs out there that he believes
are better than this City. There is no shortage of jobs
for people with a job like theirs. He told the guys not to
worry and that there are plenty of other jobs out there.
Mike Hayes
, 3123 Woodland Drive, stated absolutely they can
go and get a job anywhere but without them the people that
are going to hurt are the citizens. They could go to
Daytona or Port Orange but they are here for the citizens
of Edgewater and they are here to help them.
Jeanne DelNigro
, 3130 Tamarind Drive, asked if ECARD is
registered with the City. Councilwoman Rhodes informed her
they are registered as a political action committee. Ms.
DelNigro asked if they had a list of who is President, Vice
President, or Chairman. Councilwoman Rhodes informed her
Dot Carlson was the Chairman but that she would have to ask
them. She asked if they had that information. City
Manager Williams stated he was certain they had a list.
Ms. DelNigro asked if it would be possible to get a copy.
City Manager Williams informed her he would make the
request.
Ms. DelNigro feels ECARD isn’t working for the City of
Edgewater and that is her opinion. She feels Mayor Thomas
is doing a hell of a job. As far as the Fire Department
and the Police Department, they will not get better people
to work in the City. All of the City employees should be
holding on to their jobs. They don’t want to see one
person lose their job. Everyone should have their jobs and
keep them.
Gigi Bennington
, 121 Virginia Street, stated she has lived
in this City since 1976 and she has never had to us Rescue
or Police for anything. She had occasion to use it on
Easter Sunday and before her husband could even finish
making the 911 call, the Fire and Police were at her house
and she appreciates that.
5. CITY COUNCIL REPORTS
Councilwoman Rhodes stated she had a man call her that made
the suggestion to put the vacation watch forms on the
website so they could be filled out and mailed in instead
of having to make a trip to the Police Station.
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Councilwoman Rhodes stated she has had just about enough,
especially of Ms. Stoughton. She is the one that was in
foreclosure. It was a mistake by her mortgage company. If
anybody thinks it is any of their business she would be
glad to provide them with a copy of the letter stating
such. If you want to make a comment about how she does her
job, feel free. Everybody is entitled to their opinion.
Her personal life is her personal life. If it does not
affect this job, it is nobody else’s business. She
informed Ms. Stoughton she needed to stay out of it.
Councilwoman Rhodes stated as far as the debt goes, she
could remember five or six times, at least, when Mr. Hooper
was City Manager, they told Ms. Stoughton. Ms. Stoughton
never believed the debt but they told her the debt. She
told Ms. Stoughton not to stand up there and say she was
never told. She was told. She thinks that the people on
Council serve at the will of the people of this city. They
were elected by the people of this City and are answerable
to the people of this City. But there are to be a minimal
amount of respect for people that sit up there and do this
job for no money and take abuse week after week. She has
been doing it for eight years and in two years she will
never have to do it again. She doesn’t mind if they have a
problem with what is being done here. She will even do
everything she can to rectify the problem if she thinks it
needs to be rectified. But don’t call names, be abusive.
There is no need for that. Nobody up there wants to do
that to the people. They want to work with them and help
them any way they can. That is why they are doing this
job. They are trying to do the best job they can. She
would appreciate it if they were shown a little bit of
respect from some people. Most people are fine but some
are not. They have done it for years now and she is over
it. She has kept her mouth shut and she has taken it as
long as she can take it. You can stand up and make all the
rumor and innuendo you want but that doesn’t make it true.
Councilwoman Lichter stated they know her respect for the
Firemen and Policemen. She will be on the Council for ten
years in November. Her husband was a judge, first a
prosecutor. She is very aware of what they do in this
community. They have a problem that they are going to need
the citizens’ help to help them solve. We are being
corralled by the State who promised as campaign pledges
that they were going to fix quick the tax inequities and
none of them disagree there are tax inequities but there is
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no quick fix. There is a committee formed up there. They
have spoken to them on the phone and got together with them
and talked to them and tried to explain the problem isn’t a
quick fix. They have to deal with cutting their budgets
20%. In Ormond and Port Orange that may not mean that much
but in a community like ours it does hurt. They need
cooperation, creative ideas and thoughts of how they can
handle this. Of course they need law enforcement and the
best Fire Department but they have to try and work together
and see what is going to be cut if that comes about. They
don’t know for sure if it is. When she asked one of the
legislators if they could do it a little slower and fix the
whole thing his answer is whether it is right or wrong they
are going to get it done fast. She will always be
supportive of the Police and Fire Departments. She spoke
of when her significant other was dieing, she couldn’t
blink an eye and they were there. We have got the best.
Councilwoman Lichter stated the American Legion Post 285
will be celebrating Memorial Day on Monday and the ceremony
and celebration will be at the Edgewater/New Smyrna
Cemetery at 11:00 a.m.. She feels it is important if
people can make it that they come and bring grandchildren.
She taught kindergarten for twenty-eight years and the kids
now are not getting a civic lesson or history lesson. She
feels if the citizens can give them a living one, they
should do that that day.
Councilwoman Rogers stated everyone is concerned and
everyone is reading what is being reported in the Orlando
Sentinel and the News Journal about taxes. The plans are
consistently changing. They don’t know yet what is going
to happen. The City is in the process of trying to look in
areas where they can cut 30% from every department. They
do know about the past problems with mismanagement, with
mistakes that were made and with bad decisions. They can’t
keep going back. They have to go forward. She doesn’t
want to see the Police Department and Fire Department
diminish and she doesn’t want to see people lose their
jobs, especially in an economy where gas is exceeding $3
per gallon and there is talk of it going to $4 and perhaps
higher and everything that is going on with the State and
the City between taxes and insurance, it is enough to make
them all want to go out and live on the intracoastal so
they don’t have to pay taxes and insurance. In reality,
they all have to sit back and see what is going to happen.
They do need to start preparing for it. When they have a
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reduction of inflows they are forced to reduce what we pay
out. If we don’t reduce or look for ways to reduce, they
are going to have to reduce then they are going to have to
increase the millage and nobody is going to be happy with
that. The City Manager has been meeting with them a few
times privately. He has taken steps that were necessary
and she knows it hurt individuals but again these are
necessary steps. They are here to watch over and make
decisions based upon information that is given to them.
With the past issues and the past mistakes, they know there
were mistakes and they know there are problems. If that is
going to prevail, then that would mean they do nothing. She
believes they do have a good Council contrary to what some
people may think because some of them may not have a
consensus up there all the time that doesn’t mean they
don’t respect one another’s decision from time to time. It
takes good men to turn it around and it doesn’t happen over
night. They have to work as a whole. They have to work
together to fix this mess.
Councilwoman Rogers stated she received a ticket in the
City. Some of the Police Department thinks she is out of
to get them. She is not. If she wasn’t a City
Councilperson, she would have fought it. She hasn’t
received a ticket in anywhere from ten and fifteen years or
longer. She told the Police Officers she isn’t there to
try to fight or knock them for their jobs. She also isn’t
there to knock the Firemen for their jobs. As far as her
discussion is the past regarding pension, it had nothing to
do with the Fire or Police pension. It had do with the
issues with the General Employee pension. That doesn’t
mean she is against the City employees either. She is here
representing everyone as a whole. What is best for
everyone. Someone is going to be offended and hurt but she
isn’t directing this as any one person.
Councilwoman Rogers stated they would hear her talk again
during the shuffleboard court discussion.
Councilman Vincenzi stated he got a ticket three or four
years ago and it was the same police officer that gave her
a ticket. He guessed he was conscientious and doing his
job. He wished he would have known who his City Council
people were but other than that he did a great job.
Councilwoman Rhodes stated it shouldn’t make a difference.
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Councilwoman Rhodes asked what his name was. Councilwoman
Vincenzi stated it was Officer John Conley. He is very
enthusiastic about his job and does a good job.
Councilman Vincenzi stated one thing he thinks should never
happen anywhere any time is personal attacks on anybody.
