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03-05-2007 - Regular CITY COUNCIL OF EDGEWATER REGULAR MEETING MARCH 5, 2007 7:00 P.M. COMMUNITY CENTER MINUTES CALL TO ORDER 1. Mayor Thomas called the Regular Meeting to order at 7:00 p.m. in the Community Center. ROLL CALL Mayor Michael Thomas Present Councilwoman Debra Rogers Present Councilman Dennis Vincenzi Present Councilwoman Harriet Rhodes Present Councilwoman Judith Lichter Present City Manager Jon Williams Present City Clerk Susan Wadsworth Present City Attorney Carolyn Ansay Present INVOCATION, PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE There was a silent invocation and pledge of allegiance to the Flag. 2. APPROVAL OF MINUTES A. Special Meeting of September 25, 2006 Councilwoman Lichter moved to approve the September 25, 2006 Special Meeting minutes, second by Councilwoman Rhodes . The MOTION CARRIED 5-0 . B. Regular Meeting of November 6, 2006 Councilwoman Rogers moved to approve the November 6, 2006 minutes, second by Councilwoman Lichter . The MOTION CARRIED 5-0 . Page 1 of 62 Council Regular Meeting March 5, 2007 3. PRESENTATIONS/PROCLAMATIONS/PLAQUES/CERTIFICATES/DON ATIONS A. Pure Air Control Services, reporting on environmental qualify concerns within City Hall, Council Chambers and the Planning area No one was present from Pure Air Control Services to make a presentation. B. Certificate of Achievement presented to the Finance Department for Excellence in Financial Reporting for Fiscal Year Ended September 30, 2005 Mayor Thomas presented Finance Director Brett Tanner with the Certificate of Achievement for Excellence in Financial Reporting. 4. CITIZEN COMMENTS The following citizens spoke: Jeff Marris , 2503 Fern Palm Drive, stated it is his understanding the City of Edgewater is in talks with Volusia County to staff the Fire Station in Oak Hill with money from a grant that was obtained, SAFER Grant from the government. He disclosed that he is a Volusia County Firefighter. He spoke of plans in the works to put a third firefighter there and they are already advanced life support. He had a meeting with Fire Chief Barlow and asked him who would pay the cost as the grant goes away over five years and he said that was undecided. It is unknown whether the City would pay it or not. The other day at the Town Hall Meeting the City Manager said this would be done at no cost to the City. Then he stated that there are plans to hire three supervisors and a quick response unit for EMS to cover the expanded area and personnel. That is contradictory. There is a cost right there. It concerns him as a taxpayer that this could end up raising the taxes in Edgewater. After five years who is going to take over when the government isn’t paying for that anymore? One of the citizens at the Town Hall meeting said the City’s priority list was either upside down or doesn’t exist. Along with that, many people were complaining because they came to the Police Station after a certain time of day and there was nobody there. He asked why they are looking to Page 2 of 62 Council Regular Meeting March 5, 2007 staff Oak Hill’s Fire Station but yet the City can’t provide coverage in our City in our Police Station for twenty-four hours. He asked if it would be possible to take the money to hire the three supervisors and EMS Unit and do something about the Police Station instead. If the City of Edgewater is truly $45 million in debt isn’t it more of a priority to work on reducing that debt than staffing another City’s Fire Station. The City Manager accused him the other day of being against closest unit response. As a firefighter for nine years, being in that truck and responding past other Fire Stations to help people or sitting at his Fire Station and watching a City fire truck go by is the worst feeling in the world and the closest unit response, none of them want anything more than that. Mayor Thomas asked about this not being on the agenda tonight but being on an agenda in the future. City Manager Williams stated this is in the very early stages of negotiations with Volusia County. Volusia County has approached the City and asked the City if they were interested. They would be very interested. He feels it is prudent upon them pending the Legislative Action or the House Action to do something with tax reform that all cities start looking at ways that they can provide some intergovernmental coordination to help lower the cost and continue to provide the same level of service within any jurisdiction. It is very preliminary at this point. Mayor Thomas suggested due to the large agenda that Mr. Marris be notified when this is going to be placed on the agenda. City Manager Williams informed Council of the memo he provided to them from Fire Chief Barlow regarding a response to questions regarding the SAFER Grant. Terry Packer , 1914 Sabal Palm Drive, disclosed that she had spoken to Councilwoman Rhodes, Councilman Vincenzi and Councilwoman Rogers about her issue. She stated she has a problem with the Building Department. Not only is the City providing Fire Services for the City of Oak Hill but they are also providing Building Services too. Our Building Department goes to Oak Hill? She asked why that would be? It doesn’t seem right that they have to pay for their Building Department and their Fire Department. She asked if the Police Department is going down there too? Page 3 of 62 Council Regular Meeting March 5, 2007 Ms. Packer stated she contacted Councilwoman Rhodes with a problem she had with the Building Department. Councilwoman Rhodes informed her she called her back. Ms. Packer stated she gave her a quick answer and the problem didn’t get solved. She asked her if she has done anything further. Councilwoman Rhodes stated she is under the impression the problem is solved. The inspections are being made as fast as they can be made. She talks about tax money. She wants to hire another inspector to inspect these houses. Our inspector has time to inspect these houses. That is what she was told. Ms. Packer stated not if he is going to Oak Hill too. Councilwoman Rhodes stated she didn’t know that he was going to Oak Hill. Ms. Packer stated the other problem is Councilwoman Rhodes told her they are being inspected at a rate of twenty per day. Councilwoman Rhodes stated she never said that. Ms. Packer stated she told her Frank was capable of twenty inspections a day and that these houses were going to be inspected rapidly because of the need. Councilwoman Rhodes stated she said they were being inspected as fast as they could. That there were not a lot of permits and a lot of other inspections that he needed to do so that he could do many in a day. Ms. Packer stated she has since brought the problem to Councilman Vincenzi and Councilwoman Rogers and it will be taken care of now. City Manager Williams stated they asked Building Official Dennis Fischer to be at the meeting tonight and he could update them on that issue. Councilwoman Lichter asked about Building Official Fischer working for Oak Hill but not in Edgewater’s capacity. Oak Hill pays for that service. City Manager Williams informed her that was correct. Building Official Dennis Fischer stated he is under contract with Oak Hill and has been for better than fifteen years to provide them the services that they need. He further reported they are diligently catching up on inspections they had to put on the back burner since the hurricanes. They were unable to hire additional people after the hurricanes to help catch up. They are making appointments with these individuals to get in the home. It is hard to find people at home to get an opportunity to come in. Since that time they have done a second mailing Page 4 of 62 Council Regular Meeting March 5, 2007 to these individuals. They mailed over 47 certified mail th issues sent out on February 15. They have gotten over 40 responses. They have four undeliverables and three unknowns. In the last few days of this month, they have performed nine of those inspections with two of those needing corrections that they will need to go back on. In February they did over 35 inspections on top of the other inspections they perform. They do do 25 inspections a day including these and including the rest of the work that has still been going on, the commercial work. He is down to three people in the Building Department due to illness and leave. They are doing the best they can with the staff they have. The Mechanical Contractor in question has hired two different electrical firms to help correct some of the electrical problems they had with some of the installations. He did violate Florida Statutes regarding installation of air conditioning equipment. They took him to the Board over in Volusia County. He is presently going to be on the April Agenda for DBPR for action or whatever they are going to take in sanctions against him for doing electrical work outside his realm. They have forced him to hire electricians to perform all the work he has bee doing since then. They have had 103 inspections pass since they started this program. Mayor Thomas clarified he works forty hours a week for the City and he is contracted part time with Oak Hill. Mr. Fischer informed him two nights in Oak Hill. Ms. Packer mentioned Bunnell. Mr. Fischer also disclosed he has a contract with the City of Bunnell on Saturdays. Councilman Vincenzi asked if it is one contractor in particular or a number of contractors. Mr. Fischer stated they had one contractor that had these issues and he is the largest permit puller the City has regarding mechanical. Councilman Vincenzi asked about the contractor being allowed to perform work without inspections. Mr. Fischer explained they were doing an affidavit basis because of the hurricane status, where he was self-certifying. They did that with roofing also. They were allowed to do that as an emergency stop measure. Councilman Vincenzi asked if they were still doing that. Mr. Fischer informed him no. Councilman Vincenzi asked when they stopped. Mr. Fischer informed him months ago. Page 5 of 62 Council Regular Meeting March 5, 2007 Councilman Vincenzi confirmed that every job they do is being inspected. Mr. Fischer informed him absolutely. They are finding electrical problems in the installation of previous air conditioning units that this contract is fixing at no expense to the homeowners. The contractor is cooperating 100%. Councilwoman Rogers asked Mr. Fischer when he was made aware to begin these inspections. Mr. Fischer stated this came to fruition with Ms. Packer’s incident. He self certified his installation of which he had an electrical failure. From that inspection, they saw that and from there they decided to look at the rest of those. Ms. Packer came by quite often to monitor that. Councilwoman Rogers asked when the initial letters were sent out. Mr. Fischer informed her in November. Councilwoman Rogers stated she is privy to some information and from what she understands, these affidavits they granted, this specific HVAC contractor, they granted him these waivers well beyond the time frame. The hurricanes were back in 2004 and there was no accountability with this specific contractor and problems began and Ms. Packer brought it to the attention of the Building Department and nothing was done after several attempts. Eventually something was done and she believed it was Ms. Packer that filed the initial complaint with DBPR. Mr. Fischer informed her Ms. Packer signed the affidavit. City Manager Williams stated once they learned of this situation, he and Mr. Fischer had communication and issued a directive from his office that they are no longer in the business of issuing affidavits. At this point if they ever get into a situation where the circumstances require them to do that they will certainly be looking at options of hiring out for outside inspections or if the situation dictates affidavits of that nature they will certainly require the homeowner to indemnify and hold harmless the City. Councilwoman Rogers asked if when an HVAC job is done in the City is the HVAC Contractor allowed to pull his permit and the electrical permit. Mr. Fischer informed him they now have to name the electrician. Councilwoman Rogers stated when this specific contractor initially pulled those 155+ permits was there an electrical contractor listed on the application. Mr. Fischer informed her there wasn’t. Page 6 of 62 Council Regular Meeting March 5, 2007 Councilwoman Rogers feels this would be an error of the Building Department because they issued a permit when there wasn’t. In Volusia County they wouldn’t unless there are licensed contractors listed and verified. Mr. Fischer informed her the mechanical change out part of the unit could be performed without an electrical permit being issued if there isn’t any change in the wiring system itself other than the removal and reinstallation. They have instituted a new application form that requires the contractor to list the amperage and wire size of the existing and the proposed so they can verify that an electrical permit is needed for that work. Councilwoman Rogers asked when the new application forms came to be. Mr. Fischer informed her the first of the year. Councilwoman Rogers questioned the work they are re- inspecting or inspecting for the first time since the beginning of 2007 was work that was done last year and previous. Mr. Fischer stated they are going back and looking at every permit they issued to that one contractor and going backwards through notification. They sent out notice by certified mail because they can’t get in contact with every one of those individuals. Councilwoman Rogers stated there would be a meeting with Mr. Fischer, herself and City Manager Williams and Ms. Packer on Thursday. She has reviewed a very thick file and she has more questions. Ferd Heeb , 115 N. Riverside Drive, stated the Comptroller General of the United States reminded America Sunday night that the eldest baby boomers would turn 62 in 2008 and be on Medicare in 2011. With our legislature trying their you damndest to reduce the impact of ad valorem taxes, better bar the door??????23.44 Dennis Buelk , 2419 Woodland Drive, President, Edgewater Shuffleboard Club, stated the Club was formed in March 1961 so this year they are celebrating 46 years they have been in the City. He commented on an article in the paper regarding the property the City was thinking about buying for the Library. In the article it had one of the options that the City was going to fund it was to use the shuffleboard money that was appropriated this year. He asked that they don’t do that and find some other way to fund it. Page 7 of 62 Council Regular Meeting March 5, 2007 Mayor Thomas asked Mr. Buelk how many members they had in their club. Mr. Buelk informed him forty-eight. John Welton , Port Orange resident, stated Port Orange is a part of Volusia County as he believed Edgewater was. He is an officer in the Volusia County Shuffleboard Association. They are representing the Northern District Shuffleboard Association, of which Edgewater is also a part. What happens in Edgewater reflects on the senior citizens throughout the County and throughout the district. What they have seen, if this is so, is a trend that is very disturbing. If this is so, he can’t see any fiscal responsibility in using moneys that have already been appropriated for another situation, which will not be reimbursed whereas their moneys would be reimbursed. It just seems like fiscal responsibility to him and it certainly is reflected that way throughout the County and throughout the District. Dominic Capria , 606 Topside Circle, stated the bills that were received for water, sewer, refuse, recycling, utility tax, he understands went up by 3%. He would like an answer at the next meeting, how much they have in these separate funds and what the expenses are in these separate funds. Mr. Capria asked for an update on what is going on with Edgewater Harbor. They are talking about a lot of money that is owed to the City and he doesn’t see anything coming in. Mayor Thomas informed him that was under Public Hearings, Ordinances and Resolutions. Mr. Capria asked if it would be open for discussion. Mayor Thomas informed him it would. Carol Ann Stoughton , 2740 Evergreen Drive, mentioned the City being $45 million in debt. She feels they must start reducing our debts before they go forward in any other building programs. She