Tonight they saw a personal attack against the Mayor
because he is involved with the Miami Tract Hunt Club, who
owns the big parcel of land out by I-95. He thinks that is
wrong. Some of these people that have made these comments
are friends of his but he thinks it is wrong. He thinks
personal comments and personal attacks needs to stay out of
the public spot light. Even if they are true. The ex-
Mayor Don Schmidt had a brush with the law when he was a
juvenile and people wanted to bring that up during the
election. He feels that is ridiculous. Personal attacks
like the one against the Mayor and mentioning possible
financial troubles, which probably didn’t even happen, of
another Councilperson is wrong. They need to stop and they
really should never even be said in public at all. It
doesn’t have anything to do with the way they do their job.
If they disagree with what they say or do, come up and say
so but leave the personal aspects out of it.
Councilman Vincenzi stated another person came up and
talked about job cuts and if you get laid off here go ahead
and find a job someplace else and that there are plenty of
jobs. That isn’t so easy to do. You have to think about
what is going on in the State of Florida. If every City
gets hit with a 10, 20% or 30% reduction in revenue, every
City is going to be possibly laying off people. They won’t
be able to get a job. His goal first and foremost is to
make sure nobody loses their job. Then they will work on
all the other things afterwards as far as cutting benefits,
pay and whatnot. They have to see how much money really
gets chopped out of the budget before they seriously try to
figure out what else needs to be done. In this day and age
in Florida especially it is not going to be easy to do and
there are going to be a lot of people that are going to be
devastated if what they are talking about as far as tax
cuts really happens.
Councilman Vincenzi stated everybody comes to the Council
meetings, especially around tax time. They are looking
everywhere for places to cut money and places to reduce
expenses. Everything from the little trash collector guy
to department heads. Some of the people that make the
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biggest salaries are the people that have been here the
longest and they are the ones that have different types of
benefit plans as opposed to the benefit plans that newer
employees have. Newer employees are a lot cheaper to keep
than department heads that have been here twenty or thirty
years. They can’t just get rid of people. That is why
they are going through this painful process of trying to
figure out where they can cut expenses and where employees
are willing to compromise and how they can help out the
City so nobody loses their job and everybody still is able
to live and maintain a good standards of living while not
cutting back services. There are a lot of things that need
to be talked about in the next couple of months as the
State Legislature goes through it’s special session to see
how they are going to try and reduce taxes and things. He
asked how many regular citizens contacted their State
Representatives. A couple but not nearly enough. State
Representatives are up there and they are going to be
negotiating and bargaining and doing whatever they have to
do in this upcoming special session because they want to
get reelected next time. They need to call them and tell
them how they feel and tell them if they don’t do a
reasonable job they won’t vote for them no matter what they
do. He drives to Orlando every day. Gas prices are $3.20
a gallon now. He joined a vanpool. He isn’t going to give
up his job because gas prices are high so he finds ways to
cut. These are things that people have to do. They also
have to contact the County, State and Federal
Representatives. Every piece of governments get a little
piece of money. He commented on an article in the
newspaper regarding gas taxes. He commented on the County
of Volusia having a 12 or 15-cent tax on every gallon of
gas. They don’t have this in Orlando where their gas is
around $2.97 a gallon. That is a big difference. Whenever
he drives his car out there, he gets gas out there. The
people need to complain everywhere to everyone who will
listen to them. That is the only way anything is going to
get done.
Mayor Thomas thanked the City Employees that were at the
meeting for coming to the meeting. He expressed his
appreciation for them participating. This affects them.
If they want to get up and say something at any time, you
feel free to and you will not be chastised as long as he is
sitting up there.
Page 14 of 43
Council Regular Meeting
May 21, 2007
Mayor Thomas commented on the meetings he has attended. He
met with Evelyn Lynn, Pat Patterson, and Dorothy Hukill
regarding the tax reform. It is assault on home rule.
Each City is a different entity and has been created for
different reasons. They all need different things in
different cities. In the paper today, it said the State
raised the taxes five hundred and something million dollars
to support the School Board and they are reducing the
property taxes and telling the cities to spend their money.
They are inviting them to come down and look at our budget.
He was up there today fighting for each job. He has
another emergency meeting tomorrow with the Mayors and they
are strategizing on how they can reduce this rippling
affect. They know they are going to lose services. One
thing that hit home with him today was the County Manager
Jim Dineen said he is going to have to cut 10% from the
jail. He said he was going to have to cut $4 million from
the jail. The bed capacity is 1,400 and is already up to
1,700. They are going to go to the judges and say they
need to change things. They can’t keep putting these
people in jail and then these people are going to be in our
neighborhoods. He heard one City say they are going to
have to cut DUI law enforcement because they can’t tie up
their police officers for the amount of time it takes to
process. He feels a domino effect is going to happen. He
agreed the tax system is broken but feels they need to do
it with equality, not penalize us and point the finger at
the cities and say they are the bad guys. It is a
political battle up there and they are blaming it on us.
They are cutting it just as fine as they can. He guaranteed
the City employees he is fighting for their jobs and
benefits as much as he can.
Mayor Thomas commented on how proud he is of the Miami
Tract Hunt Club. He stated the Miami Tract Hunt Club
leases the hunting rights out there and they purchase the
water. He is smart enough to know that 261 people are not
going to use the amount of water that would go to the City
of Titusville. They have a guide sitting in the fire tower
today. Each one of his members is required to sit in that
fire tower for six hours every day from May 1st through
th
August 30. They spotted a fire down there yesterday and
it has grown to 200 acres. Not only do they provide a home
for the game species out there, they also provide a home
for the non-game species. People don’t’ realize what they
do. He didn’t know where the attacks came from. If you
know Mike Thomas, when you get on him then he just fights
Page 15 of 43
Council Regular Meeting
May 21, 2007
back that much harder. If you are a spade, he is going to
call you a spade. If you are a liar, he is going to call
you a liar. If it is in a public meeting and if it is not
true, then let them do something about it.
Mayor Thomas called a ten-minute recess. The meeting
recessed at 8:00 p.m. and reconvened at 8:10 p.m.
6. CONSENT AGENDA
There were no items on the Consent Agenda to be discussed
at this time.
7. PUBLIC HEARINGS, ORDINANCES AND RESOLUTIONS
nd
A.2Reading, Ord. No. 2006-O-37, City of
Edgewater, on behalf of Frank and Donna Morris,
requesting an amendment to the Official Zoning
Map to include 10± acres of land located north of
Oak trail, west of 2967 Oak Trail as RT (Rural
Transitional) cont. from 3/5/07, Item 7G
rezoning
()
City Attorney Ciocchetti read Ord. 2006-O-37 into the
record.
Frank Morris
, applicant, was available to answer questions.
Due to there being no comments, Mayor Thomas opened and
closed the public hearing and entertained a motion.
Councilwoman Rhodes moved to approve Ord. 2006-O-37, City
of Edgewater, on behalf of Frank and Donna Morris,
requesting an amendment to the Official Zoning Map to
include 10± acres of land located north of Oak Trail, west
of 2967 Oak Trail as RT (Rural Transitional), second by
Councilwoman Lichter
.
The MOTION CARRIED 4-1. Mayor Thomas voted NO
.
B. Resolution No. 2007-R-05, which would include
property owned by Southeast Volusia Hospital
District as vested pursuant to the Annexation
Agreement, which allows heights in excess of 35
feet
Page 16 of 43
Council Regular Meeting
May 21, 2007
City Attorney Ciocchetti read Res. 2007-R-05 into the
record.
City Manager Williams made a staff presentation.