asked if they presently have the required moneys that they are supposed to have according to our Charter. Ms. Stoughton also spoke on behalf of a friend on Woodland Drive, who is a senior citizen, whose water bill usually runs around $64.00. They are now $90 and the water department said she has no leaks. She knows the City needs Page 8 of 62 Council Regular Meeting March 5, 2007 money but she feels they need to watch taking money from poor, senior citizens. Ms. Stoughton commented on a person in the Building Department that was fired after working for the City for two and a half years. From what she hears, she is going to sue. She feels they should start downsizing in City Manager Williams’ office with the perks. There is a total of $290,000 being spent under the City Manager’s department. She feels they have to start downsizing with the top officials. Everybody wants to work in Edgewater because that is where they are making the money. Wilfred Pelletier , 1801 Kumquat Drive, Officer, Florida Shuffleboard Association, stated he was at one of the Town Meetings with Councilwoman Rogers and City Manager Williams and they had very good conversation, some enlightment that they didn’t really know. The building that was removed in 2004 was actually built by the Shuffleboard people. It wasn’t an expense the City did. It seems to him that the damage of the hurricane, he didn’t know how they could destroy 16 poured concrete courts but apparently it was done. Within forty-eight to seven-two hours, they lost their shuffleboard courts and facility and now here they are in 2007 and they are still waiting for their courts to be built. He understood they do have the permits and now they read an article in the paper that there is a chance that because the need of the many may overcome what is right to the few that they may try to use some of that money to do a project that may get done. They still need to buy two more houses to do what they want to do. Are they able to keep their word? It came up before the Board. It got passed. They have a Committee that has been working with the Engineers and Parks and Rec. They helped with the design of the building and the lighting. It is going to be a very nice facility if and when it ever gets built. He then asked if they needed to stay until the Library item comes up on the agenda to discuss this more. Mayor Thomas informed him that was entirely up to him. Dot Carlson , 1714 Edgewater Drive, representing ECARD, formally announced that ECARD would be running a new petition, which is Amendment to Edgewater City Charter regarding residential density west of I-95. She has already received a poison pen letter. They filled out the form but only with their first and last name. The first Page 9 of 62 Council Regular Meeting March 5, 2007 name started with an F and the last name was a U. She considers herself lucky. She has irritated someone, which means she is doing her job. Leo Towsley , 2828 Unity Tree Drive, stated he was here about the dog pound again and would be until they get rid of it. He was reading in the paper last week about the $261,335 it takes to run the place. The City said they paid $99,300. He asked where the other $162,000 would come from. They were under this agreement when they voted for the thing about the $500,000 to put up the building and to be run by volunteers and donations and now the City is kicking in $99,000 a year. Councilwoman Lichter stated there are volunteers there during the day and community service people that are using up prison time helping and a day laborer that doesn’t get perks. There is a history that would take twenty-minutes. She informed Mr. Towsley he has only heard one side of the story. She mentioned representing the City when she served on the Humane Society. She would like Mr. Towsley to contact her at home to hear a different side of what happened. Mr. Towsley wanted everyone to hear where the money is coming from. Councilwoman Lichter mentioned a workshop that would be held by the City Manager where he would present various options of what they are going to do. She would like her fellow Councilmembers to also come and visit the shelter. She welcomed Mr. Towsley to come also. Mr. Towsley stated coming to visit is one thing, paying for the place is another. He doesn’t want to be paying all this money. Councilwoman Lichter informed him she is a taxpayer too. Mr. Towsley informed her and she is also a volunteer and this is one of her pet projects. Councilwoman Lichter informed him this City is her pet project. Councilwoman Rogers stated she asked City Manager Williams the same question and he said it was in their budget report. She suggested he ask the newspaper writer where she received that information and then he may get his answers. Councilwoman Lichter stated she welcomes a phone call. Mike Stull , 1401 S. Ridgewood Avenue, Suite 5, twenty plus year Edgewater resident, asked if the Library discussion Page 10 of 62 Council Regular Meeting March 5, 2007 would be open for discussion. Mayor Thomas informed him yes. 5. CITY COUNCIL REPORTS Councilwoman Lichter stated since the last time they met she has been to three workshops on the property tax situation. Tallahassee puts certain financial responsibilities on cities that many people don’t realize in terms of pensions, working conditions of firemen and policemen. They have in the last few years absolutely cut the percentage of money they give us for our roads, which means local communities kick in more. They have cut the percentage of money they give to hospitals and health care, which means local communities give more. Mental Services and that type of thing have been cut and especially school money has been cut. All picked up by local communities. She commented on speaking at a workshop called by Evelyn Lynn. There were hundreds of people that spoke for the citizens that the property taxes are unfair, unjust and inequitable. She agreed but felt a quick fix is not the answer. These cities are going to be so deprived of resources that things they all want no doubt will have to be cut. Councilwoman Lichter stated she appreciated the desire for the shuffleboard. Many seniors play. That is a worthwhile activity. The mural also got wiped out that day. She believes promises are promises and a handshake is a handshake. Councilwoman Lichter commented on very few legislators speaking at the end of that meeting. She told them she thought they formed a Committee and they should wait until they get their Committee report to see what they recommend before rushing into this. The whole situation has to be fixed. Councilwoman Lichter commented on a workshop that she attended as well as Mayor Thomas and City Manager Williams, where there were five speakers. There were people representing the tax group, our Assessor, and people from the League of Cities, which is a group that every city in the State belongs to. That is a group that also thinks there are injustices in the tax situation. The League has some concrete ideas to help that and help fill the void. She feels Tallahassee should listen to them also. Page 11 of 62 Council Regular Meeting March 5, 2007 Councilwoman Lichter briefly commented on a meeting she attended for the League of Cities itself. She has been very busy trying to get input in and understand what this is going to mean. It well may mean unless they think of an alternate way to help our resources. Just turning back the clock to what the City paid in taxes five or seven or eight years ago is not what it appears on the surface. Our community has increased in residents. Gas and other things have increased. Many things have changed. To turn it back to that it would mean taking away things they all want and need and joining in with other communities for various services. She feels they all need to keep an eye on this and need to have a workshop. Councilwoman Rogers expressed her appreciation to the citizens that came to the two Town Meetings she held as well as attending the meeting tonight. The information they brought to her attention was well received and she plans to address each and every item and get back with them. She suggested they keep an eye out in the newspaper. Councilwoman Rogers commented on being a member of the MPO Board and being quite busy. They have a couple of representatives, Evelyn Lynn that had a tax meeting on th February 28 and Marcia Bowen in the Senate, who has a bill right now with some suggestions regarding the property tax crisis. There are over 100 ideas they are looking at right now. They are meeting this week. She sent an e-mail and put her two cents in. She did not address the property tax issues for business or industrial. She hit upon all residential properties. She put it out there because they are looking at all suggestions. She feels they should not be paying property taxes based upon a property value. The Federal Government, when we are taxed we are taxed according to our taxable income. The more you make, the more you pay in taxes. As far as the property values go, we are being taxed the same way. The more the property is worth, the more you pay in taxes. Property taxes are generated so there is a revenue source to pay for the services they receive. She feels they should pay property taxes according to family size, which would make it a little bit more equivalent. She also made a suggestion that they need to look at in some areas they have a lot of residents that may live in unincorporated Volusia County that come to the meetings as well as those that live within the City limits. Both residents are receiving services. Page 12 of 62 Council Regular Meeting March 5, 2007 She feels this needs to be looked at. She feels they need to look in the future to a consolidation of services because she feels they are paying some duplication. Councilwoman Rogers then referred to the TRIM notice. The tax breakdown goes to various entities. She feels they have to look at all of that, not just one particular area. Councilwoman Rogers then commented on property insurance. The insurance crisis they have isn’t just property insurance. It is automobile and boat insurance. She wants the legislature to look at the whole package. She mentioned health insurance being a separate issue. Councilwoman Rogers then commented on already looking into some of the items that were brought up at the Town Meetings. She stated when the animal shelter was initially put on the ballot it was put on the ballot as a rescue/adoption/educational facility. They aren’t hearing about it anymore being dubbed as an educational facility. As far as the educational facility, that was one of the things the voters were lead to believe it would be and it is not. She referred to the Ordinance in 2004 that specifically states the City Council studied and researched that item before it was put on the ballot. She has asked if there was a formalized bid put out and there was not and they don’t have a record of one. She spoke of this being discussed at the Town Meeting. Councilman Vincenzi commented on a good editorial in the News Journal today from Pamela Hasterok. She talked about the tax proposals that are out there and said something to the effect that if you don’t want to pay property taxes, you should take a look around and do a reality check first. All of these proposals sound very nice. Everything comes at a price. If they don’t pay the City for the services they get, they will be paying someone else. Some of the proposals are drastic and some are not so drastic. There are a lot of them out there and they just have to wait for all of the ideas to surface. If some of the more drastic proposals are put on the ballot and voted in, there are going to be drastic changes not only in Edgewater but in every city in Florida. One of the big effects mentioned by Mr. Heeb earlier is right now Florida is an attractive place to live and the housing and building industry, even though it is slow right now has been active with baby boomers and retirees moving to this State. If they take Page 13 of 62 Council Regular Meeting March 5, 2007 away property taxes it is going to look very attractive for everybody. He spoke of seeing growth on an unbelievable scale come to this State. He spoke of people looking at the short term and not the overall effects of what life is going to be like when these things do take effect. When these proposals do come out, everybody that is a voter needs to be very careful and think about what they are voting for. Councilwoman Rhodes agreed with Councilman Vincenzi. At some point they are going to pay for services. Whether you pay for it in property taxes, through your water bill or sales tax, whatever tax money is taken away from the City in order to provide services is going to have to be made up somewhere in some way. They need to be careful and see how all this shakes out and then they can address it more intelligently. Councilwoman Rhodes stated she and City Manager Williams had a long discussion today regarding the debt the City is in. She asked City Manager Williams to explain the debt to the public the way he explained it to her. City Manager Williams stated when you look at it from a proportional relationship in terms of which fund incurs the most debt, the most debt that is on the book is a result of the Water & Sewer Fund, which specifically ties to capital improvement projects relating to the Wastewater facility back in the 1980’s and 1990. Florida Shores and a majority of the City was served by septic tanks. The State of Florida came in and said the leaching from the septic tanks is affecting the Indian River, requiring the City to build an Advanced Wastewater Treatment Facility. If they didn’t, the State was going to issue a moratorium on the issuance of building permits. The City went out and incurred a bunch of debt to build an Advanced Wastewater Treatment Facility as well as related infrastructure. At that same time they incurred capital improvement project for the Water Facility. Along those same lines, they incurred additional debt to upgrade that facility as well. Another large portion of the debt is the result of road infrastructure throughout Florida Shores, which were previously shell roads. The City took action and paved those roads. Another capital improvement project, hence more debt. Prior to the issuance of these capital improvement projects, Edgewater was very affordable to purchase a home and still is affordable today. He spoke of Page 14 of 62 Council Regular Meeting March 5, 2007 experiencing a tremendous amount of appreciation in home value as a result of those capital improvement projects. By incurring that debt and paying it over the amortization of the life of that loan, everybody has received a very wonderful value. Councilwoman Rhodes spoke of living on a dirt road in Florida Shores before they were paved and having a septic tank. As being one of those people that lived here at that time, she is happy with that debt and doesn’t mind paying it. Mayor Thomas thanked Councilwoman Rogers for having her Town Hall meetings and commented on the whole Council all sharing the load. He spoke of the boards the other Councilmembers serve on. He briefly commented on the meetings he attended last month. Mayor Thomas commented on speaking about the Library, the Animal Shelter, the Shuffleboard Courts and the debt daily as well as other problems. There is no easy solution. Mayor Thomas further commented on the Animal Shelter and the voters approving the $500,000 in 2002 for the Animal Shelter. Mayor Thomas then commented about not being against the Shuffleboard Courts and being an avid shuffleboard player. Mayor Thomas then spoke about the property taxes. He has been to three meetings and a seminar on the property tax reform and what they are trying to do is a quick fix bandaid over this thing. If you don’t think you are going to pay the same thing. You are going to be paying the same thing. We have to have roads, we have to have police, we have to have fire, we’ve got to have drainage. We’ve got to have that. All they are going to do is shift the burden. When they shift the burden, they aren’t going to give the cities the opportunity to spend it where they want to. The State is going to tell them where to spend it. He spoke of not being able to compare small cities with larger cities. They are going to shift the burden and make the cities the bad guy. He would like to see Home Rule. The County tried to shove those seven Charter amendments down their throats on the last ballot and they wooped them because of Home Rule. He guaranteed they are working on these things daily. Page 15 of 62 Council Regular Meeting March 5, 2007 6. CONSENT AGENDA A.Law Enforcement Trust Funds – staff recommending approval to use “Funds” in the amount of $9,962.50 to purchase and install a security system for the Whistle Stop sub-station B.Edward Byrne Memorial Justice Assistance Grant – staff recommending acceptance of the “Grant” in the amount of $4,839.00 to purchase various items totaling $4,851.52 and authorize the use of Law Enforcement Trust Funds in the amount of $12.52 to pay the difference C.East Volusia Mosquito Control District – staff recommending approval of an annual request to perform low level flights over the City of Edgewater and authorize the Mayor or City Manager to execute the document Councilwoman Lichter moved to approve the Consent Agenda, second by Councilwoman Rhodes . The MOTION CARRIED 5-0 . 7. PUBLIC HEARINGS, ORDINANCES AND RESOLUTIONS A. Mike Horber, owner of No Name Saloon, 2001 S. Ridgewood Avenue, requesting a Special Activity Permit for a Living Legends Concert in association with Powell Productions and the American Legion Post 285 events with outdoor music to be held March 24, 2007, with a rain date of March 25. Mr. Horber requests the City waive the permit fee and all other associated charges, i.e. Police/Code Compliance Officer fees Development Services Director Darren Lear made a staff presentation. Mike Horber , No Name Saloon, made a presentation regarding the charitable event he was going to be having and requested the fees be waived. Mayor Thomas opened the public hearing. Page 16 of 62 Council Regular Meeting March 5, 2007 Councilwoman Lichter stated in the past they have had this kind of charity benefit but she didn’t remember if they waived Police, Fire & Code Enforcement fees. It was confirmed that they had not. Mayor Thomas stated he spoke to Police Chief Taves the other day and he said if there is going to be 600 people they are going to have to treat it the same and are going to need some extra staffing. He was unsure about waiving the Police fees and the Code Compliance fees. He questioned them doing this for the Cancer Society and suggested taking that out. He asked Mr. Horber if he could do that. Mr. Horber informed him he could, it would just reduce the benefit they are able to provide. Councilwoman Lichter commented on the problem being there is more than one allowed in the course of a year and there are several places that ask for this kind of thing. They have not set that precedent before. She asked if they paid the fees for Police and Code Officers in the past. Mr. Lear didn’t recall waiving those fees but thought they might have waived the permit fee. Councilwoman Lichter asked how much the permit is. Mr. Lear informed her $300. Councilman Vincenzi also thought they may have waived the permit fee in the past but he didn’t think it was right to waive any other expenses as a result of extra fire and police that are needed because the taxpayers are paying for those services. If more police are needed to control crowds or traffic, he didn’t feel it was fair for the taxpayers to soak up the burden. Councilwoman Rhodes asked the actual cost of processing the permit. Mr. Lear stated he would have to check the advertising fees and associated costs. He didn’t know off the top of his head. Councilwoman Rhodes stated her recommendation would be to reimburse the City because those are tax dollars. While this is a worthy cause and she didn’t have a problem with that, everybody has their own charity and every taxpayer is entitled to give their charitable dollars where they want to. She didn’t think she had the right to make that decision for them. If the fee can be reduced by the actual cost of what it costs the City to process the permit, she would not be against that. She doesn’t want to see any taxpayer dollars paid for this event. Page 17 of 62 Council Regular Meeting March 5, 2007 Thomas Coe , Post Commander, American Legion Post 285, 11 Las Palmas Drive, stated one in four people today will get cancer. He is a cancer survivor. He spoke of a conversation he had with Russell Powell, Veterans Affairs Officer in New Smyrna Beach. They are trying to put something together to add to a scholarship for the education of the nurses in a Cancer Research Center in Tampa. He spoke of trying to give back to the community on a regular basis and asked that the City consider waiving certain fees. The American Legion, even though they are a non profit organization, are prepared to take out of the American Legion Post Trust Fund any fees that would be necessary. He spoke of meeting with the Jr. Vice President of WalMart, who said it was a noble contribution to people in research. WalMart has agreed to match what they do raise. If the City could help them, they would appreciate that also. The following citizen spoke: Carol Ann Stoughton , 2740 Evergreen Drive, stated a month and a half ago many of the Council voted for giving to ACT $11,000. She is also a cancer survivor. She felt it would be a disgrace if the City said no. She thanked the American Legion for doing this. Councilman Vincenzi stated it isn’t a matter of saying no. It is a matter of how they use taxpayer dollars and can they find the money to do it. He asked if anybody knew how much it cost to have police and whatnot at an event. Mr. Lear informed him it was $31.60 per hour for Police and Code Officers. Councilman Vincenzi asked about the total figure. Mr. Lear informed him they don’t know until the event is over. City Manager Williams stated the situation would dictate it. He commented on typically what happens. After the event they compile the hours and do the invoice. Councilwoman Lichter asked how much it costs for bike Week. Councilman Vincenzi asked if it is under $2,000 is there any money left that they set aside for charities and non- profit requests. City Manager Williams stated they have additional moneys that came out of the RCC budget this year that were returned to the City. They are also targeting Page 18 of 62 Council Regular Meeting March 5, 2007 some of those funds here tonight for some of the items they have listed and that was a return of about $80,000. There is some excess money in some accounts should the Council desire to waive these fees. Councilwoman Vincenzi doesn’t want to set a precedent but if it is going to cost $1,500 for police officers can they find $1,500. Councilwoman Rhodes stated that is the problem. When you do it for here you have to do it across the board. You can’t pick and choose. What may be important to her charity wise may not be important to someone else. Councilman Vincenzi stated they have had requests for money before and some they have had money for and some they haven’t. They have approved some and not approved others. Councilwoman Rhodes stated they aren’t requesting charity money and they don’t have that anymore and had to cut it out of the budget because the City doesn’t have any money. City Manager Williams estimated the cost at $450 for police officers. They would also have Code Compliance as well. Councilman Vincenzi estimated it would be under $1,000. Councilwoman Rogers stated they do have to make decisions based upon they are the stewards that are spending the citizens money. She didn’t vote for the $12,000 for ACT because she didn’t see any statistics that showed that it would directly benefit the city in any way. She is sure there are individuals in the City that did receive some assistance through ACT. This is a totally different thing. She wondered how many people that do not live in the City limits and would need a place to stay. She spoke of bringing income into the City, which she is definitely for. She was sure some of the employees of the No Name are residents of the City and will get paid well for doing this. She is for this. If they could find $12,000, they can find $450 or $1,000 or $1,500. Councilwoman Lichter commented on making donations to various organizations personally. She is for waiving the $300. She has a bit of concern because all of the projects that come under this heading have been more than worthwhile. She would rather buy the ticket and will than say that she thinks they should give to one over another. She would like to waive the permit fee and not the services of our officers. Page 19 of 62 Council Regular Meeting March 5, 2007 Mayor Thomas agreed with Councilwoman Rhodes and Councilwoman Lichter regarding are they going to be able to turn their head again. They are tightening their belts already. They had a meeting last week about restructuring and cutting people’s benefits and this sort of thing. He would be for waiving the permit fees. They are taking away from the taxpayers again. He didn’t know how much more they could tighten. They have meetings on this every day. Mr. Coe stated if the City would consider waiving the permit fee, he personally would absorb the cost of the law enforcement and traffic control in the interest of reverity and getting on with their lives. Councilwoman Rhodes asked Mr. Horber what his contribution is. Mr. Horber stated all net proceeds would be going over to the foundation. Councilwoman Rogers stated and they are looking to award $5,000 scholarships. Mayor Thomas entertained a motion. Councilwoman Lichter made a motion that for this particular event at the No Name that all the conditions be followed and that the City waive the $300 permit fee, second by Councilwoman Rhodes . The MOTION CARRIED 4-1. Councilman Vincenzi voted NO because he felt the City should be giving more . Mayor Thomas called a ten-minute recess at this time. The meeting recessed at 8:15 and reconvened at 8:25 p.m. B. Public Hearing, LEO Developers, Inc. requesting Final Plat approval for a 21-unit single-family residence subdivision to be known as Pinehurst Subdivision located east of U.S. #1, south of Canal Road Development Services Director Lear made a staff presentation. Mayor Thomas asked the applicant to come forward. Ed Grant , 873 Hewitt Drive, Port Orange, stated Mr. Scott got sick and had to leave so he was available to answer any questions. Page 20 of 62 Council Regular Meeting March 5, 2007 Mayor Thomas asked for Council comment. Mayor Thomas reported on visiting the property today with City Manager Williams and Development Services Director Lear. He was very impressed. There were scrub oaks on the property so that told him it was very high and very dry. It looked good. Due to there being no comments, Mayor Thomas opened and closed the public hearing and entertained a motion. Councilwoman Rhodes moved to approve the final plat of Pinehurst with the condition that prior to recording final plat all City staff comments are satisfactorily addressed and a bond/surety device for al infrastructure is accepted by the City, second by Councilwoman Lichter . The MOTION CARRIED 5-0. C. Public Hearing, Daniel Johns requesting Preliminary Plat approval for a 69-unit single- family residence subdivision to be known as Woodbridge Lakes located south of Roberts Road, between Indian River Elementary School and San Remo Development Services Director Lear made a staff presentation. Don Simms , Developer, Woodbridge Lakes, read a prepared statement with regard to the important aspects of their proposed new community. He was available to answer the easy questions and had his engineer, Daniel Johns, with him to answer the hard ones. Mayor Thomas reported on visiting the property today with City Manager Williams and Development Services Director Lear. He was pleased to see it was white sand and pine trees. He could tell by the vegetation it was high and dry. He was pleased to see the property was very clean. He stated you could tell Mr. Simms really cares about that land. Councilwoman Lichter had a question about the road. It was in a different place on two different maps. Mr. Simms explained what happened. Councilwoman Lichter asked if there was any thought for another way out. Mr. Simms Page 21 of 62 Council Regular Meeting March 5, 2007 didn’t feel there would be that much traffic out of there due to only having 69 lots. Councilwoman Lichter asked Mr. Simms if he was doing work on Roberts Road itself. Mr. Simms explained when Mosquito Control cleared the ditch that runs along the west property line, there was debris piled ten or twelve feet high in some places. When he called they told him most of the people are happy the ditch got cleaned. He couldn’t let that happen because it was blocking his drainage into the canal, which could have been a disaster. He hired his people at a cost of $17,000 to go in and grade it all off, load it up and haul it out of there. He also spoke of letting six property owners in San Remo cut through his property to do swimming pools, patios and porches so they didn’t have to tear up their yards, they were able to go through his property. He further commented on some trouble he had gotten in with Code Enforcement once. Mr. Lear informed Councilwoman Lichter on the western side of Lot 2 there is a fifteen-foot wide emergency access easement. Councilman Vincenzi stated this looks like a very nice subdivision. He asked if they would be having sidewalks. Mr. Simms listed what is included in the project. Councilman Vincenzi then commented on the negativity they have heard about 75-foot lots and every lot in this project being 75 feet. He asked Mr. Simms how he could make a profit and offer all the amenities. He felt it was a great plan. Mayor Thomas opened the public hearing. The following citizens spoke: Dot Carlson , 1714 Edgewater Drive, asked that Council discuss with the developer and all developers in common areas to try to do xeriscaping. Councilwoman Lichter stated Deborah Green from the Water Authority could certainly help with that type of thing. Carol Ann Stoughton , 2740 Evergreen Drive, stated that is a beautiful piece of property there. She commented on when school opens and lets out. She hopes they consider the Page 22 of 62 Council Regular Meeting March 5, 2007 road and if they are going to be left with the fact that the City is going to have to widen the road there. The people from meadow Lakes can just about get out of their development. They must consider the road there. She didn’t know who was going to pay for that because eventually it is going to have to be widened. Mike Visconti , 316 Pine Breeze Drive, stated he lives in Meadow Lake. He wanted to make sure the change was made to the entranceway. Councilwoman Rhodes informed him yes. Dominic Capria , 606 Topside Circle, stated Mr. Simms mentioned a fishing dock. He didn’t see any water there. If he is talking about a fishing dock over the retention pond, that is illegal. Councilman Vincenzi pointed it out on a map. Mr. Capria stated that is what it looks like to him anyway. Mr. Capria asked how much the homes are going to cost. Councilwoman Rhodes informed him it is none of their business. Mr. Capria then asked if the development is paying for the streetlights or does it go to the City. He comes from a subdivision where they pay for it. The City doesn’t. Mayor Thomas stated they aren’t paying for it. Councilman Vincenzi stated the City doesn’t typically pay for new roads or streetlights when a development comes in any more. Mr. Capria asked if there would be a gated community. Mr. Lear informed him it is not gated. Mr. Visconti asked if Roberts Road was supposed to be widened and if this would take place before the widening of Roberts Road or after. Councilwoman Rogers who serves on the MPO wasn’t aware of Roberts Road being widened. Sidewalks are going near there. Mayor Thomas stated he follows the MPO and he hasn’t seen anything in the immediately future of widening Roberts Road. Mr. Lear commented on some preliminary studies that were done about the possibility of widening Roberts Road to three lanes. That has never gone anywhere up to this point. It is not in the Capital Improvement plan. Right now there are no solid plans for that. Page 23 of 62 Council Regular Meeting March 5, 2007 City Manager Williams stated they just passed a concurrency ordinance addressing roads and certainly they are going to have to do some traffic studies to determine level of service. Councilwoman Rhodes stated that can come from road impact fees. Councilwoman Lichter