Miranda Fitzgerald
, Law Firm of Loundes, Drosdick, Kantor &
Reed, 215 N. Eola Drive, Orlando, representing Southeast
Volusia Hospital District, stated they entered into an
agreement with the City in December 2004 that committed the
Southeast Volusia Hospital District to annex the 71 acres
of property and in return for that it was really a mutual
benefit agreement because the City couldn’t annex
additional land to the south of this project without this
particular piece of property coming into the City. In
return for the agreement to annex and the City’s ultimate
annexation, they were very careful when they crafted the
annexation agreement to go point by point and include in
the annexation agreement virtually everything you would
typically have in your PUD agreement recognizing they still
had to come back and get the property zoned but they wanted
to make certain they had an understanding with the City
before they annexed about what their intentions were for
the development of that site and what the City’s intentions
were. They have that agreement. She thought it was
through an oversight that it got omitted from the original
resolution that they passed. They would appreciate the
Council rectifying that now and recognizing this project
too has vested rights. She would be happy to answer any
questions.
Mayor Thomas opened the public hearing.
Councilwoman Lichter congratulated Ms. Fitzgerald for being
so perceptive.
Councilman Vincenzi stated he wants this to go through and
he is going to vote for it. He wanted to make sure that
there is no chance that somebody will come back later and
bother them and try to dispute anything. ECARD has said
they have never been against hospitals building structures
higher than 35 feet for the good of the community and he
feels that is great. City Manager Williams informed him
there is always a potential that somebody might try to
challenge. Councilman Vincenzi asked if they had their
ducks in a row where they can fight it. City Attorney
Ciocchetti stated effectively the annexation agreement is a
PUD Agreement and is probably included with the others.
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Council Regular Meeting
May 21, 2007
Councilwoman Rhodes stated after reading the annexation
agreement she felt it was clear that they are vested.
Councilwoman Rogers stated even if they weren’t vested they
would have asked to have this put on the ballot so they
could get what they need. This just saves them from having
to go through that step.
Mayor Thomas closed the public hearing and entertained a
motion.
Councilwoman Lichter moved to approve Res. 2007-R-05, which
would include property owned by Southeast Volusia Hospital
District as vested pursuant to the Annexation Agreement,
which allows heights in excess of 35 feet, second by
Councilwoman Rogers
.
The MOTION CARRIED 5-0
.
8. BOARD APPOINTMENTS
A.Planning & Zoning – nomination by Mayor Thomas to
fill a vacant seat due to the expired term
(6/6/07) of Gigi Bennington, who seeks
reappointment
Mayor Thomas nominated David Leonard.
Councilwoman Rhodes moved to approve Mayor Thomas’
nomination of David Leonard, second by Councilman Vincenzi
.
The MOTION CARRIED 5-0
.
B.Economic Development Board
1) Nomination by Councilman Vincenzi to
fill a vacant seat due to the expired
term (6/6/07) of Doug McGinnis
Councilman Vincenzi mentioned trying to contact John Nelson
over the weekend but he didn’t get a return call. Mr.
Nelson was at the meeting.
Councilman Vincenzi pointed out that Mr. Nelson lived in
New Smyrna and asked him where he worked. Mr. Nelson
informed him he owns a software company at 201 S. Ridgewood
Page 18 of 43
Council Regular Meeting
May 21, 2007
Avenue and he owns property at the Massey Ranch Airpark.
His business has been in Edgewater since 1999.
Councilman Vincenzi moved to appoint John Nelson, second by
Councilwoman Rogers
.
The MOTION CARRIED 5-0
.
2) Nomination by Councilwoman Rhodes to
fill a remaining term due to the
resignation (4/25/07) of Jerry
Anderson
Councilwoman Rhodes moved to appoint Patricia Reid, second
by Councilman Vincenzi
.
The MOTION CARRIED 5-0.
3) Nomination by Councilwoman Lichter to
fill a vacant seat due to the expired
term (6/6/07) of Marcia Barnett, who
seeks reappointment
Councilwoman Lichter moved to reappoint Marcia Barnett,
second by Councilman Vincenzi
.
The MOTION CARRIED 5-0
.
C.Citizen Code Enforcement Board
1) Nomination by Councilwoman Rhodes to
fill a vacant seat due to the expired
term (6/21/07) of Gene Mirabella, who
seeks reappointment
Councilwoman Rhodes moved to reappoint Gene Mirabella,
second by Councilman Vincenzi
.
The MOTION CARRIED 5-0
.
2) Nomination by Councilwoman Lichter to
fill a vacant seat due to the expired
term (6/21/07) of Ed Corn, who seeks
reappointment
Councilwoman Lichter moved to appoint Ben Wagner, second by
Councilwoman Rhodes
.
Page 19 of 43
Council Regular Meeting
May 21, 2007
The MOTION CARRIED 5-0
.
3) Nomination by Mayor Thomas to fill a
vacant seat due to the expired term
(6/21/07) of Jean Kayat, who seeks
reappointment
Mayor Thomas nominated Alvin Wiefling.
Councilman Vincenzi moved to appoint Alvin Wiefling, second
by Councilwoman Rhodes
.
The MOTION CARRIED 5-0
.
D.Police Pension Board – nomination by Councilwoman
Rogers to fill a vacant seat due to the expired
term (6/20/07) of Ferd Heeb, who seeks
reappointment
Councilwoman Rogers moved to reappoint Ferd Heeb, second by
Councilwoman Rhodes
.
The MOTION CARRIED 5-0
.
9. OTHER BUSINESS
A.Sale of ParkTowne Property – staff recommending
approval of a Purchase and Sale Agreement and
Addendums (2) with MGM Real Estate Group, Inc.
for 82± acres of City owned property located in
ParkTowne Industrial Center for $4.5 million and
authorize the Mayor to execute all associated
contract and closing documents
City Manager Williams stated the applicant or agent has
requested a 30-day extension of the contract pending
completion of a wetlands study to determine the number of
upland verses lowland acres. They are going to pull this
from the agenda and allow him that 30-day extension.
City Manager Williams commented on communication from him
indicating the study would be done in about two weeks. He
also commented on the City’s counter offer to the original
contract which targets a number for us to achieve to get
out of debt on the remaining property we have out there and
fulfill obligations for infrastructure agreements
Page 20 of 43
Council Regular Meeting
May 21, 2007
associated with Base Leg Dive, the Rowan Way extension as
well as eliminating some other debt. We have floated the
offer of extending impact fee credits to them at some point
in the future but they have to wait for the impact of this
wetlands study.
B.Green Waste/Yard Trash Request for Proposal –
staff recommending approval to award the
Agreement (5-year term) to Cloer and Sons, Inc.
for a fee of $4.50 per cubic yard ($180,000) and
authorize the City Manager to execute the
documents
Deputy Director of Environmental Services Brenda DeWees
made a staff presentation.
Councilwoman Rogers stated they have had the same price for
the past three years and will for the next two years but
she is asking them to sign a contract with them for the
next five years. She asked their normal way of increase.
City Manager Williams informed her it specifies the
Consumer Price Index. Ms. DeWees informed her it is stated
in the agreement that Mr. Cloer has already signed.
Councilwoman Lichter stated she has never seen such a
thorough presentation by Cloer & Sons. They sound very
cooperative and good.
Councilwoman Rhodes stated it says in her paperwork that
the City of Edgewater had the lowest disposal cost in
Volusia County after the hurricanes.
Councilman Vincenzi stated the lowest bid was $4.40 and
they bid $4.50. He asked Mr. Cloer if he would be willing
to go to $4.40. Councilwoman Rhodes questioned if that was
legal. Mr. Cloer agreed to go to $4.40. Councilwoman
Rhodes thanked Mr. Cloer. Councilwoman Rhodes questioned
having to give the other guy the opportunity to underbid
that. She was concerned with legality.
Mayor Thomas commented on knowing Mr. Cloer for 35 years.
Mayor Thomas entertained a motion.
Councilwoman Rhodes moved to award the five year Agreement
to Cloer and Sons for Green Waste and Yard Trash removal at
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Council Regular Meeting
May 21, 2007
a price of $4.40 per cubic yard, second by Councilman
Vincenzi
.
The MOTION CARRIED 5-0
.
C.Shuffleboard Courts – per City Council request,
discussion regarding temporary
postponement/proceeding with capital project to
construct shuffleboard clubhouse and courts
City Manager Williams commented on the information provided
to Council at Councilwoman Rogers’ request regarding the
movement of this facility, the project worksheets,
insurance claims, etc. Additionally Councilman Vincenzi
requested some capital equipment replacement schedules of
the department. The request came in relatively late and he
has incorporated a schedule from the Police Department for
tonight’s discussion.
City Manager Williams commented on the Mid Year Budget
Review Cash analysis based off of mid-year budget
projections that they will be presenting to Council at a
future date. This is one of the main reasons he is going
to recommend postponing the construction of this facility
in light of this ending cash analysis, the pending property
tax issue they have hanging over their head today and the
fact that they have began discussing the possibility and
have eliminated some jobs and are asking for the employees
to come forward with ways to save money.
City Manager Williams stated after they net out the pluses
and minuses and IOU’s, they are projecting at the end of
this fiscal year they will have $527,000 in the bank.
There is some policy discussion they need to have later as
they present this regarding some of the IOU’s between the
funds. This scenario basically pays back some of the IOU’s
in one year. They can say they are going to pay it back
over a three-year period. He felt it was important to
postpone those discussions until a future date to come back
with some ideas. The second thing this does is eliminate
100% in one year the transfer from the Water & Sewer Fund
which is a significant step in the right direction in terms
of turning this whole process around. They internally are
evaluating methodologies to present back to Council for
their consideration on what an appropriate amount of
transfer shall be.
Page 22 of 43
Council Regular Meeting
May 21, 2007
City Manager Williams stated he believes we have a looming
crisis regarding our rolling capital in the City. He went
over the Edgewater Police Department Fleet/Mileage Listing.
He spoke of having other needs.
City Manager Williams then went over the project worksheet
for the shuffleboard courts as he had broken it down. They
can, after they have gone through the process, submit a
request for an overrun through FEMA for reimbursement.
Today he does not have a definitive yes that they will get
that reimbursement. Year to date they have actually
incurred $38,000 in expenses, which included the
racquetball courts. The City has received $160,000 in
insurance proceeds in November 2004. It went into the
General Fund and was not allocated to be specifically
toward the construction of this facility. He reminded
Council that at that time they were responding to Charley,
Frances and Jeanne and grasping at every penny they could
get their hands on to recover from those storms and that is
what the City did. He commented on why they need to place
an emphasis on our cash reserves from this point forward in
order to correct and prevent situations of this nature from
happening.
City Manager Williams stated the number one thing they have
to do is seek State approval. In order to proceed, the
Department of Emergency Management must approve that
facility. Leisure Services Director Jack Corder sent the
information over in March and for whatever reason, they did
not receive it. They drove over and hand delivered this to
the folks at the Department of Emergency Management and
physically gave it to them for their approval. It is
currently being reviewed by them for their acceptance.
They have to design the facility and it is on hold pending
State approval. Once the State approves the project, staff
will proceed with the bid to determine actual cost to
construct. He commented on what has been budgeted for the
shuffleboard courts. They would have a net impact to the
General Fund this year of $224,000. Recognizing they did
receive insurance proceeds in November 2004, it went in and
became part of the Fund balance and is part of the Fund
balance they have on the books today. He spoke of
prioritizing and start planning for the replacement of the
looming prices they have and build up our cash reserves to
be able to respond and those funds were used back then to
recover from the hurricanes. He then asked for Council’s
pleasure.
Page 23 of 43
Council Regular Meeting
May 21, 2007
Councilwoman Lichter asked if there is a general delay
needed anyway because they have to go every level of the
plans. City Manager Williams informed her yes.
City Manager Williams thought with the delays they have in
the approval process, they would clearly have this project
shifted into next fiscal year. They are going to have to
look at it from the effects of property tax reform and what
their priorities are based on the Town Hall Meeting.
Councilwoman Lichter asked if they have to pay when they
play in New Smyrna. A gentleman in the audience informed
her they have to join their club, which is $20 per year.
Councilwoman Rogers stated which is more expensive than the
fees in Edgewater being $12.
Councilwoman Rogers asked Deputy City Clerk Bloomer to put
the CD in of the pictures of what the shuffleboard courts
looked like the morning after the hurricane. These were
the shuffleboard courts that were knocked down within
seventy-two hours of Hurricane Charley. Coincidentally
that was August 13, 2004. At the beginning of August 2004
there was an ordinance or resolution passed by the City
Council to have on a ballot for the citizens of Edgewater
to vote whether or not they wanted to spend $1 million for
th
Kennedy Park renovations. On August 13 Hurricane Charley
came and damaged the court so bad that the City said they
had to come in and within 72 hours clear the courts. She
commented on the damage to the fencing. The clubhouse
looks good. She didn’t think that looked structurally
damaged. The courts looked playable to her. Someone made
the determination to knock down the clubhouse, to clear out
the shuffleboard courts and they were told this had to be
done within seventy-two hours because FEMA was in town so
the City would receive their reimbursement quickly. The
City Council was not aware that this happened according to
an e-mail that Councilman Vincenzi sent to the President of
the Shuffleboard Association. She rode her bike right
after Hurricane Charley and didn’t see detrimental damage.
She saw things that needed to be fixed but not where this
whole thing needed to be knocked down. She commented on
the fact that the City received a check for $189,965.00 on
November 19, 2004. They are given tonight a document that
was prepared by the City Manager that indicated we received
approximately $177,000 in 2004 towards the racquetball
court and shuffleboard courts. This was just the insurance
Page 24 of 43
Council Regular Meeting
May 21, 2007
reimbursement. We will not receive reimbursement from FEMA
until the shuffleboard courts and clubhouse and everything
has been rebuilt. The Shuffleboard people have asked,
written letters, and called requesting information
regarding the status of this. They haven’t been told
clearly anything. When she sees this City received this
money in November 2004 and she as a Councilperson did not
know the City received this insurance money until last
Monday. She is appalled. She is left in the dark and the
last person to find this out. She didn’t know if the
Council was aware of this or not. She has had a passion
about this. She has asked questions. The old City Manager
should have told her they received insurance money. Most
importantly he should have told the shuffleboard people.
The shuffleboard people have played shuffleboard across the
street since 1961. She believed the clubhouse was built in
1969 by the shuffleboard people with their money. There is
documentation and letters indicating how these people did
it, the celebrations they had and also letters indicating
that the Chamber of Commerce donated funds so the
shuffleboard people could have a couple additional
shuffleboard courts built. Shuffleboard courts that were
donated, a clubhouse that was donated and paid for by
members, and the City received the insurance proceeds and
nobody knows about it. When something goes wrong, do they
just turn and ignore it? They have to do something. They
can’t let this go on. Insurance money was deposited into
the City General Fund. Why wasn’t this noted in the audited
statements? Why wasn’t it brought to the Council’s
attention? She feels it is ridiculous that nothing has
been done.
Councilwoman Rogers stated a City Councilmember admitted in
a letter that he knew this was wrong. Nothing has been
done so far. She has asked before about the status of
things. She just recently found out the City requested
FEMA give the City an extension on the FEMA money. They
can’t indefinitely say they are going to rebuild something
and hope that FEMA is going to give us the full amount of
money. Initially they were told they were going to get
100% if the clearing away of the shuffleboard courts and
the clubhouse was done within seventy-two hours. Then it
was 95%. Then it was 80%. Who knows where it is at this
point. She just recently found out that two days after her
first town hall meeting where the shuffleboard people came
to the meeting and again asked questions about this. They
wanted to know the status and what was going on. Nobody
Page 25 of 43
Council Regular Meeting
May 21, 2007
told them that maybe something was in jeopardy. The first
thth
meeting she had was on February 24. On February 26 Brett
Tanner, the Finance Director submitted a letter requesting
an extension of time to rebuild those shuffleboard courts.