asked if that is totally a City road. Mr. Lear informed her it was. Mr. Simms agreed at the Planning & Zoning Board to pay for the streetlights. One of the requirements of the Planning & Zoning Board was for him to run a sidewalk the entire length of his property at his cost, which he agreed to do. Mr. Simms complimented Mr. Lear and Bonnie Wenzel who have always tried to be helpful in trying to guide him. He didn’t always like what they said but at least they were trying to guide him the right way. Mayor Thomas closed the public hearing and entertained a motion. Councilman Vincenzi moved to approve the preliminary plat for Woodbridge Lakes Subdivision, second by Councilwoman Rogers . The MOTION CARRIED 5-0 . D. Public Hearing, Edgewater Harbor, LLC requesting Amendment No. 2 to the Planned Unit Development Agreement (PUD) for Edgewater Harbor City Manager Williams made a staff presentation by going over the outstanding issues addressed in Amendment #2. Staff recommended approval of the second amendment. Kevin Donaghy , on behalf of Edgewater Harbor, stated there were some major issues discussed at the last meeting and he complimented City staff on their willingness to work with them. They felt they had some real wide gaps to cover but they came out of the meeting being reasonably happy about agreeing to pay up to $20,000 per month for the boat slips and they are excited about moving forward with that as the cornerstone of their project. Mayor Thomas asked for Council comment. Page 24 of 62 Council Regular Meeting March 5, 2007 Councilwoman Rogers commented on when the project was presented to the City and the first RFP was going to be condos. The selling point was the $500,000 estimate in property tax revenue that the City was going to receive. There were other developers that presented developments to the City but this one won over those developments because of the revenues. That didn’t happen and then last year they received the second change. The story that was told was they were going to go from an eight-story condo to townhouses due to the cost of construction and financing of condos. The City gave this gentleman an extension and allowed him to change the plan. In doing so she made a statement that if this was not done within the specified period of time that this development would then have to be built according to the current land use codes or at least the land use codes they were working with. Here they are strike two. It has not happened and now the gentleman is coming back and he is wanting the Council to discount on the boat slips. From the revenue figure that was given to her by City Manager Williams, with the $1.50 per foot per length of boat slips, they are looking at revenue in the amount of $230,000 per year. New Smyrna is looking at selling a wet slip starting at about $385,000. When she reads that and they are looking at getting $230,000 per year per boat slip, she has to stop. This gentleman received this property, prime waterfront with the largest amount of boat slips in the City for $3 million and they haven’t gotten anything so far. A lot of time has been spent and they have received nothing and now he wants a three-year extension of the time to build something. The whole reason they put it out for RFP was to try to find somebody that was going to bring revenue to the City and bring all of these wonderful things. It didn’t happen. She feels it didn’t happen the first time, it didn’t happen the second time, it’s not going to happen the third time. She feels they need to look back at the duration of their agreement they did last time and it specifically says the developer’s failure to initiate construction within the time frame identified herein may result in the City’s termination of this agreement. She feels right now that is what they need to do. It hasn’t happened and the City doesn’t have the money and they need to go forward. If they give him these amendments, they have no remedy if these things don’t happen. They will be right back where they are at now or in a court situation. She feels the agreement has been breached. Page 25 of 62 Council Regular Meeting March 5, 2007 Mr. Donaghy disagreed with Councilwoman Rogers. He mentioned there being a number of reasons why the original project did not go up. The developer did not enjoy returning $8 million in deposits when it became fiscally irresponsible to try and put up the original project. Prices raised too quickly, the impact the hurricanes had on raw materials and the insurance and labor pool, etc. They came in last year. They did get an amendment. This is still a condominium project and they still believe it will have a very positive impact on the City’s revenues. They moved forward last year and spent another $1 million. Their plans were submitted to the City in November. They had some issues with the City that they debated at length last time. They were asked to come to a resolution. The boat slips being $380,000 was news to him. Councilwoman Rogers stated the dry slips are starting in the $180,000 range. She informed Mr. Donaghy they didn’t have a lot of time tonight and it does say the developer’s failure to initiate construction. What is more plain than that? Mr. Donaghy informed Councilwoman Rogers he understood what was in the agreement but there was a significant issue as to whether or not they were awarded the boat slips and it was their sincere position that those were awarded to them in the original PUD agreement. There was never any discussion until during this past year about payment for the boat slips. They met in good faith with staff and agreed to pay $1.50 per foot, which will come out if they are successful to about $240,000 per year to the City, which he feels is a significant concession. They want to start this project as soon as they can. The extension is needed to do the sales, the banking and the financing. Councilwoman Rogers stated that price is a drop in the bucket compared to what it could and should be. She feels the city has been beyond a good neighbor and in some cases a decision made back then was almost blind to give the man the property for $3 million. The City didn’t even have the property for thirty minutes. The City has lost a wonderful opportunity and the tax revenue that they definitely would have had by now. With the situation they are facing, this certainly would have helped. Three more years, you have got to be kidding me. Please. Three more years. Don’t insult us. Councilwoman Lichter feels this is an opportunity to recoup. She doesn’t see it like Councilwoman Rogers. We Page 26 of 62 Council Regular Meeting March 5, 2007 have a new capable lawyer, who they asked to negotiate this agreement. She doesn’t know how long City Attorney Ansay spent in conference with these people to work out a deal that in the end isn’t quite what everybody would like. The way the building slump is right now things are not what they were when this process started. These people have invested $8.5 million. They are sitting here again trying to save a project and work with the City. She feels City Attorney Ansay is the negotiator, not the five of them. She is going to go along with City Attorney Ansay’s recommendation. Mr. Donaghy stated this is not an isolated incident. He commented on the market being difficult right now. They asked City Manager Williams how many building permits the City issued this year. City Manager Williams informed him in the first quarter they issued five. Mr. Donaghy stated five. They want to build it as soon as they can. Councilwoman Rhodes asked City Attorney Ansay if they say no to this and forget the court and them suing us, what happens if this agreement is terminated by the City. They have to have some sort of agreement, some sort of zoning. City Attorney Ansay stated the agreement they have in place right now for the property to the degree it is terminated leaves the property in an RPUD zoning classification with no agreement in place. At that point in time it would become incumbent on the applicant to rezone the property out of RPUD classification to try to achieve some sort of other development through straight zoning processes or attempt to negotiate another PUD agreement. They are in a position where those are really the options. Obviously that is not going to happen because they probably will be involved in some litigation in the interim. The details and the way this has all evolved probably couldn’t have been foreseen when the RFP was originally put out and the contracts entered into because at that time the market was a much different place. She has had questions along the lines of getting the property back. There isn’t anything they can do because the City conveyed the property. Other than this development agreement, there are no contractual assurances to the City that the developer does anything on this property to meet the needs of the City via the RFP. This PUD agreement is essentially where the terms of that whole process came to bear. Page 27 of 62 Council Regular Meeting March 5, 2007 Councilwoman Rhodes stated if they terminate this agreement 1) they spend money on legal fees and 2) at some point there is going to have to be some agreement. Barring no agreement, that land lies fallow. She thinks they are better served by at least attempting to make this happen. If it doesn’t happen, he will never get another agreement out of her. She agreed with Councilwoman Rogers to a point. She feels this has gone on far too long. He didn’t do what he said he was going to do. But she does understand the way the market is now and that it is in the City’s and the developer’s best interest to get some development on that property. In the interest of doing that, she would vote for this. Councilman Vincenzi stated like many things it’s not the ideal solution but it is a solution. He thinks this project has dragged on too long. He feels there should be something in there that says this is a last chance effort. If it doesn’t succeed this time, go back to the drawing board with nothing guaranteed on either side and go back to negotiating a new agreement for that piece of property. Mr. Donaghy stated if they don’t live up to it the City would have the right to pull back the boat slips. If the PUD would expire, they would have no guarantee of ever being able to get the boat slips. Councilwoman Rogers pointed out that City Attorney Ansay said there are no contractual assurances. City Attorney Ansay stated what she said was when they originally put together the first RPUD project there was no contractual assurances that what they wanted via the RFP was going to be done exactly as set forth in the response submitted by them in the time frame submitted by them except what’s in there. They don’t have any separate other agreement allowing them to pull back the property. If the date has changed and says three years and they get three years from now they still have the phrase that says if the developer doesn’t complete within the time frame required the agreement can be terminated, which puts them in the position they are in today. Councilwoman Rhodes stated she thought three years from now they wouldn’t have the litigation issue they might have today. It’s one thing to go to the court and say we have done everything the City can do and bent over backwards to help this man with this development and it is another thing right now there are some issues on the table. There might Page 28 of 62 Council Regular Meeting March 5, 2007 be some City liability in this. That would be for a judge to decide. But three years from now you eliminate that. Mr. Donaghy stated there were a number of issues that were resolved. City Attorney Ansay stated they came to the table with the developer presenting a lot of allegations that the City was in part responsible for the delay such as the issue of fighting over the impact fees, the issue of site plan approval. She feels clearly the position they are in today with those allegations being present is a much weaker position then they would be in if in three years from now it wasn’t completed. Right now their position would be, if this were to all blow up, that the City was in large part responsible for the delay. That would be something a judge or someone else would have to decide. Councilman Vincenzi again stated he didn’t think it was a great solution but it was a solution and hopefully it will jump start this thing and get it going. Mayor Thomas commented on meeting with City Manager Williams where they discussed the terms of the agreement. He asked how many boat slips they were getting. City Attorney Ansay stated in the event all the relevant regulatory authorities permit them there would be 30 water- wet slips and up to 300 dry slips. Mayor Thomas stated the City only has 410. He asked City Manager Williams what the best solution would be for the citizens of Edgewater. He informed him this is the best agreement they could come up with but if they approve this agreement he would like to add a stipulation of a time limit. Mayor Thomas opened the public hearing. The following citizens spoke: Carol Ann Stoughton , 2740 Evergreen Drive, asked how much money they owe us presently that we have failed to collect. She can see them going forward if they pay up what they haven’t paid in the first place. You people have spent so much time. Other people have to come in and lay out money. These people haven’t. Why hasn’t the Council looked into that money? Get it now. Get it up front and then they can go forward. Is it $2 million they owe us? She feels they should collect the money before they allow them to go on Page 29 of 62 Council Regular Meeting March 5, 2007 for another three years. They have already had two years. Let’s collect the money. They could use $2 million. Mike Visconti , 316 Pine Breeze Drive, asked if the City is going to benefit or lose by this? If the City benefits by it, why is it taking so long to have this developer start developing this project. You get impact fees, you get tax revenues. Does the City benefit or don’t they? Councilwoman Lichter commented on the developer changing the plan. She mentioned the money and time it cost. Mr. Visconti stated the developer is taking the gamble. He is the one spending all the money. He is the one gambling to sell these units. Where does the City lose? Ferd Heeb , 115 N. Riverside Drive, stated he has opposed the development of this property since day one when the County owned it. He strongly recommended it be retained as a park to give all the present and future residents access to the riverfront. Tim Howard was the first one to try to acquire this property from the County and develop the property. The City and Boston Whaler opposed it. The County turned it down. The City then orchestrated the deal to buy this property and sell it to the developer of choice based on RFP’s. Based on these people’s RFP the Council awarded them the ability to buy that property for $3.2 million. That is less than $50,000 per acre for prime, waterfront property and possibly the last large parcel on the riverfront. This is the third time they have renigged on contracts. They admitted they renigged on contracts with the first buyers and refunded $8 million in deposits. They renigged on the original proposal and the City granted them a change, which he though was insanity at the time, and now they are back at the table looking for an additional. In addition, they come back and tell the City they have 90% of the available boat slips that are available to the citizens now and in the future. This is insanity. Turn them down and go back to the drawing board or get something from them in return for what they are asking for. Paying for the use of the boat slips is not enough. He has strongly recommended that they get them to give us the south 200 feet for boat ramps and parking for boats for the residents of Edgewater. Give us the 200 feet, and give them the three years. If they don’t want to do anything more, turn them down. Page 30 of 62 Council Regular Meeting March 5, 2007 Councilwoman Rhodes asked if they would give the city the 200 feet. They informed her no. Pat Card , 3019 Willow Oak Drive, disclosed he had talked to a number of the Council already. He stated he stood up there and opposed the extension the last time. He is standing there to oppose the extension again tonight. He is sorry that this individual has had so many problems moving forward