Right now that extension is only good until August 2008.
If she read it correctly, it said there were two previous
extensions. So they have been asking for extensions. She
asked who filled out the time extension recommendation.
City Manager Williams admitted it was him. Councilwoman
Rogers commented on where it says the extension was needed
because of the ability to obtain personnel or equipment and
that contractors were unavailable in the area. She said
that is not accurate. The accurate thing here is that we
were in the red and we needed to use that money. The
shuffleboard people have been left in the dark and hung out
to dry. They just figured because they are old they are
going to go away. They aren’t going to go away. She wants
to see the shuffleboard courts rebuilt. She knows the
numbers can be massaged and moved and they can use time
value of money. They can do something. They need to get
this right. The reason why it has prevailed so far is
because good men have done nothing. She is here now and
she wants to do something. She wants this thing done.
City Manager Williams felt it was important to point out
that until the State gives an approval, this may be get
extended again and again and again and they are at the
mercy of that approval. They were also waiting on St.
Johns to come through with permitting.
Councilwoman Rogers told City Manager Williams he never
told them he has been having to ask for extensions from
FEMA. She made mention about this at the last meeting.
She presented a question about how long it would go on
before FEMA says they aren’t going to reimburse us. He
never informed her they requested an extension in February,
two days after the Town Hall meeting. Why wasn’t this
brought to their attention? She is sitting with the
shuffleboard people last Monday and that is when she was
told. It would have been better to tell her ahead of time.
The shuffleboard people are having to pay more to go to New
Smyrna Beach to play on their shuffleboard courts. They
are having to work their schedules around New Smyrna. That
land across the street was deeded to the City and she
understands there is something in the deed that indicated
that the shuffleboard courts were to stay on that land.
She asked if they needed to get an attorney and come back
Page 26 of 43
Council Regular Meeting
May 21, 2007
at us. That is what she has heard they are looking at
doing. City Manager Williams informed her this is the
first time he has heard anything about a deed restriction.
If there is a deed restriction on that location, he would
be glad to research it. Until they get final State
approval, this could receive additional delays. Until they
start properly planning for the replacement of our rolling
capital to provide the essential police and fire services
they have out there, until they start addressing the cash
reserves to properly plan for and be able to respond to
hurricanes again until they get the situation resolved or
know what is going to come down from the State Legislature,
it is his recommendation to postpone this project.
Councilman Vincenzi informed Councilwoman Rogers he has a
lot of respect for her and she makes a lot of good
comments, which he appreciated. He admitted that things
have been done that weren’t proper, like the bulldozing of
these courts on a spur of the moment without notification.
What he said in his e-mail was true. Nobody up there knew
it. Ken Hooper made the decision and went ahead and did
it. The City received some money that went into the
General Fund and it was spent. That was wrong. The City
is in deep financial trouble right now especially with
looming tax cuts coming on. It is irresponsible to go out
and spend that kind of money on a recreational activity
before you know the impact of what will happen in the
State’s special session with tax reform. He feels bad for
the shuffleboard people. If they had money, he would vote
for it today. Being responsible stewards of taxpayer money
would lead him to believe that the right thing to do would
be put it off one more time until they know what kind of
impact the tax situation is going to have on the City. He
can’t in good conscience vote for something like this when
he knows that he may be having to make a much tougher
decision where it would involve people’s jobs and
livelihoods. He can’t in good conscience vote for this at
this time. He will gladly vote for it in September or
October if the money is available and they have a good
chance of getting reimbursed. Even if they don’t have a
chance of getting reimbursed and the money is available he
would still vote for it.
Councilwoman Rhodes agreed with Councilwoman Rogers and
Councilman Vincenzi. She stated the money they received
from the insurance company for the shuffleboard courts
should go to the shuffleboard courts. That is the right
Page 27 of 43
Council Regular Meeting
May 21, 2007
thing. It should have gone then. If they didn’t do it
then, they need to do it now. If they are saying they made
mistakes, tough crap. You make a mistake, you pay for it.
The City made a mistake the City needs to pay for. Over
and above those insurance proceeds, she agreed with
Councilman Vincenzi. Any money coming out of the General
Fund until they know what is going to happen with the tax
reform she thinks would be irresponsible at this point in
time. They are going to have to go through the State
process anyway, which will take a few months. By then they
should have more information about what is going to happen.
Anything FEMA will reimburse is the shuffleboard’s money.
She thinks the insurance proceeds are theirs also. She
feels it is like a rebate. To compare paying police
officers and firefighters and other City employees verses
something you are going to be reimbursed for. That is the
price of doing business. To her it does not correlate.
What they pay out in salaries and the general budget is
money that comes from the taxpayers. They will pay out
money from the taxpayers for a short period of time but you
will receive that money out. The taxpayers have not lost
one dime on the shuffleboard court to that point. She
feels this is going to take a few months for the permits to
happen and in that time they should have a better idea of
what is happening with their finances. It would be
irresponsible to put public safety at risk so they can have
the shuffleboard courts. She wants them to have them and
she will do everything to see that they get them in a
timely manner. From now on, these people need information.
Tell them when you are going to tell them at least. She
feels they are entitled to the courts. The money was given
to them to have those courts and the money will be
reimbursed to the City to have those courts and they should
have those courts.
City Manager Williams stated he didn’t necessarily
disagree. One of his concerns is the fact that if they
have $50 in the bank and it costs them $50 and they pull
that $50 out of the bank and they have to wait 6 weeks to
get it they are running a risk. He didn’t think it was
advisable at this point in time to run that type of risk.
Councilwoman Rhodes stated they put themselves in that
position. This City put themselves in that position. You
just have to bite the bullet.
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Council Regular Meeting
May 21, 2007
City Manager Williams stated his number one priority is to
make sure those paychecks continue to get paid each week.
Councilwoman Rhodes stated she just said that. She just
said that public safety obviously and jobs cannot come
before a recreational activity but she also said they are
entitled to it and they should get it.
City Manager Williams stated he thought that was where he
was going to need direction from Council. Councilwoman
Rhodes informed him she just gave him direction. Give them
the insurance proceeds. City Manager Williams asked
Councilwoman Rhodes if they wanted him to take the money
out of the $527,000 they have projected. That is what he
needs Council to tell him. Councilwoman Rhodes stated well
you took in and spent it real quick so they can just give
it right back. City Manager Williams stated he would
prefer they use we in that context. Councilwoman Rhodes
informed him he was right. It is we. She wasn’t absolving
herself from any responsibility. If she had known it at
the time, she would have said something at the time. She
knew they received insurance money and assumed it went
where it was supposed to go.
City Manager Williams stated if his memory serves him
correctly, there was a resolution that was passed by
Council acknowledging the emergency expenditures that were
necessary for responding to the hurricanes. In the
resolution would have been the expenditures necessary for
the demolition. He brought it up to see if any of the
other Councilmembers were aware of the discussion.
Councilwoman Rhodes stated that doesn’t mean it goes on
forever. City Manager Williams stated the point he is
trying to make is they need to prioritize. His priorities
are to correct the cash flow problem they have, make sure
they have enough cash in the bank to make sure that they
continue to meet our payroll obligations. If they miss one
time, that is one of the criteria for declaring a financial
emergency when the State of Florida comes in. That is his
emphasis. He recognized the need to take $160,000 out. He
can’t do that right now. He is trying to put some things
in place to ensure they have enough cash flow in order to
be able to respond to a hurricane season. As soon as they
can free up those funds, he doesn’t have a problem with
allocating it. The crisis they have to address is capital.
They have to continue to have the vehicles on the road.
That is where he is placing his priority. If they want him
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Council Regular Meeting
May 21, 2007
to take a different direction, he needs to know that. If
they want him to tell these folks they are going to wait on
the cars, that is fine and he will allocate the $160,000 as
priority number one going forward. He needs for them to
have that conversation as Council/Manager.
Councilwoman Lichter stated she was a little bit in shock.
She agreed with what has been said previously by her fellow
Councilpeople. Unhappily it might have to wait. Other
things in this City have waited three to four years now and
the money is in the bank for it. They didn’t take the
animal shelter money and put it for the purpose of the
hurricane. That was voted on with a positive vote from the
public. She feels they owe them an IOU if nothing else.
They need some assurity that it is really going to happen
but at the moment they have to wait a bit of time.
Councilwoman Lichter asked who took the pictures and if
there were any of the mural. She worked very hard to get
the $5,000 that Courtney Canova painted with real historic
scenes. She never saw the wall.
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City Manager Williams stated when they met April 30 he
distributed to Council a packet of everything he has been
able to run down in terms of the inspection from the Chief
Building Official, communication from the Leisure Services
Director and the pictures that the City had of the damage
to that facility and provided them with that information.
Councilwoman Rhodes asked City Manager Williams to have
this on one agenda a month so they revisit this topic every
month and get a status report on where this is. Councilman
Vincenzi asked if they could wait until after the special
session in Tallahassee. Councilwoman Rhodes informed him
they could.
Mayor Thomas stated it is unfortunate and they could point
fingers at who did what. They need to take responsibility.
It is gone and they need to rebuild it. He informed
Councilwoman Rogers if her daughter wanted a dress and she
knows she has to put food on the table then she is going to
make a responsible decision and put food on the table.
Councilwoman Rogers informed him he couldn’t use that.
Mayor Thomas informed her he could. Councilwoman Rogers
stated if she wanted a dress… Mayor Thomas banged the
gavel and informed Councilwoman Rogers he had the floor.
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Council Regular Meeting
May 21, 2007
Mayor Thomas stated they are in a terrible, terrible
situation. He has never seen anything like this in the
State of Florida. When you are a government employee, you
either do it because you believe in it or you do it because
you want a secure job. You know you aren’t going to get
the money that the outside world is giving you. You are
going to do it because you have a secure job and the
benefits that come along with it. He has never seen the
amount of people that are scared for their jobs. This is a
serious situation. That is why he is going to two or three
meetings every day. It isn’t right what they are trying to
do to the City. The have already cut to the bone and now
they want to cut some more. If each department has to cut
1/3, it is going to be terrible. They aren’t going to have
services. It is going to be a domino effect. Two or three
years down the road, they are going to say they don’t have
that service anymore. They need to do something about it
now. There is no question the tax system is not fair and
not equitable. They need to give it to the Tax Reform
Commission and let them come up with a plan. Not a bunch
of legislators fighting a political battle in Tallahassee
and that is exactly what is going on up there and making
the cities look like the bad guys. He commented on loving
to play shuffleboard. They need to make responsible
decisions. He appreciated the other Councilmembers making
those responsible decisions.
Councilwoman Rogers asked City Manager Williams when the
Disaster #1539 FEMA Project Worksheet was prepared. Would
it have been prepared around the time they were asking for
FEMA to give us money. City Manager Williams stated it is
part of the public assistance process. It would have been
prepared right after the hurricanes.
Councilwoman Rogers commented on the figures not matching
with regard to the shuffleboard clubhouse. She asked if
City Manager Williams was telling her it is going to cost
the City $137,000 to put the lights out there. City
Manager Williams stated he didn’t know the answer until
they bid the project. He commented on why the figures
don’t match. They wrote the project worksheet in 2004 and
they have experienced 40% and 50% increases.
Councilwoman Rogers feels it is smoke and mirrors. When
Mayor Thomas talks about every Councilmember up there about
making their decision and doesn’t even mention her name,
please. This is ridiculous. She is looking at numbers and
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May 21, 2007
what is right. Something could be done. She didn’t care if
they take baby steps. They did received $189,000. You are
going to tell me they can’t at least start something, at
least the shuffleboard courts. The money they are talking
about putting out they are going to get back. She feels
they are going to lose it and FEMA isn’t going to give them
another extension and they will not get the money and these
things will not be rebuilt the way they should have been
rebuilt. They shouldn’t have been knocked down in the
first place. Smoke and mirrors, that is what they have.
Mayor Thomas entertained a motion.
Councilwoman Rogers stated try to prove me wrong. If you
prove me wrong she will still win because if they can prove
her wrong they will have the shuffleboard courts.
Ms. Stoughton asked her if there were going to be citizen
comments. Mayor Thomas informed her no.
Councilwoman Rogers’ husband encouraged the Council to
prove her wrong. Mayor Thomas stated he wasn’t saying she
was wrong. Councilwoman Rhodes stated they aren’t
disputing what she is saying. Mayor Thomas stated he
agreed with what she says. They have to make a decision.
He asked who they want to fire? Councilwoman Rogers stated
that wasn’t what she was asking. Ms. Stoughton felt there
should have been an Attorney General investigation into
this matter a long time ago.
Councilwoman Rogers made a motion that they do something
and correct the wrong that has been done
. The City
received $189,965.74 and the City should say to the
shuffleboard people here, it is your club, it’s your
shuffleboard courts that you want rebuilt. We will turn
this over to you because since we didn’t management this
very well and maybe you can and then let the shuffleboard
people and herself form something and go out and ask
citizens to help them to rebuild this. She bet they could.
They have already spent $38,000 in engineering fees.
Mayor Thomas asked if there was a second to that.
Councilwoman Rogers stated of course not. Councilman
Vincenzi asked if someone could summarize that.
Councilwoman Rogers stated let us have the $189,965.74.
They have already done the engineering of roughly $48,000
and let them get this thing built. Let them manage it.
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Council Regular Meeting
May 21, 2007
Councilwoman Rhodes stated come back with that motion after
the tax reform and after they are permitted. If they can’t
get permitted, this is a moot point right now.
Councilwoman Rogers asked why they couldn’t get permitted.
Leisure Services Director Jack Corder stated they currently
have in hand the St. John’s permit. Now Emergency
Management has to review it and give us the okay to move
forward with the project.
Councilwoman Rogers stated so if they get that by a certain
date will the Council say they will come back and let them
have the $189,965.74 so they can go forward.
Councilwoman Rhodes stated once it comes back let’s make
the motion again. She thinks they will have more
information.
City Manager Williams stated that is not it. At that point
they have crossed one of the hurdles they have just
identified. Then you will have to design the facility and
bid the facility. At that point in time they will take
those budgeted numbers and he will present factual numbers
based off of the bids that come in for the construction.
He feels they would be in a better position to make the
decision to proceed and they would have definitive numbers.
Councilwoman Rogers stated Mayor Thomas wouldn’t allow
citizen comments but she thinks a couple of the
shuffleboard people need to get up and explain or give them
some more input. Mayor Thomas stated that was fine, the
shuffleboard people.
Carol Ann Stoughton got up and said she was with them too.
Carol Ann Stoughton
, 2740 Evergreen Drive, commended
Councilwoman Rogers for digging into this. When she says
she is going to do something, she does it. Are these real
figures or fake figures or are they going to come back with
different figures? She informed Councilwoman Rhodes she
found out in January from City Manager Williams what the
debt was. They didn’t know it, she didn’t know it and the
citizens didn’t know it.
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Council Regular Meeting
May 21, 2007
Councilwoman Rhodes stated they have an auditor’s report
every year and it is in there.
Mayor Thomas informed Ms. Stoughton she needed to address
the whole Council and not just one person.
Ms. Stoughton stated Mr. Williams told her in January and
no one in town knew because she talked to thousands of
people. City Manager Williams was Finance Director and he
knew where this money went and he knew what debt we were
in. He was courteous enough to tell her. None of the
Council knew it until she asked for it. She feels if the
money was given for the cause; why not give it to the
cause. That money was appropriated for a certain thing.
We evidently didn’t have the money in our Charter which is
required and that is why the money was taken out. She
feels the City Attorney should have an investigation as to
who decided to do this and knock it down. She feels those
people should be made to pay. Many people knew what was
going on but nobody blew the whistle. She asked City
Manager Williams if he knew what was going on as Finance
Director.