with this project. The original project would have generated a great deal of money and tax for the City as he described it. He really would like to see the Council simply say you haven’t done your part, I’m sorry and turn it down. Dave Ross , 2803 Needle Palm Drive, stated there are going to be three of them that make this decision. The question before them really is are you happy with what is going to happen and the benefits that the City of Edgewater are going to receive with the agreement they have. Is this the best that Edgewater can do with that piece of property? If it is not the best, then terminate the agreement and negotiate a new agreement with this owner or a new owner that he may sell to to cover his property. He didn’t think there would be any problem getting $8 million off of that piece of property today and he feels he knows that. He urged the Council to make their decision not on the market today. Is this the best deal for the City or is there something better out there that they can negotiate with somebody if not this gentleman. Make your decision on what is best for Edgewater, not what is best for the developer. Hawk McMillan , developer, Edgewater Harbor, thanked City Manager Williams, City Attorney Ansay and Paralegal Robin Matusick. They really did work hard. He kept his word and they never did raise their voices. Mr. McMillan felt Councilwoman Rogers was very wrong. He has spent a lot of money and is the one that got the Manatee Protection Plan and paid for that. Councilwoman Rogers asked Mr. McMillan how much it cost him to put up the seawall. Mr. McMillan informed her he didn’t put up the seawall. Councilwoman Rogers asked what he did with the property that made his out-of-pocket fees be $8.5 million when he roughly paid $3.2 million. Mr. McMillan stated they spent about $1.5 million doing the plans for the eight-story buildings and they spent engineering fees Page 31 of 62 Council Regular Meeting March 5, 2007 to do the engineering for the eight-story buildings because that is totally different engineering than you would do for townhouses. They had to clean up the site. They have had a lot of legal work done and that is what he spent. Mr. McMillan stated if they do this and go forward, they are going to review his plan. He is going to pay for the review and then to go forward he has to pay the impact fees for the 142 units. He doesn’t think the Council has any idea what it is like in the lending world today. Councilwoman Rogers informed him she did. Mr. McMillan asked her if she has borrowed $8 million before. Councilwoman Rogers stated for Mr. McMillan to get up and look straight at her and tell her she is wrong, she suggested they remember she is here to represent the people, not the developer. She doesn’t feel sorry for what he has spent and what he has gone through. She is here for the citizens. Mr. McMillan stated he hopes they go forward. He is prepared to personally borrow the money to pay the impact fees at a very high rate of interest. If they don’t go forward, it will be land banked, he will sue the City and he will sell the land just as the land is underneath the PUD agreement and zoning that is there. He feels the way he feels about the boat slips and about the way they submitted. He doesn’t want to do it. He wants to go forward and build this project. Councilwoman Rogers asked Mr. McMillan who pushed forward the extension last time. Mr. McMillan stated he did remember and he brought in his plan in November and he was prepared to go forward then. He had a bank loan. He couldn’t get his plan review. Some way or another, his bank was told that he owed the City $2.6 million. He doesn’t owe the City $2.6 million and they refused to fund the remaining of the loan. That is what pushed them here. Now he has to go back and redo everything. He hopes they go forward. Councilwoman Rogers asked if he was willing to reduce the time frame from three years to a year. Mr. McMillan informed her she was asking him if he was willing to go bankrupt. No, he is not. Councilwoman Rogers informed him that wasn’t what she asked. Mr. McMillan informed her she doesn’t understand the situation. Councilwoman Rogers stated she wasn’t there to argue, she just asked a Page 32 of 62 Council Regular Meeting March 5, 2007 question. Mr. McMillan informed her he really didn’t want litigation but he feels after doing a whole lot of work that he has a great point to litigate on. Councilman Vincenzi asked City Attorney Ansay what the ramifications would be if they didn’t approve this, what would happen and what will it cost the City. City Attorney Ansay informed him they have a date in the current draft agreement that requires construction to commence early next month. If construction does not commence, which obviously it will not, by that date then the City is in a position where it can terminate the agreement. At that point in time, it is her understanding they would probably be served with a lawsuit by the developer. Councilman Vincenzi asked on what basis. City Attorney Ansay informed him on the basis, she thought, based on what they have told her, based on the fact that they would claim that any delay in the agreement was delayed on the part of the City and that they were not able to move forward because they submitted back in November and since then these issues have been in dispute. She thought at that point it would be up to a court to sort it all through. She felt at the end of the day they are still finding themselves in a position where they have somebody who owns a piece of property that the City once owned but owns no longer which puts him in the position of owning that property and then having to decide whether to sell it, which would become someone else’s issue from the standpoint of deciding what ultimately happens or if they go back to the drawing board and attempt to restructure a new deal, which is usually difficult to do and then the same two parties are in court litigation over the project. She wasn’t sure what the claims would be but she guessed they would try to hit the City with the burden of the failure to comply with the timeframe. Councilwoman Rhodes asked if they sue the City and win, the court would force the City to adhere to this original RPUD? If they lose the lawsuit, what is a judge going to do to them? City Attorney Ansay speculated and stated if she were them she thinks their homerun would be they would argue that they should be able to proceed with the development or they should be entitled to damages from a financial standpoint that the developer feels he has incurred as a result of the delay. Whether a judge would actually give them that, they would have a lot of very good arguments, which they do, that the delays they are alleging are not all borne by the City. She thinks they all Page 33 of 62 Council Regular Meeting March 5, 2007 understand the real delay is the market. If you can’t get people to buy condos, you can’t get money in terms of deposits. If he can’t get money in terms of deposits, he can’t get a bank to loan him the money he needs to do the project. At the end of the day, she feels the City has that as their argument. The City didn’t cause the delay, the market did. What a judge does is always out of their control. Councilwoman Rhodes stated she was just wondering when all is said and done and it is all over what their obligation is going to be as far as zoning this land and do they at that point have to renegotiate a new RPUD assuming he comes to them. City Attorney Ansay stated exactly. One of the big things that exists here as well is there is also a height issue now that is a predicament for them as well as the City. This is one of the projects that was attached to the ordinance that the former City Attorney prepared as a grandfathered project because of the existing PUD agreement. With this PUD agreement terminating, this causes a lot of issues for the property in the future. Councilwoman Rogers stated City Attorney Ansay had made mention initially that two of the conditions the developer could sue us on would be his alleged claim about the delay because of the impact fee issue and because of the site plan approval. She understood the site plan is now in the City and is being reviewed. What he is asking for is an amendment. If they gave him an extension, of let’s say six months to do what he initially proposed to do, then he can’t come back and sue us for those two things. If he is saying the City delayed him, delayed him for how long? Just give him an extension for that period of time and let it run its course and then he would have no grounds to sue them because they are still working under the agreement that they did last year and they are giving him an extension for those things that he is alleging the City has done. City Attorney Ansay felt clearly one position could be that if the site plan was submitted back in November, figure out what purported time they have arguably caused any delay and extend it that time period. She thought the other things the City Manager attempted to resolve with the amendment with the developer also had to do with the impact fee issue as well as the use of the slips. The original PUD agreement provided an allocation of boat slips. There was no mention of any fee. At the end of the day, if she had to bet her money, she would bet her money on them Page 34 of 62 Council Regular Meeting March 5, 2007 winning that issue in court. That was an issue that they in exchange for the time period tried to give to balance the equities a little bit. She felt the agreement was very contradictory and vague. It did not provide for how impact fees would be dealt with in terms of a project that was to be done in phases. There was an issue. There was correspondence from the previous City Manager that these could be paid based on phases. That was the other issue she thought there was some attempt to try to resolve in addition to the timing. Councilwoman Rogers stated that has been resolved so they just give them an extension for the review of the site plan. City Attorney Ansay stated they aren’t going to offer to pay for boat slips and they aren’t going to offer to pay on the impact fee schedule the City has set up if they don’t get the extension. Councilwoman Rogers suggested they put everything back to a level playing field. Do what initially you have now interpreted this agreement said without what you are planning to do with the impact fees now regarding the boat slips. They have that interpretation. It doesn’t need to be an amendment. Just say that that is now clearly understood, give him a six- month extension on the site plan approval and in six months they will be back there and they won’t have to deal with a lawsuit coming against the City. It appears there are some Council people that are going to vote in favor of the amendments because of a lawsuit and what she is saying is they can run the deed out right now. Mr. Donaghy respectfully disagreed. They had a number of issues. They went through this whole discussion the last time they were here. They had significant issues over the ownership of the slips and the impact that not reviewing their plans had on them and their financing. It is not that easy to just give them a six-month extension. He feels they made some significant concessions regarding payment for the slips, which is almost a quarter of a million dollars a year if they hopefully get what they are looking for. He thinks they have gotten a little awry here. He feels this is still the best thing for the City. If they don’t go forward, forget the lawsuits where they would have to sue to protect their rights and their rights to the slips. If this PUD is not approved, other developers who are successors in interest would develop whatever they wanted down on the waterfront. This is still a project that is going forward. They are trying to get a Page 35 of 62 Council Regular Meeting March 5, 2007 commercial marina facility that is open to the whole City. He thinks that is what the City should focus on. He thinks that is what the City should focus on. If they don’t have this they won’t have a PUD agreement and they will be further from where they are here and a successor/developer/owner may not want to put something down there for the benefit of the citizens of Edgewater. He feels it makes sense to go forward with this one. The Council directed them to work their differences out and he feels they made an honest, sincere attempt to do that. They reconciled everything they had on the table and everything the City had on the table and they would like to move forward on this. They don’t want to litigate this matter. Councilwoman Rogers stated her biggest concern is the three-year extension. They would be looking at 2010 and then when are they going to receive the money. Councilman Vincenzi asked how the 300 dry dock slips equate to boat slips on the river. City Attorney Ansay explained the Manatee Protection Plan defines what constitutes a slip. Through the Manatee Protection Plan they not only define a dry-stack storage as a slip, they also define trailer space where you would actually park a boat trailer. If you try to put in a launch and put in fifty trailer parking spaces, those all constitute slips under their definition. It is very aggressive. This is all geared toward manatee mortality. Mayor Thomas commented on asking City Manager Williams, City Attorney Ansay and Mr. McMillan and his constituent to sit down and try to hash things out and make compromises. They did so he can’t see anymore debating. They need to either take the opinion of their City Attorney and City Manager, their recommendations, or vote no. He is not real happy about the project but he likes the smaller stories better than the tall stories. He doesn’t like giving all the boat slips up but he questioned the City Attorney in detail and she informed him they have a very good chance of winning that because of the previous agreement. He believes the City Attorney and City Manager went to bat for them and is making the best agreement for the citizens of Edgewater. Mayor Thomas entertained a motion. Page 36 of 62 Council Regular Meeting March 5, 2007 Councilwoman Lichter made a motion to approve Amendment #2, to the Planned Unit Development Agreement (PUD) for Edgewater Harbor, second by Councilwoman Rhodes . The MOTION CARRIED 3-2. Councilwoman Rogers and Councilwoman Rhodes voted NO . st E.1 Reading, Ord. No. 2007-O-04, Dennis Brinn, President of Sunshine State Bank, requesting an amendment to the Official Zoning Map to include 2.08+ acres of land located at 1620 Edgewater Drive as B-3 (Highway Commercial) (rezoning) City Attorney Ansay read Ord. 2007-O-04 into the record. Development Services Director Lear made a staff presentation. George Scott , 3018 S. Peninsula Drive, Daytona Beach, Director, Sunshine State Bank, was available to answer any questions. Mayor Thomas asked for Council comments. Councilwoman Rhodes felt this would have made a great place for a City Hall. Councilwoman Rogers felt it would have been a good place for a church. Mayor Thomas opened the public hearing. The following citizens spoke: Mike Visconti , 316 Pine Breeze Drive, stated he was very disappointed. This was the site he chose for a new City Hall. He congratulated Mr. Brinn for picking a beautiful site in Edgewater. He is disappointed in Council for not getting that piece of property so we lost another one. Mr. Visconti asked if they are ever going to get a City Hall. Mayor Thomas informed him yes. Councilwoman Lichter stated she didn’t think it was voted on by the public the last time they voted. Mr. Visconti proposed to start a pledge drive for the citizens of Edgewater to pledge $2 per week, $110 per year. If his calculation is right, they have about 22,000 people in Edgewater. At that pledge, they would have a revenue of Page 37 of 62 Council Regular Meeting March 5, 2007 $2,442,000 and they could get a new City Hall. He asked the Council to think about it and he would be glad to help. Mayor Thomas stated he still had a plan for City Hall. Dot Carlson , 1714 Edgewater Drive, stated she is five houses away from that property. What is sitting there now used to be the Settle Wilder Funeral Home. It sits way back on the hill. She asked how much of that land is going to be covered in concrete and what access off of Edgewater Drive. They already can’t get off of Edgewater Drive onto