Mayor Thomas again informed Ms. Stoughton she must address
the whole Council. Ms. Stoughton stated she has a right to
ask him a question. Mayor Thomas informed her she didn’t.
Ms. Stoughton then asked Mayor Thomas if he knew what was
going on. She told Mayor Thomas to tell the audience they
were out of order when everyone started applauding.
Ms. Stoughton stated they have a right to know what is
going on. She asked Mayor Thomas if he could ask City
Manager Williams if he knew what was going on. Mayor
Thomas asked City Manager Williams if he knew what was
going on.
City Manager Williams stated what he did know was the City
was recovering from three hurricanes. The City as they
have pointed out many times needs to change their policy
regarding the number of cash reserves or at least attain
the cash reserves we have. They were using every available
resource to respond to those hurricanes.
Ms. Stoughton then asked what they paid for water meters.
Was it $5 million or $15 million? Are they done paying
$15,000 for a survey?
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Council Regular Meeting
May 21, 2007
Councilwoman Rhodes stated it has not cost the City one
penny for those water meters. City Manager Williams stated
that answer is in the CAFR, along with every other answer.
Councilwoman Rhodes stated every single year our debt is in
our auditor’s report. You can read it every single year.
It is public knowledge and nobody tries to hide it. City
Manager Williams thought Financial Note #8 deals
specifically with the debt that the City has on its book.
If not there is a debt schedule in there that identifies
every amount of debt we have on the books.
Dennis Buelk
, 2419 Woodland Drive, stated there were
mistakes made and most of the Council agrees there was. He
thinks the part of the opinion was when they decided to
take those courts down they were interested in that
property for a couple of years and that made the decision.
He had an article from March 1, 2002 from the Observer
showing what they had planned for that property.
Mayor Thomas stated he didn’t understand how you could
damage a shuffleboard court. There would have to be some
severe scars or something. They realize the problem but
they are financially strapped right now. He knows there is
some money for that but they need to just wait. He wants
to do it. He thinks there were some things done wrong and
everybody is pointing the finger at everybody. They need
to make amends and they need to have a shuffleboard court.
He knows we can’t afford it and he knows it isn’t a popular
decision.
Councilwoman Rhodes felt they could move forward until they
get to a point where they have to say no. Right now, they
don’t have enough information to say no at this point. She
felt they could go for the permitting and get to a point
where they need the cash, maybe they will have it. They
are getting that insurance money if City Manager Williams
has to take a pay cut. Let’s move forward. She has asked
City Manager Williams to keep it on the agenda every month
so they know where they are in the process. When it gets
to the point where they need cash in hand, then let’s take
another look at it. Maybe then they will be able to give
them a definite time line of when it is going to occur.
Councilman Vincenzi felt that was all anybody up there was
saying, except Councilwoman Rogers.
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Council Regular Meeting
May 21, 2007
Mr. Buelk stated he was the one that took the pictures and
when he went over there the day after the hurricane the
wall was already down.
Dominic Capria
, 606 Topside Circle, stated he is a little
concerned. They are talking about $160,000 in insurance
and $189,965.74, which comes up to $355,000 total. They
should be talking about that amount and they are talking
about $189,000. He feels they should definitely check into
the deed. The shuffleboard courts must stay here. He
would like to see that checked. That is where they should
be.
City Manager Williams stated fast-forwarding it to today’s
scenarios they talk about a wrong or misappropriated
funding. He stated they have an impact on this coast of a
major event. They sit down and look at priority of funds or
the restrictive use of funds. Councilwoman Rhodes stated
she understood why it happened but feels it doesn’t have to
go on forever. City Manager Williams agreed. Hence his
point of trying to constantly bring forward and make
recommendations that they need to make some changes
regarding how they handle their cash reserves.
Mayor Thomas stated Councilwoman Rogers made a motion and
they had no second. He asked if anyone wanted to make
another motion.
Councilwoman Rhodes made a motion to move forward with the
shuffleboard courts with the permitting process and that it
be on the agenda every month so they are updated all the
time and when it is time to have cash in hand, that they
have another discussion and vote, second by Councilwoman
Rogers
.
The MOTION CARRIED 5-0
.
10. OFFICER REPORTS
A. City Clerk
Deputy City Clerk Bloomer had nothing at this time.
B. City Attorney
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Council Regular Meeting
May 21, 2007
City Attorney Ciocchetti reported that they are looking at
the issues related to west of the I-95 petition and they
should have some word product to them shortly.
Mayor Thomas commented on the ECARD petition west of I-95.
He has gotten complaints about them misrepresenting
themselves about protecting the wetlands. When they ask to
see the petition they don’t have it and inform them it is
just one house per twenty acres. He asked if they could
have a little investigation into that. Councilwoman
Rhodes reported she also had received complaints.
Mayor Thomas stated he also had complaints from business
owners that they were trespassing on their property
illegally. He feels they need to investigate that. City
Manager Williams stated they certain would. There were
applause from the audience.
C. City Manager
1) Planning & Zoning Board request to
Council for Joint Workshop
City Manager Williams referred to a memo from the Planning
& Zoning Board requesting a joint meeting with Council.
They also would like to add that it would be a good time to
have a discussion regarding the Evaluation & Appraisal
Report. It is the necessary steps the City needs to take
for changes to the Comprehensive Plan and it is a
requirement that is done every seven years. He feels they
needed to look at their schedules for consideration of the
joint workshop with the Planning & Zoning Board. When they
discuss vision and recognizing that Board has taken some
great steps in trying to develop a vision for the City. He
has submitted to Council as one of his goals a
recommendation to establish an official visioning committee
made up of members from the Planning & Zoning Board,
Economic Development Board, Recreation/Cultural Services
Board, Parent Teacher’s Association, New Smyrna Beach High
School SGA, Council on Aging and one member at large so
they get a good representation of the demographics that
exist in the City. The number one goal should be to
establish a goal for the city in fifty years and the next
step would be to hopefully try to establish a vision
statement. He will have Paralegal Robin Matusick contact
the Council for coordination of a joint workshop.
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Council Regular Meeting
May 21, 2007
2) Special Meetings scheduled for May
23, 2007 and May 30, 2007 to consider
Ord. No. 2007-O-12 which could
increase the senior homestead
exemption of up to $50,000.00
City Manager Williams then commented on the need to have a
Special Meeting regarding the additional senior homestead
exemption that is available. There is a deadline of June
st
1 that if the Council is going to take action has to be
st
read into and adopted by June 1 or they will miss that
st
deadline and will have to wait until the December 1
deadline. He then went over the status of other Volusia
County cities and where they are at in the process.
Councilwoman Rhodes asked who decided the cut off would be
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June 1. City Manager Williams informed her the State.
Councilwoman Rhodes didn’t feel it was fair to do this
before the tax reform.
City Manager Williams stated to date they know there are
about 738 residents that would qualify for that exemption,
which would have an effect of about $105,000.
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Councilman Vincenzi stated he wouldn’t be here May 30.
City Manager Williams stated they could postpone it.
Actually his recommendation would be to postpone it until
they know what is going to happen at the State level and he
could bring it back to Council before the December 1st
meeting.
Councilwoman Lichter stated if seniors have an income of
less than $20,000 they already have one. City Manager
Williams stated it is still in effect.
It was the consensus of Council to postpone it.
3) Tentative Agenda Items
City Manager Williams stated they are preparing for the
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July 4 celebration and wanted direction from Council as to
whether or not they want to continue forward with that
celebration. To date they have invested $6,000. Where
they are heading is they have met with all of the
departments and have told them they needed to achieve a 10%
reduction in this year’s budget and what they have that is
going to affect that is overtime for clean up of the parks
Page 38 of 43
Council Regular Meeting
May 21, 2007
and so forth. He needed direction as to whether or not
they want to proceed.
Councilwoman Rogers asked if they had talked to New Smyrna
Beach about combining the fireworks efforts with Edgewater.
City Manager Williams informed her he had not had those
discussions. Fire Chief Barlow stated they had negotiated
with New Smyrna in previous years and they were willing to
combine them but they had to be shown in New Smyrna.
Councilwoman Rhodes stated they do so little in this City
and asked how much they cost. City Manager Williams
informed her $12,000 and then they have overtime associated
with the event.
Mike Hayes commented on spending $12,600 per year for the
fireworks and if they were to go in with New Smyrna they
would probably windup paying more than that. We get a
great deal from Zembelli. If they go in with New Smyrna
they are still going to pay overtime to help clean up. He
would like to keep it in Edgewater and come up with ways to
help raise money. The Volunteer Association raises $6,300
and the City kicks in $6,300. They need to know because if
they aren’t going to go through with it, he needed to get
in contact with Zembelli and see what they could do about
getting some type of fees back.
Councilwoman Rhodes felt this summer was going to be a
tough summer and that they should celebrate something.
Councilwoman Lichter felt it was an important thing to
celebrate but she felt there may be ways they could cut
cost. She suggested using the CAP guys. Sometimes
communities volunteer that way. City Manager Williams
stated they would certain explore every avenue. The reason
they are bringing this before Council is because they have
told the departments to come up with a 10% reduction. Over
time for special events, and this type of nature is
specifically targeted as achieving those savings.
Councilwoman Rogers felt the fact that they have already
put out the money is a no-brainer.
It was the consensus of Council to proceed.
City Manager Williams commented on a proposal from
Government Service Group Inc. to provide professional
Page 39 of 43
Council Regular Meeting
May 21, 2007
services and the development of non-advalorem funding
alternative for the City’s Fire Service. He will bring
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this back as an official discussion item on June 4. This
was something he identified in the goals workshop they had.
Shortly following that he had a meeting with a former City
Manager, John Kevin Grace who is now doing consulting work
for them and he happened to come in so timing of that was
fortuitous.
City Manager Williams stated they are going to proceed with
a discussion item on the proposed Animal Shelter at the
th
June 4 meeting. They will be presenting Performa
operating budgets, a radius plan, ordinances, policies and
procedures and provide them with the alternatives they have
been researching. What they have found and what they
believe they can do for Council’s direction and discussion.
They thought about trying to specifically address this in
the form of a special meeting however the agenda looks like
it can support a discussion item of this nature.
City Manager Williams commented on the flyer for the Town
th
Hall meeting that would be held on June 9. It is his
understanding all of the Council will be participating.
They are preparing a discussion where each department will
present to Council what the impact of some of this
reduction will mean and the quality of services they
provide today. He feels it is an important discussion they
need to have. Through that discussion they can start
developing steps to correct some of the issues they
identified tonight. At that same point in time they will
have available facts about property tax, which is something
they have included in the budget this past year. He didn’t
know if the citizens knew it existed. They are going to
proceed with having some of those printed and made
available for the citizens.
Councilwoman Rhodes suggested they put some on the counter
in City Hall where you pay the water bill.
City Manager Williams commented on trying to include some
interesting facts. They will be distributing these to the
citizens in trying to communicate the property tax.
City Manager Williams commented on posting the Town Hall
Meeting notice on the Internet as well as sending out some
invitations via e-mail. They are also looking at printing
inserts and stuffing them into the News Journal and running
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Council Regular Meeting
May 21, 2007
advertisements as well. Councilwoman Rhodes and
Councilwoman Lichter suggested using the Pennysaver instead
of the News Journal. City Manager Williams stated they
received a quote from the News Journal for 10,383 that
includes printing and distribution it is a $700 expense.
Councilwoman Lichter stated people are complaining to her
that they can’t get insurance on manufactured homes. She
feels it is almost just as much a problem as inequity in
taxes. She would like to research this.
City Manager Williams stated that is an excellent point.
When he and the Mayor attend the meetings on the property
tax rebate, what keeps coming out is they should be
communicating the fact of what has Tallahassee done to
correct that problem. They haven’t. If that is an
indicating of how they are going to fix the property
reform, he feels they should all be somewhat concerned.
11. CITIZEN COMMENTS
The following citizens spoke:
David Ross
, 2803 Needle Palm Drive, stated it is a
political war in Tallahassee. There is nobody in the State
that is able to negotiate with political warriors. He
recommended they suggest the Florida League of Cities and
invite the counties to join with them to notify the State
Legislature and our beloved Governor Crist that they are
going to put forth a petition for an amendment to the State
Constitution that will require the State of Florida to roll
back their revenues the same amount that the cities and
counties are required to and it will pass and they know it
will pass. There is negotiating with public. The cities
and counties are a problem but so is Tallahassee and so is
Washington D.C. This is an opportunity to get the State to
pay attention to the money they waste. Would the Florida
League of Cities send them a letter and say if they roll us
back, they are going to get roll back by the Constitutional
Amendment and the only thing they would be allowed to raise
additionally by that same Constitutional Amendment would be
the same percentage they are going to let the cities raise
ad valorem taxes.
Mayor Thomas informed Mr. Ross he was on track. They meet
twice a week and they have a conference call with the
Page 41 of 43
Council Regular Meeting
May 21, 2007
Florida League of Cities, the President in Tallahassee to
strategize.
Mr. Ross stated his point is the Florida League of Cities
will not be able to negotiate with those politicians but
they can tell them they are going to recommend to put forth
a petition for an amendment to the public and that will
scare them.
Councilwoman Rhodes felt that was a good suggestion.
City Manager Williams stated the League is developing an
attack but the one problem they have is until there is
something definitive because there are so many moving
targets out there.
Dominic Capria
, 606 Topside Circle, stated he already got
notice he will not be reinsured. For the record, you can
get insurance. Whatever agent you go to that agent gets a
fee but the insurance reverts to citizens and that is all
you can get. If you can’t get insurance at all, the
company you first had must hold you.
Mr. Capria stated people insure for higher than what their
contents or houses are worth.
Councilwoman Lichter stated new people can not get
insurance and that is one reason houses aren’t selling.
City Manager Williams stated if you examine your own
insurance bills today they would find that there is a
charge for citizens to bail out.
John Cordeiro
, 1515 Pine Tree Drive, asked if Liz McBride
was paid $100,000 to leave. City Manager Williams stated
Liz McBride had a contract that had severance. Her
severance required her to receive 270 days compensation,
thirty days notice. She was paid for the accruals and the
total package separation agreement was $106,000.
Mr. Cordeiro stated when the City doesn’t have any money
that is a lot of money to pay someone to leave. That money
could have gone to the police or firemen.
Councilwoman Rhodes stated she wasn’t fired. She left of
her own accord. It was her decision to leave so what else
can you do.
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Council Regular Meeting
May 21, 2007
Mr. Cordeiro stated the City should think about redoing
these leaving things and how much they get paid.
Mike Hayes
, 3123 Woodland Drive, President, Edgewater
Professional Firefighters, invited the Edgewater citizens
to visit the official website of the Edgewater Professional
Firefighters, Local 4575. The website address is
Edgewaterfirefighters.org. This is going to be a factual,
informational site. He stated he looked forward to seeing
th
everybody at the June 9 Town Hall meeting.
Mr. Hayes stated the Edgewater Professional Firefighters
goal is to insure that all employees keep their jobs. They
strive to keep the same level of service in all
departments. They want to make sure the City still
continues to have clean parks, clean, safe streets and
personal service from all employees. That is what you get
from this City. If benefits are cut and lost, hopefully
some will stay but some will go. They chose this City.
Many of them have been here a long time and they strive to
stay in the City.
12. ADJOURNMENT
There being no further business to discuss, Mayor Thomas
adjourned the meeting. The meeting adjourned at 10:00 p.m.
Minutes submitted by:
Lisa Bloomer
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Council Regular Meeting
May 21, 2007