U.S. #1. She already has a motel on one end of her street and dead trees. There is no tree on the backside of that lot yet and these people are going to put another bank. There are already banks up through there. She doesn’t care what they put but suggested they do a good traffic pattern. She asked if they are going to put any trees on the property. Mayor Thomas closed the public hearing. Councilwoman Rhodes moved to approve Ord. 2007-O-04, Dennis Brinn, President of Sunshine State Bank, requesting an amendment to the Official Zoning Map to include 2.08+ acres of land located at 1620 Edgewater Drive as B-3 (Highway Commercial), second by Councilwoman Lichter . The MOTION CARRIED 5-0 . F. Public Hearing, Sunshine State Bank requesting approval for an off-site sign which is proposed for property adjacent to and west of the proposed bank property Development Services Director Lear made a staff presentation. Mr. Scott informed the Council that at their main bank in Port Orange on Clyde Morris Boulevard they planted 92 palm trees around the bank not counting all of the other landscaping. Mayor Thomas asked for Council Comment. There was none. Mayor Thomas opened the public hearing. The following citizen spoke: Page 38 of 62 Council Regular Meeting March 5, 2007 Dot Carlson , 1714 Edgewater Drive, asked if their exit is coming out onto Eaton. Mr. Lear informed her no they aren’t proposing to do that. Only one access was decided upon on Edgewater Drive. She still hasn’t heard any explanation with what they are going to go with traffic control there. Mr. Lear stated they have a traffic study they have to submit to the City to verify that traffic pattern works. Mayor Thomas closed the public hearing and entertained a motion. Councilwoman Lichter moved to accept the sign, which will be separated from the bank itself, second by Councilwoman Rhodes . The MOTION CARRIED 5-0 . st G.1 Reading, Ord. No. 2006-O-37, City of Edgewater, on behalf of Frank and Donna Morris, requesting an amendment to the Official Zoning Map to include 10+ acres of land located north of Oak Trail, west of 2967 Oak Trail as RT (Rural Transitional) (rezoning) cont. from 2/5/07, Item 7C The applicant has requested continuance with no date certain. This item was withdrawn from the agenda. st H.1 Reading, Ord. No. 2006-O-43, Joseph Alison requesting an amendment to the Official Zoning Map to include 27.69+ acres of land located south of Airpark Road, west of Silver Palm Drive as RPUD (Residential Planned Unit Development) and approval of the associated RPUD Agreement for Elegant Manor Estates (rezoning) cont. from 12/4/06, Item 7D City Attorney Ansay read Ord. 2006-O-43 into the record. Development Services Director Lear made a staff presentation. Mark Watts , Attorney, Cobb & Cole, 351 E. New York Avenue, Suite 200, Deland, made a presentation on behalf of the applicant. He further commented on traffic issues and Page 39 of 62 Council Regular Meeting March 5, 2007 waiting on a traffic study. He feels to continue to hold it up and to leave it on the table pending the study does a tremendous disservice to his clients. He asked the Council not to leave them in limbo. His clients have submitted a development that is consistent with what they have asked people to plan for in the City. He asked for Council’s support and approval of the PUD. Mayor Thomas opened the public hearing. Mayor Thomas made a presentation with regard to Turnbull Hammock due to having walked the property. He would be willing to support this if they do not fill in the north borrow pit to leave some extra drainage. They are only going to lose four lots. There was a brief discussion regarding the boundaries of the Hammock area and what divides it. There is a canal between Silver Palm Drive and the Hammock. There was a brief discussion regarding who is supposed to maintain the canal. City Manager Williams didn’t know the answer. Councilwoman Lichter felt they should look into who is supposed to maintain that. City Manager Williams agreed to look into this. Councilwoman Rhodes asked Mayor Thomas if he wanted the north borrow pit to remain in addition to any other retention he is going to be required to have or let him trade off. Attorney Watts commented on the existing pond on the south being expanded in exchange for filling in the one on the north. The same capacity that is on the north for that pond is simply being shifted to the pond on the south. They are doing what he asked keeping the additional capacity. Mayor Thomas confirmed they would be expanding the southern most borrow pit. Attorney Watts confirmed that was correct. He showed a rendition of the outline of the existing borrow pit on the south and the outline after it is enlarged. Mayor Thomas feels they need to go to extremes to protect the Turnbull Hammock system. Page 40 of 62 Council Regular Meeting March 5, 2007 Mayor Thomas recessed the meeting for five-minutes for City Clerk Wadsworth to change the CD. The meeting recessed at 10:10 p.m. and reconvened at 10:15 p.m. Mayor Thomas asked for Council comment. There was none. Mayor Thomas asked for public comment. The following citizens spoke: Pat Card , 3019 Willow Oak Drive, stated when somebody stands up there and makes any suggestion at all that they extend Mission Road through the center of Turnbull Hammock an ancient, aqueous, hardwood hammock, they had him say that was a more favorable spot then putting it along Park Avenue. He feels that is the wrong thinking. If they ever consider putting it in there, they should attempt to get these properties by every means possible. Mayor Thomas stated he would lay his body in front of them. Attorney Watts stated he is just looking at what corridors make sense on a map. Personally he thinks using frontage along I-95, if you have to stay close to a disturbed area makes a lot more sense. Turnbull Bay Hammock, Spruce Creek and the Tomoka are outstanding resources they can’t afford to mess with. He again asked Council not to hold up his clients’ investment in the property and their plans to move forward on the basis of what might happen many years down the road. They asked for Council’s support on this on the basis of its consistency with the development of the City and the Comp Plan. Dot Carlson , 1714 Edgewater Drive, stated the more houses you put near the Hammock the more contaminations they will have running into the Indian River Lagoon. Mayor Thomas closed the public hearing and entertained a motion. Councilman Vincenzi moved to approve Ord. 2006-O-43, Joseph Alison requesting an amendment to the Official Zoning Map to include 27.69+ acres of land located south of Airpark Road, west of Silver Palm Drive as RPUD (Residential Planned Unit Development) and approval of the associated RPUD Agreement for Elegant Manor Estates (rezoning), second by Councilwoman Rogers . Page 41 of 62 Council Regular Meeting March 5, 2007 The MOTION CARRIED 5-0 . I. Res. No. 2007-R-03, ratifying the results of the November 7, 2006 General Election City Attorney Ansay read Res. 2007-R-03 into the record. Mayor Thomas entertained a motion. Councilwoman Rhodes moved to approve Res. 2007-R-03, ratifying the results of the November 7, 2006 General Election, second by Councilman Vincenzi . The MOTION CARRIED 5-0 . 8. BOARD APPOINTMENTS A.Planning & Zoning – nomination by Councilwoman Rhodes to fill a seat vacated by Dan Grisell who has moved outside the City limits Councilwoman Rhodes nominated Gigi Bennington, second by Councilman Vincenzi . The MOTION CARRIED 5-0 . B.Recreation/Cultural Services – nomination by Councilwoman Lichter to fill a seat due to an expired term Councilwoman Lichter nominated Debra Sopko, second by Councilwoman Rhodes . The MOTION CARRIED 5-0 . 9. OTHER BUSINESS A.Property Purchase – discussion on request by the Edgewater Public Library for the City to purchase property adjacent to the library (presentation by Library Board Chairman Jean Haughwout on 1/8/07) City Manager Williams made a staff presentation. Jean th Haughwout appeared before the Council on January 8 identifying this property as an option to purchase for potential expansion of the library property. After concluding the presentation the City and seller agreed to Page 42 of 62 Council Regular Meeting March 5, 2007 split the appraisal cost. The appraisal came back at $158,000. He commented on what is included in the contract. They anticipate demolishing the property at an estimated cost of about $10,000. The total cost for purchase and demo is $199,000. He commented on Council direction for Mayor Thomas and himself to go back and hold some additional conversations with the seller to try to negotiate the price to the appraised value. They met with Mr. and Mrs. Tomazin and had a very good discussion however the contract price remains today as it was when it originally appeared before Council at $189,000. He briefly commented on three potential funding sources that were also th identified at the January 8 meeting to include freezing police officer positions and vacant firefighter positions, the shuffleboard courts, and shell and property in ParkTowne. City Manager Williams commented on an email from Butch McCracken from McCracken Enterprises that has requested to purchase the remaining shell, which is between 18,000 and 20,000 cubic yards at $3 per foot. City Manager Williams commented on appropriations that were made in this current budget for debt to construct Base Leg Drive and a portion of Rowan Way to provide access across the drainage canal along ParkTowne Blvd. He again commented on the offer from McCracken Enterprises to purchase the remaining shell at an estimated cost of $60,000. Rather than exercising that option, staff suggested they exchange shell and property for the construction of the concrete span to provide the access across the stormwater canal. Construction costs will be determined from an issuance of an RFP that they are planning to do. Upon pursuing the debt for the construction of Base Leg Drive, they obtain additional funds to look at the purchase of this property if the Council so desires. He asked for Council direction. Councilwoman Lichter stated they are talking about purchasing property for the library and that price is over the appraised price by $31,000. City Manager Williams confirmed that has not changed. All they are suggesting at this point is that they do some exchanging of assets within the ParkTowne property. Mr. McCracken has expressed his interest in doing so. Obviously they will have to go through the RFP process and then they will pursue debt issuance on the construction of Base Leg Drive of which Page 43 of 62 Council Regular Meeting March 5, 2007 they have a contractual obligation for. In pursuing that debt issuance, they can look at obtaining additional funds to purchase the library property if the Council so desires. Councilwoman Rogers asked if they could just agree that on Option #2 that they don’t want to deal with taking away the shuffleboard court money for the purchase of this library. Councilwoman Rhodes questioned there being a cost for racquetball courts included in the shuffleboard court money. City Manager Williams confirmed there was. Councilwoman Rhodes suggested they take the money out for the racquetball courts to put towards the library house. City Manager Williams informed her the estimated cost for that is roughly $96,000. The City did receive some insurance proceeds to the tune of about $189,000 so that would help eliminate the $200,000 deficit on the cost of that and that money has gone back into the Fund Balance. That is why they see the $200,000 impact is borne in the General Fund. They have not bid this project yet. They can’t tell them for certain that there is an adequate amount of funds to continue to do the shuffleboard courts at this point in time. They still have the right to petition FEMA to increase the project worksheet to accommodate any additional funds above and beyond what they have already pledged. They are ready to go ahead and move forward with the project and bidding but they still have to determine the cost. That item will be back before Council awarding it to a contractor at some point in the future. Councilwoman Lichter asked what that had to do with three police officers. City Manager Williams explained he understands option two is now off the board. Option 3 involves some assets in ParkTowne, doing an exchange. They have a property owner that is doing a $12 million project out there right now that said he could accommodate but they have to bid that portion of it. Councilwoman Rhodes asked if they could do all three things, the road, the house and the shuffleboard court. Councilwoman Rogers stated they didn’t know about the shuffleboard until the RFP comes back. City Manager Williams stated they have to get the construction cost. They also will be doing an RFP on the construction of Base Leg Drive. They have some unknowns they have to get answered but they believe this is one of the better options out there. Councilwoman Rhodes stated they have budgeted Page 44 of 62 Council Regular Meeting March 5, 2007 for the shuffleboard court. City Manager Williams stated as he understood Council that option is off the board at this point but they still have to bid the project. They built the budget based off of estimated costs and it may come in where there is an impact of $300,000 or $400,000 to the General Fund and that item will be back before Council. Councilwoman Rogers felt they needed to decide if they were going to buy the property or not. She felt absolutely not. Contract price $189,000, appraised value $158,000. No, not in this market. Councilman Vincenzi stated he was going to say something similar but Councilwoman Rogers said it better. If the appraised value is $158,000, why are they asking $189,000. Because they know the City can reach into their pockets and pay it and he feels that isn’t right. He would love to buy that piece of property and the one next to it for library expansion but not at the cost of being robbed. Councilwoman Rogers stated greedy. Councilman Vincenzi stated they know the City has more than an individual would have. If an individual went to buy that property for $189,000 and an appraisal came back at $158,000, no bank in the world would lend you that money. Councilwoman Rhodes questioned the value by sales comparison being $194,000. City Manager Williams informed her that was an old contract from the original drive by. Mayor Thomas asked if they could buy that house in Florida Shores for $189,000. He feels it is something they can’t pass up. In the future, it is going to go up in price. Even though they don’t have the money and they were forced to rob Peter to pay Paul. He doesn’t know how City Manager Williams sleeps at night. He is thinking about what the Council wants all the time. He took him hunting and he was talking about City business the whole time. He is constantly working for the citizens of Edgewater and how to please everybody. Councilwoman Rhodes had a problem with the price. Mayor Thomas informed her they wouldn’t come down on the price. Councilwoman Lichter felt it couldn’t be held up but there is probably another way to do it. Mayor Thomas informed her they could make another offer. He wasn’t sure if they would accept it or not. Page 45 of 62 Council Regular Meeting March 5, 2007 Ruth McCormack, Librarian, Edgewater Library, stated the property is of greater value to them and the City then it would be to the average homeowner. Because they are adjacent they could utilize it far more fully than anybody else could for the purposes they would wind up using it for. The second homeowner has agreed in the future that he will give them right of first refusal on the other little piece of the corner. In all likelihood if they secure the first, eventually they will secure the second and then they vacate the road and they have a lot more property then they would buying a different site some place else. You know the price is only going to go up. It is going to go up for any piece of property they choose. If they wait two, three or five more years then it will be more. On the night they gave the first presentation, everybody voted unanimously to stand behind them and it was a wonderful thing. She stated Councilwoman Rogers said they didn’t want to let this one slip through their hands like they did the corner of U.s. #1 and Indian River Boulevard. That is what will happen here if they don’t act on it. They won’t wind up getting it. Eventually the library will move some place else and they will no longer have the perfect location in a residential area that you can get to so easily by foot, bike and road. It is more valuable to them and they know that but any situation like this where a municipality was planning on locking some pieces together, you are going to expect to pay a little more than the appraised value. She knows City Manager Williams has been locked in this because the owners have been to every meeting except tonight so he hasn’t been able to say what can be offered. It is a public venue so it has been sort of can’t you lower the price a little. They did come down from $200,000 so they did lower it a little. They may still lower the price some more. She impressed upon the Council how valuable it is in conjunction with the other property that is already in the library holdings. Mayor Thomas asked for public comment. The following citizens spoke: Carol Ann Stoughton , 2740 Evergreen Drive, stated the people have a right to ask what they want for their property irregardless of their appraisal. They have to go somewhere. The houses in Edgewater start at $175,000. The man at the end of the street wants $300,000. Even if they Page 46 of 62 Council Regular Meeting March 5, 2007 paid $160,000 here, the man at the end, and Mr. Williams is aware that he was kicked off the man’s property because the man said he wouldn’t sell it unless he got $300,000. Then they have $200,000 to the lot to the east. They are talking about $700,000. She isn’t against the library but she is against spending what they don’t have. Library cards have gone up to $5 a piece. She hopes in the future they would try to petition the County, if they don’t want to give them money and they are cutting back what services are they giving them. It is called the Volusia County Library. She feels they should go back and say they are cutting money from them and say they want to cut money from them and go on a Federal or State level. She suggested they think about that in the future. David Ross , 2803 Needle Palm Drive, asked the appraised value of the Library and the property it is on. It is prime commercial property. He suggested they sell it and find another location for the library to do what they want to do in one location rather than piecemealing a package together. Just a thought. Mike Stull , 1401 S. Ridgewood Ave, Suite 5, stated he owns the property to the east of the library and he has never been contacted about anyone purchasing his property. His property is about 31,200 square feet. That property is about 25,000 square feet. If you don’t have a contract up front with the owner at the end of Banyan Tree Drive, of course he is going to want $300,000. Councilman Vincenzi asked Mr. Stull the asking price for his property. Mr. Stull informed him $465,000 but it is zoned commercial, it is ready to go, it is a larger lot, you can vacate Alamanda in between and have another 60-foot right-of-way. Alamanda could be ran down to Banyan Tree Drive and connected with Edgewater Drive. He again stated nobody has ever contacted him to negotiate anything about it. Even to ask if he would lower the price. He would even be willing to hold a note on part of the property to help the City out. Councilman Vincenzi commented on struggling to find $200,000. To find $450,000 or $460,000 would be a lot more difficult. He suggested Mr. Stull contact City Manager Williams. He informed Mr. Stull some of the consideration is money and where to get it from. Mr. Stull stated that is why he said he would be willing to hold a note. Page 47 of 62 Council Regular Meeting March 5, 2007 Councilman Vincenzi pointed out no matter who finances it, it is still increasing debt. Mr. Stull stated if they buy the house they are proposing to buy now, they are still going to have to buy the house at the end of Banyan. Councilwoman Rhodes felt Mr. Stull had a good point. Councilwoman Rogers stated and there is no house on it so they wouldn’t have to demolition anything. Councilwoman Rhodes stated that is something they might want to investigate. Councilwoman Rogers stated especially since they are thinking about City Hall with the Library on top. She felt he had a point. Ferd Heeb , 115 N. Riverside Drive, asked City Attorney Ansay from a fiduciary point of view, can the City pay 25% more than the appraised value for property. City Attorney Ansay informed him yes. From a legal standpoint you can because it is under $500,000. There are requirements once you get over $500,000 for paying more than appraisal, it requires a heightened vote, four out of five voting in favor of it. Jean Haughwout , Chairwoman, Edgewater Library Board, stated when they were talking about all of these properties, Mr. Stull’s property was one of the properties where information was given to the Council. It was in the packet with the two houses. With no money, it was difficult to work on that particular property. They asked to do the first house because they knew that funds were limited. This property is on high elevation and a lot of fill dirt could be sold after the house is raised. They feel it is an excellent site and for them to look for another site is ridiculous. They have prime property there. Why would you want to sell prime property? The City owns the building, not the County. The County staffs the property. They really don’t want the County involved in this. Councilwoman Lichter stated in the beginning the library was built by funds raised by citizens and the property is City property. Ms. Haughwout confirmed that was correct. Councilwoman Lichter asked Ms. Haughwout if she had mentioned something along the lines about fundraisers and raising money. She is thinking about the difference with what they should pay and what would be possible to be raised. Page 48 of 62 Council Regular Meeting March 5, 2007 Ms. McCormack stated where the grants come in is when you are actually doing the construction project. The State of Florida does matching grants for the construction of libraries. Fundraising is where the Friends of the Library have committed to doing a building project fundraiser to raise the local money rather than asking for it. That is what they did the last time. They raised all of what was needed locally so they could get the matching grants from the State. This is really the same thing as last time. The City purchased the property and the local support organization, the Friends, raised the construction money for the matching grant and the State gave them the rest. Councilwoman Lichter stated if the land is owned by the City and the building was built by local people, what is the County’s function with staff and service. Ms. McCormack informed her the County provides all of the staffing. They maintain the building. They maintain the grounds. They provide all the materials, the collection equipment. They pay all of their bills as far as utilities. Councilwoman Lichter asked Ms. McCormack if she thought they would do that with a larger building. Ms. McCormack informed her absolutely. Ms. McCormack stated to her knowledge they have never declined when a community has spoken by raising that local money, they have never declined to expand their obligation. Councilwoman Lichter asked about making them an offer. City Manager Williams informed her the direction he got from Council was to go back and offer them the appraised value. They said no and countered back at $189,000. If it is Council’s intention to make them an offer, he asked them to inform him what they would like him to offer them and he would do that. Councilwoman Rhodes commented on having to do this in a public meeting and being bound by the Sunshine Law. Councilwoman Lichter asked City Attorney Ansay if they are. She questioned negotiation of a business deal having to be done in public. Mayor Thomas stated he gave his word to Mr. and Mrs. Tomazin that they would have a decision tonight. Councilwoman Rhodes informed Mayor Thomas maybe he shouldn’t have said something. Councilwoman Rogers stated the only decision could have been their price. City Page 49 of 62 Council Regular Meeting March 5, 2007 Manager Williams stated he could obtain a consensus by phone after speaking with each Councilmember individually. Mayor Thomas stated he had no problem with making an offer between $158,000 and $189,000, which would be a decision that would be up to them. That would be all right with him. Councilwoman Rhodes suggested investigating Mr. Stull’s property. She feels a little competition doesn’t hurt. She suggested investigating Mr. Stull’s property and then make a decision on this. That might be the better deal, even though it is more money. Mayor Thomas feels if there is more property and they don’t have to do any demolition, sure it is. Councilwoman Rhodes stated but once that property is appraised, that may be way over priced as well. Mayor Thomas stated from what he understood, he gave him a price. Councilwoman Rhodes stated they would still have to have it appraised to make sure that property is in line. Maybe that will turn out to be the better option. Mayor Thomas felt they weren’t taking into realization the adjacency of the property. He spoke about when he purchased two lots next to his property when he paid almost double for the two lots. City Manager Williams asked if it was Council’s intention to buy the surrounding properties. Obviously they are prime properties and if you bundle it together it makes this whole effort much more appealing. He thought one of the things they identified when they originally purchased this that if it wasn’t Council’s intention to secure the other parcels around it, this property really would not benefit them that greatly. They also talked about expanding that facility to include City Hall. They sent that out and had the engineers take a look at it and the conclusion was they could probably do it but from a cost basis, you would be better off tearing everything down and starting over and going up. They have the 35-foot height issue that they would have to deal with as well. Mayor Thomas stated they needed to make a decision and entertained a motion. Page 50 of 62 Council Regular Meeting March 5, 2007 Fred Pelletier , 1801 Kumquat Drive, stated once you commit yourself, when you know you need three lots to do what you really want to do, it doesn’t make sense to start with one lot at a lower price and because of supply and demand have to pay more for additional property to complete the project. If you don’t have the money for the one hundred and something thousand, where are they going to get the money for the $300,000 and $400,000? Councilman Vincenzi felt the right thing to do would be to put it off one more time and investigate the other options, such as Mr. Stull’s property. Mayor Thomas stated they needed to either turn it down or approve it because he gave Mr. and Mrs. Tomazin his word. Councilwoman Rogers stated then it would have to be turned down because they aren’t willing to pay $189,000. Councilwoman Rhodes stated she absolutely supported this. This is a buyer’s market. She thinks they can get this house for less. If they can’t they need to look in another direction. This goes against everything inside of her. She will support an expansion of the library but she isn’t going to do it at the expense of the taxpayers. She felt City Manager Williams needed to tell them no unless they are willing to come down on the price. If this doesn’t work out, something else will. Mr. Stull stated his lot is 20% larger than both of those lots put together. Eighty percent of the $475,000 comes to $372,000, which would be a discount per square foot. Councilwoman Lichter felt they were going to have to say no. Mayor Thomas entertained a motion. Councilwoman Rhodes made a motion to say no to this property unless the property owner is willing to accept the appraised price and that City Manager Williams should investigate Mr. Stull’s property, second by Councilwoman Rogers . Mayor Thomas confirmed Councilwoman Rhodes motion to be that they want to turn down and investigate Mr. Stull’s property. Councilwoman Rhodes stated unless the Tomazin’s are willing to come down to the appraised price they should say no to them and investigate Mr. Stull’s property. Page 51 of 62 Council Regular Meeting March 5, 2007 The MOTION CARRIED 5-0 . Councilwoman Lichter would like to look at the total deal. She feels they need to know what they are talking about in the end result. Ms. Haughwout asked what they are going to do about the third property. They have one property they said no to and now they are going to wait for him but what about the third property. Mayor Thomas asked if they have talked to the other property owner on Banyan Tree. City Manager Williams stated he has not had any conversation with that property owner. Ms. Haughwout stated she has had conversation with him but there was no money so they didn’t go any further. City Manager Williams stated maybe they could address it with the Professional Services, Item 9B. B.Professional Services – staff recommending approval of an Engagement Letter with Beth Rawlins, Inc. to provide professional campaign and communication services at an amount not to exceed $15,000 City Manager Williams made a staff presentation. Councilman Vincenzi confirmed this would be an engagement with this person where she would design some kind of information gathering campaign that would tell them whether it is feasible to move ahead with any type of ballot initiative that would discuss the items that were mentioned. City Manager Williams stated right, regarding whether or not it is time to ask the electorate. Councilman Vincenzi stated she would not be soliciting support for it. She would just be finding out public attitude about these things. City Manager Williams stated that would be stage one. Stage two is if it is time, then they can draft an educational campaign to help educate our electorate on the benefits of the proposed initiatives the City may take at that point. She has most recently helped the cities against consolidated government defeat the Volusia County Charter Amendments as well as helping Port Orange with their public safety facilities and a number of other governmental entities throughout the State. Councilman Vincenzi asked if they would have input as to the process and tools she develops before any surveys are Page 52 of 62 Council Regular Meeting March 5, 2007 implemented. City Manager Williams stated if they so request. Councilman Vincenzi stated he would like to. Not necessarily tell her what to do but to see what she is going to do before she does it. City Manager Williams stated they could present that information. They are targeting a source of funds for approving this expenditure as the excess funds from RCC that were returned to the City to the tune of $80,582. Mayor Thomas stated thanks to him and City Manager Williams. City Manager Williams suggested and Mayor Thomas begged them. Mayor Thomas entertained a motion. Councilwoman Rogers stated this is not a budgeted item. He just indicated a source of where this could be paid from. Any extra money this City receives should go towards a City Hall reserve. Something such as this, professional services, she believes if they have these questions they could ask the attorney and at the same time they don’t have extra money coming down the pike. As a matter of fact they are going to have a shortage of revenue. The City wants this but this is one of those insatiable desires. They can’t afford it right now and they should not do it. What happens if the people come back and say the City can buy the property for $158,000? They just basically said if they do come back, they would buy it. Then they are going to need to find money to buy it. She again stated no, they don’t have the money. Any extra source of money needs to be allocated to City Hall. Councilwoman Lichter asked about capital expenses as large as a City Hall or a Police Administration Building or a Fire Station. Do they go to the public like they did in previous years or does the Council make that decision? City Manager Williams informed her they make the decision to put it on the ballot and ask the public to approve or disapprove it. Recognizing our needs and the cost and all the other initiatives that are coming from the State level, their only option barring a miracle at this point is to ask the voters to approve something if they intend on achieving a City Hall within a somewhat reasonable period of time. If the location is not here and they are going to have to go out and secure property, they are looking at a $2 million purchase at a minimum, just for the purchase. They are talking about a $400 per square foot number to Page 53 of 62 Council Regular Meeting March 5, 2007 construct a commercial facility. They are probably looking at about a $10 million project realistically to build a new City Hall. Keeping that in mind, if they could somehow miraculously come up with a million in the budget to reserve, they are ten years out plus the cost of inflation they would have to factor in. Councilwoman Lichter referred to when the YCMA was put on the ballot and the citizens being asked to list their priorities of what they wanted and this came out as one of the priorities. Councilwoman Rogers stated they have to start somewhere. They don’t need to ask the citizens if they need to reserve some money. They only ask the citizens when they are looking to purchase or build something. They don’t want things to fall through their hands but that doesn’t mean they are going to be blind, dumb and stupid and pay more than what something is appraised for. Ms. Stoughton asked if they could have public participation when the Council was done. Mayor Thomas informed her no. Councilwoman Rhodes stated one of their primary objectives in their strategic planning was a City Hall as well as transportation and infrastructure. The whole point of the vision was to put your resources to make that vision happen. The things that don’t make that vision happen are resources they don’t spend. She felt to spend $15,000 to talk to taxpayers into voting for a City Hall or whatever maybe not the best thing but anything they have done up until now has not worked. Maybe this is the first step in achieving one of their objectives. She feels it is worth a try. Councilwoman Lichter felt they don’t even write properly so the voters understand something they want to put on the ballot in terms of the 35-foot height limit. What the City put on as an amendment wasn’t very clear. She asked if this person helps write that type of thing. City Manager Williams explained this person helps draft the language and has drafted a number of very successful ballot questions addressing a number of situations very similar to these. Council will have an opportunity to review that work and go forward. Mayor Thomas entertained a motion. Page 54 of 62 Council Regular Meeting March 5, 2007 Ms. Stoughton stated there is no public. Mayor Thomas informed her no. Ms. Stoughton asked why. Councilwoman Rogers stated it is Other Business. Mayor Thomas informed Ms. Stoughton it was up to him. Mr. Capria stated they had it under the library. Mayor Thomas informed Mr. Capria it is up to him. Mayor Thomas entertained a motion. Councilwoman Rogers moved not to approve the Professional Services under Other Business . Motion died due to there being a lack of a second . Councilwoman Rhodes moved that they accept the Engagement Letter with Beth Rawlins in hopes that maybe they can get something jump started, second by Councilman Vincenzi . The MOTION CARRIED 4-1. Councilwoman Rogers voted NO . C.Professional Services – authorize emergency expenditure of funds for remediation of air quality concerns within City Hall, Council Chambers and Planning Department City Manager Williams made a staff presentation. He commented on the recommendations for remediation in the amount of $44,387.50. Councilwoman Lichter asked if there are grants for this type of thing. City Manager Williams informed her there isn’t a whole lot in the way of grants. Councilwoman Rogers asked about insurance. City Manager Williams informed her they are researching that but some policies do not cover damage of this nature. He commented on some of the problems they are currently correcting. Mayor Thomas entertained a motion. Councilwoman Rhodes moved to approve the emergency expenditure of funds for remediation of air quality concerns within City Hall, Council Chambers and Planning Department at a total cost of $44,387.50, second by Councilman Vincenzi . The MOTION CARRIED 5-0 . Page 55 of 62 Council Regular Meeting March 5, 2007 D.Council Term Limits – Councilman Vincenzi’s request to discuss having a court issue a declaratory opinion on Section 3.04 of the Code of Ordinances as it relates to term limits Mayor Thomas mentioned Ferd Heeb, who served on the Charter Review Committee, informing him he would be able to enlighten the Council. Ferd Heeb , 115 N. Riverside Drive, commented on when a previous Council drafted the referendum, which amended the Charter to provide for term limits and staggered terms. The Charter Review Committee’s position was that they did not trust any citizen of the City of Edgewater to sit on this Council for more than two years at a time. They recommended they leave everything the way it was with two- year terms and no term limits, with one dissenting vote from the Charter Review Committee. The only way they could make staggered terms was to go to four-year terms. The referendum was for November 1999 and was to take effect for the election in 2001. He spoke of the Charter being amended in November 1999 and the Council, other than Councilwoman Lichter, being voted out. He felt that some of the Council at that time thought they had a life appointment. Councilwoman Lichter served the first two- year term, then a four-year term and as far as that Council was concerned, she got another four-year term. That was their intention when they drafted that referendum. In his opinion, she gets another four-year term. If Councilman Vincenzi had not dropped off and ran for County Council he would be sitting in the same boat and he guaranteed Councilman Vincenzi would be looking for another four years. Councilman Vincenzi informed him he would not. He wants to do what is right. If a judge says that Charter is the way he interprets it, which means two complete terms is for whoever was up there. The two four-year terms or a two-year term and four-year term. Then that is it. If a judge says the other opinion is right, he is happy with that. He feels it is open to discussion and he feels it needs to be interpreted by someone other than Mr. Heeb or himself. Mr. Heeb stated he was there and he discussed the issue with that Council because they didn’t want term limits. He assured Councilman Vincenzi it was not the Council’s intention at that time to limit the first group to six years. Councilman Vincenzi informed Mr. Heeb he believed him when he says that is what he thinks they Page 56 of 62 Council Regular Meeting March 5, 2007 intended. He requested the minutes/recordings from the Charter Review Committee and Council meetings during that time and he didn’t hear or read that. He interprets the Charter differently. Councilwoman Rhodes commented on Foley & Lardner issuing an opinion on this already and they thought that Councilwoman Lichter could run. She asked City Attorney Ansay her opinion. City Attorney Ansay stated she has read the Charter language and also the memo from the previous City Attorney, having not benefited from any minutes or recordings, her reading of the Charter is she thinks there is somewhat of an ambiguity but if she was to render an opinion she thought she would agree with Foley & Lardner. Councilwoman Rhodes stated they have had two attorneys give the same legal opinion. It only applies this one time in this one election. They are going to spend $5,000 to get a judge to give them an opinion when they have two lawyers that gave an opinion. She feels with it being just this one time that it would be a waste of taxpayers money. She also sees a way out of it. If Councilwoman Lichter were to resign two months before the next election she would sit out two months and she could still run, assuming she wanted to. She spoke of if Councilwoman Lichter wanted to run again, they would be paying $5,000 and not getting any different results. Councilman Vincenzi stated a lot of things could happen. He feels this is the only way to interpret the Charter properly. Councilwoman Rhodes didn’t see a point in spending thousands of dollars for this one time. Councilman Vincenzi stated the first attorney also quantified his opinion at the end saying a judge may interpret this differently and that would be the final decision. Mr. Heeb stated they have a perfect judge to sell this for them, the citizens of Edgewater. They are determining whether Councilwoman Lichter can run again. The citizens will determine whether she will stay in office. Councilwoman Lichter commented on many League meetings they attended and there being very few cities having two years Page 57 of 62 Council Regular Meeting March 5, 2007 because the constant turnover didn’t make for consistency. The give back was to stagger and have term limits but the three or four years was really desired by that Council. Mr. Heeb stated that was the Council’s point of view. The citizens’ point of view on the Charter Review Committee was two years. You either do the job or you are out. Mr. Heeb stated why waste the money. If she runs and the citizens decide they want to keep her, it is a done deal. If they decide she has been here too long, they will let her go and they don’t have to spend the money. Councilwoman Rhodes stated or maybe she won’t run at all. Mayor Thomas asked Councilman Vincenzi if he still wanted to pursue this. Councilman Vincenzi informed him yes. Someone in the audience asked if they were allowed to ask questions. Mayor Thomas informed her no and entertained a motion. Councilman Vincenzi made a motion that the issue of term limits as outlined in the City Charter be sent to a court to issue a declaratory opinion, second by Councilwoman Rogers . The MOTION CARRIED 3-2. Councilwoman Lichter and Councilwoman Rhodes voted NO . Dominic Capria During the roll call, , 606 Topside Circle, asked for a point of order. Mayor Thomas informed him he was interrupting the meeting and told him to sit down. Dominic Capria , 606 Topside Circle, stated it is his opinion that Councilwoman Lichter is not entitled to vote on this issue because it involves District 4. City Clerk Wadsworth asked City Attorney Ansay if she knew how long the time frame is for this to go to court and if it would interfere with her qualifying. City Attorney Ansay informed her they could do it as quickly as they can and get it moved along as quickly as they can. She felt judges are pretty good about ruling on things they know are precursors to an upcoming election. 10. OFFICER REPORTS Page 58 of 62 Council Regular Meeting March 5, 2007 A. City Clerk Wadsworth had nothing at this time. B. City Attorney Ansay had nothing at this time. C. City Manager Williams City Manager Williams commented on the creation of a Citizens Task Force. He wanted to know if Council was interested in creating a Citizens Task Force to look at and assist the City with addressing the potential impacts of this property tax reform with the intention of developing that into a budgetary committee that works with them going through the process. He felt it would be very beneficial to the City. Councilman Vincenzi wasn’t opposed to it. He would like to see not just the same faces and would like other opinions. City Manager Williams explained his intention is to try and get a very diverse group of individuals. City Manager Williams commented on the press release he provided to Council which outlines the establishment of call boxes at Fire Station 55, Fire Station 57 and the substation that is going to be open at the Whistle Stop Ballpark. City Manager Williams then commented on the memo he provided to Council from the Fire Chief referencing the questions that were brought up by Jeff Marris regarding the SAFER Grant. He asked Council to provide him with some feedback. City Manager Williams then stated during the Town Hall Meeting he made a comment that for a number of years the ad valorem tax collections did not cover the police and fire expenditures. He commented on the spreadsheet he provided to Council, which covers 1999-2006. City Manager Williams commented on the report for the Strategic Planning Process from the University of Central Florida. He spoke of adopting an official vision statement if Council desires for the City. He commented on the goals identified by the Council at the Strategic Planning Process. They have sent that out to staff and each director will develop goal statements for the goals that Page 59 of 62 Council Regular Meeting March 5, 2007 have been identified for the Council. They are doing this from a team perspective. They will bring this back to Council for official adoption in the form of a resolution. 1) Tentative Agenda Items There were no Tentative Agenda Items to be discussed at this time. 11. CITIZEN COMMENTS The following citizen spoke: Trish Whitaker , 3124 Pine Tree Drive, asked how they are basing the term limits. Were they considering the two-year terms half terms because even by that standard Councilwoman Lichter is over. Councilman Vincenzi stated he thought it started in 2001. Ms. Whitaker stated she has read the Charter thirty times and she keeps coming up with the same thing. Carol Ann Stoughton, 2740 Evergreen Drive, stated she learned at one of the meetings that Councilwoman Rogers held that there is a porno shop trying to come into Edgewater. She wants to seriously consider starting something that would make these people go away before they even apply. It does not bring upon a lawsuit if you try to get the churches involved to try to stop this before it gets out of hand. Councilwoman Rogers stated what was brought to her attention was a possible adult store to be brought to the City. She requested that the City Manager pull the ordinance and they will be bringing this up. They have to do this in such a way that it doesn’t come across as an emergency ordinance. They have to do it as routine so the City can be protected so if they do make a change, the individual or business cannot come in and say they did it based upon such. City Manager Williams stated that particular application has been denied due to his proximity to a school. There isn’t an issue with that particular establishment right now. Page 60 of 62 Council Regular Meeting March 5, 2007 Councilwoman Rogers has already started the process inside quietly to get this looked at. Ms. Stoughton informed Councilwoman Rogers she knew she would do that because what she says she will do she does. Councilwoman Rogers commented on the item having to be pulled and looked at by the City Attorney. City Attorney Ansay stated the issue was brought to her attention today. This is something she had a lot of experience with in other cities particularly in New Smyrna each. She spoke of the City’s adult entertainment ordinance being willfully inadequate. This is a really complex area of law that is governed by Supreme Court cases and the First Amendment and they can’t just say they aren’t allowed. If this is something the City is wanting to rectify and bring the ordinance up to speed, given that direction tonight, she will jump on it. It is going to have to be passed through the normal course of proceedings and is going to require them getting evidence in the record. She feels they need to get on it to deal with issues that may be coming down the line. Councilwoman Rhodes thought years ago they passed ordinances. They do have free speech issues so they have to allow them in their town. She thought they passed ordinances where they would only allowed to be where they really wouldn’t want to be in town. City Attorney Ansay commented on there being two separate issues. She spoke of there being a whole level of processes they can put on them to better regulate them that most cities do that Edgewater currently doesn’t have in the Code. City Manager Williams compared New Smyrna’s ordinance to Edgewater’s ordinance. City Manager Williams asked each Councilmember to see him individually before they left so he could discuss an issue with them. 12. ADJOURNMENT Page 61 of 62 Council Regular Meeting March 5, 2007 There being no further business to discuss, Councilwoman Rhodes moved to adjourn. The meeting adjourned at 11:45 p.m. Minutes submitted by: Lisa Bloomer Page 62 of 62 Council Regular Meeting March 5, 2007